Two times per day isn't enough.

Take a book and a box of animal crackers, a bag of Fritos, and spend at LEAST an extra hour just sitting, reading, with the snacks close by.

Every day for a couple of weeks.

Really work on not looking like a predator. Don't move your arms high and fast. Don't try for eye contact.

 

I'm sorry. that has to be really frustrating. I have one goat that was very wary and untrusting of me when I got her. she tamed down quite well I thought. until I had to worm her and felt the need to drench her with cmpk after she kidded. she pouted and refused to get near me for a few days after. her name is coincidentally DQ for drama queen) she wouldn't even eat her dinner, just stand 20 feet away watching everyone else eat. she is slowly coming back around. I think when they have kids it is especially difficult. I tamed her not with the nice and easy advice that most people give here. I put a collar and leash on her and forced her to accept me touching her until she actually started to like it. many cat rescue organizations tame feral cats this way too. hold them and pet them for days and days until they start purring and liking it. it is techincally called habituation. you just touch them so much that they eventyaully get used to it.the fight or flight hormones can't last forever. but in times of stress they will likelly revert some. I am sure you know but, avoid ever chasing them. being chased is almost worse than being caught to a prey animal. I have seen some leave a length of rope attached to a collar to facilitate capture from a distance but this has its dangers. I had to do it with my wild one. (they seem to have trouble figuring out that you can catch them from 10 feet away) good luck with whatever you do.

 

i would have no room for wild goats. too many good one to choose from
is there something special about the wild goats that you still need to hang on to them? i doubt you will get the kids tame if they are raised from the wild dams.

 

I know EXACTLY how frustrating this is for someone who really wants to be able to have a close relationship with their goats. Having Boers many of which were not handled much prior to my getting them I've learned it can be a VERY excrutiating game of getting them to warm up. lol.

I have finally gotten to where I'm almost where I want to be with them. Last year I got 4 weanlings at about 4 months old, boy were they untouchable. It took MONTHS literally. At first it seemed that NOTHING was going to work. I tried it all, but they were in a paddock where I couldn't 'make' them be close. That really isn't the issue though. You think that where they are now you can at least get close because they're cornered, but that's kind of how they feel about it too. LOL. You're forcing them to accept contact, they don't really want it.

Finally after a long 9 months two of the 4 I got early last year came around... 4 months later, the other two are just starting. Let me tell you the only thing that ended up working, and I tried all the sitting out there for hours with treats etc... treats do work, but what ultimately ended up helping was that the two I said were finally all friendly (and we're talking so friendly I can't get rid of them now, lol) anyway, those two I had brought over to the big barn becasue I thought they might be pregnant and wanted them where I could get to them easier. In the big barn is where my dairy girls are... VERY friendly. Well, I take treats in every so often to the dairy girls, and the 2 'untouchable' girls at first wouldn't partake in the little frenzy that goes on, but they watched... after several days, they tentatively came over to grab a bite... I dind't make over them, I just kept feeding the dairy girls, and petting and loving on them, while whenever one of the two outsiders came I gave them a treat and otherwise basically ignored them... finally after a few days of that, they got so insistant that I wasn't paying any attention to them they got annoying about it, lol.

Now, the other two, I just brought them up to the small barn where two other already friendly girls are because I think they may be due in May. Started the same thing. Finally after a few days they are at the point now where they'll come for treats and want them, and I'm starting to brush my hand on them as they are there. I suspect in a few more days I won't be able to get rid of them either.

The reason I say that the 'captured' method isn't all that helpful is I got a new adult Boer doe about 3 weeks ago. Just a lovely girl, but hadn't been handled much beyond the necessary and didn't like it. In her isolation stall she had begun to take treats from me--as long as I was outside the stall over the gate, lol. In the stall I could 'make' her let me pet her, but she wasn't happy about it. When I turned her in with my buck just the other day, she's pretty much back to her wild and crazy self.

It's okay. In a few months I'll move her over to one of the barns to keep a baby watch on her, and let her learn just as the others did, and I'm sure she'll be fine.

If you have a goat that's already friendly and craves attention, my advice would be to combine them and do the above. If you don't... could you find one? Usually the dairy girls are very attention craving.

 

Two times per day isn't enough.

Take a book and a box of animal crackers, a bag of Fritos, and spend at LEAST an extra hour just sitting, reading, with the snacks close by.

Every day for a couple of weeks.

Really work on not looking like a predator. Don't move your arms high and fast. Don't try for eye contact.

Rose,I have done that, every day for 5 months. well I used grapes and raisins. I go to the barn twice a day I dont just feed them and leave I have a short bucket I sit on in the stall with them and I spend time out there everyday at both feedings. I have tried putting the treats down so they know what they are when I offer them. THey gobble them up as long as Im not holding them. I have tried not putting them down after they know what the treat is so they will know they have to come to me and get them, I look the other way or hold my head down a bit.

 

We have an alpine that was abused/neglected for a couple years. My neighbor tried the nice way to tame her, but I had to force her to like petting in the end. I think the turning point was when she was put in a pen by herself... goats are herd animals and they want to have company... after a few weeks she comes up to me and talks to me... at least now that her 3 month old kid is gone. I think each goat is different and I think that everyone who has posted has a way that works for them, and try each... it may take one way or it may take several blended together... I do wish you luck.....I feel your frustration.

 

If you have a goat that's already friendly and craves attention, my advice would be to combine them and do the above. If you don't... could you find one? Usually the dairy girls are very attention craving.

I have the 4 bottle babies Im raising but they are still very young and not ready to be put out with the others yet. I have a friendly pygmy buck but hes my colts pet and stays with him My other friendly one is in a pen waiting to give birth.

 

First off, let me say I TOTALLY understand your frustration.

At this point you MIGHT want to try going with the "enforced habituation".

I had a wild Nervous Nellie. She came from another farm, completely unhandled. She had a kid. (Big surprise! Previous owners "didn't think" she was bred, but she was running with a buck!)

Anyway, she kidded with a single, and I noticed the kid was nursing off only one side. I knew the other side HAD to be milked out or we'd have problems.

It was a complete rodeo the first few times. I had to catch & collar her in a catch pen, usually while she had her head in a bucket of grain, then wrestle her over to the milkstand. We were BOTH worn out!

But Nellie came to realize that eating a bowl of grain up on the milkstand wasn't going to kill her. I kept her there after milking, stroking her, scratching her withers, talking nicely to her, etc (forced her to become accustomed to it). By the end of three weeks, she was banging down the stable door to get to the milkstand! I could even approach her (slowly) in the pasture and get in a skritch or two.

As all your other efforts have met with failure, you might want to try a version of this. Have you got a milkstand with a headlock to restrain her (them)?

I wish you luck. I think your persistence will eventually be rewarded. Please let us know how it goes.

NeHi

 

My boer cross wether is a bit wild. I didn't really try to tame him down other than to lay my hand on him when he was feeding. He would always run away.

This winter I decided to trim his overgrown hooves so I put a collar on him and held him against the wall. Now I've started to hook his collar to the wall and hold him against it. He fights at first but then gives up and stands still. Now he almost acts like he likes to be rubbed. He's even walked up to me for rubbing. I don't think that would have happened if I had kept trying the nice approach.

 

I agree that twice a day isn't enough. I had a doe (Boer) that was pretty wild when I got her. I couldn't catch her, touch her, or do anything with her unless I practically hog tied her. The turning point for us was when she kid. I was with her when she kid, I helped her with #3 because he was stuck. (she had triplets as a first freshener). From that point on, I could touch her - we bonded. Now when she is pregnant, she wants me with her. I had sold her a year or so ago to a friend, I recently got her back. (bred). She never forgot our special time, and wanted me with her when she kid.

Animals are more sensitive and intuitive than a lot of people give them credit for. They are going to sense your frustration. Animals pick up on that, and then think that something is wrong. I don't generally advise people to use treats as a way to gentle an animal down because an animal should come to you and become submissive without expecting to be given treats.

My suggestion is to spend as much time as you can with the animals. If you are the sole person that feeds them, they will learn to accept you. 5 months is really not that long of a timeframe for animals to adjust. Do you know what their background is? If they came from a situation where they free ranged, or weren't handled regularly, of course they are going to have an issue with somebody now asking them to do something.

I wouldn't give up on the goats just yet. I would work with the babies, as they will be easier to win over. Pick them up, hold them, even if they squirm or fuss. Hold them and talk softly to them until you feel them relax.

One thing that we use here with the horses (behavior modification) is never leave the stall or barn on a negative note. Always try to leave with something positive, like a pat on the head, or a good girl, some sort of praise. You can use treats to reinforce a positive, but try not to use the treats as a way of bribing the goat to come to you. For instance, if you smooch at the goat to come to you and it comes to you - then reward with praise and a treat. Don't hold out a treat and say come here goat - because then the goat is only coming because you have a treat. You want the goat to be willing to come to you - because you aren't always going to have treats in your pocket.

I know how frustrating it is. I have had a few kids here and there that was a bit standoffish. It bugged me because I spend A LOT of time with my goats. I imprint them at birth, and they never have reason to be scared or timid. Some goats are more sensitive than others.

If you have kids that are bottle fed and you're afraid that their mannerisms will change if they are put in with the standoffish kids - I don't think that would be a problem. Bottle kids will always be bonded to you. I have a big 3 year old buck that has been free ranging at another farm for a year, and I can assure you that they don't forget who their mommy is. My buck will still come to me and want to sit in my lap and suck my fingers.

Hang in there! Worse case scenario if they don't bond with you - sell them and get some bottle kids that will bond to you. It sounds like you're really hurt that they aren't warming up to you. It sometimes takes a lot of patience and perseverence.

 

I've not had any wild ones. Some fraidy cats but not wild. I think the bottle goats will help out though if you mix them. Short of that I'd be feeding them grain on the milk stand and giving them a big long belly hug for as long as I could. If you scratch right between their shoulders on some goats its a "magic" spot....like the dog twitching its leg....
I do have a mean one that is aggressive to people but my herd queen kicks her butt when she tries her routine...she's not staying if having kids doesnt calm her down....

 

We got a few wild does last summer. After quarentein (sp?) we put them with out friendly herd. They have not become tame, but are definetly less wild. When these three wild does kidded, they were each in a kidding pen for two weeks with their babies. We grained them am and pm and picked up the babies every few days. Easy to catch in teh small pens. Now they are all back out with the herd again, and are friendlier than before. We did not spend hours with them.
I have noticed that dam raised kids will become friendlier when mama weans then. They also usually have more respect for your space than the mob of bottle babies. I used to worry about the dam raised babies being wild, but it has not been a problem. As long as you do spend time close to them regularly.
It helps to be close to the ground, the babies want to check out the new thing in their area and see if it is good for climbing and tasting.
I would catch everyone and put them all back into a small area and just let the babies get used to you being there. Offer them cookies or whatever in your hand, but let them get it, don't scare them away. They should be climbing on you in a few days, even if they are flighty, as ling as you are quiet and don't move fast. If you do move fast, then catch them without chasing them and just hold them for a bit.
Having them used to your presence when they are small, even if they are not friendly at that time, will help them to become freindly when mama gets tired of them punching her bag in a few months. The wethers are the most friendly by 9 months, regardless of bottle or dam raised.
Our two most friendly mamas are dam raising their kids, born 2/14. These kids are the most wild little things, have to sneak up and catch a back leg. Which we do, then just hold them and love them for a bit. They settle down in a minute and each time you let them go, they do not run away as quick. I am not at all worried about them being less than loving by this fall.
So, have hope and keep at it. You may never really tame the mamas, but the babies should be fine.

 

I guess Im just really frustrated at this point. And I really am not understanding how a couple hours a day over the course of 5 months is not enough time to spend with them.

I guess at this point now that the barn is almost empty we could put one mom and her babies in a stall at a time and work with them that way instead of the whole herd at once but would they just revert back when added back to the herd? I dont think the babies would but I get the feeling the moms would. Plus I hate the idea of locking them back up when they could be free to move about outside.

Maybe my best bet would be the babies once they are weaned if they are not too wild by that time.

I am glad to know the bottle babies will stay tame

 

We got a few wild does last summer. After quarantine (sp?) we put them with out friendly herd. They have not become tame, but are definitely less wild. When these three wild does kidded, they were each in a kidding pen for two weeks with their babies. We grained them am and pm and picked up the babies every few days. Easy to catch in the small pens. Now they are all back out with the herd again, and are friendlier than before. We did not spend hours with them.
I have noticed that dam raised kids will become friendlier when mama weans then. They also usually have more respect for your space than the mob of bottle babies. I used to worry about the dam raised babies being wild, but it has not been a problem. As long as you do spend time close to them regularly.
It helps to be close to the ground, the babies want to check out the new thing in their area and see if it is good for climbing and tasting.
I would catch everyone and put them all back into a small area and just let the babies get used to you being there. Offer them cookies or whatever in your hand, but let them get it, don't scare them away. They should be climbing on you in a few days, even if they are flighty, as ling as you are quiet and don't move fast. If you do move fast, then catch them without chasing them and just hold them for a bit.
Having them used to your presence when they are small, even if they are not friendly at that time, will help them to become friendly when mama gets tired of them punching her bag in a few months. The wethers are the most friendly by 9 months, regardless of bottle or dam raised.
Our two most friendly mamas are dam raising their kids, born 2/14. These kids are the most wild little things, have to sneak up and catch a back leg. Which we do, then just hold them and love them for a bit. They settle down in a minute and each time you let them go, they do not run away as quick. I am not at all worried about them being less than loving by this fall.
So, have hope and keep at it. You may never really tame the mamas, but the babies should be fine.

All good news maybe Im just trying too hard. Im going to try just handling the kids and let the moms have to alone times they seem to want. Hopefully they will be weaned soon and things will turn a bit. In the meantime since Im losing patients with the moms it'll give us all a needed break

 

Glad my rambling helped.
It will help to be away from scardy mamas, and being with the bottle babies should really help. Having the bottle babies EVER leave you alone is a remote posibility! LOL
hehe, catch the wild babies, and put them in the pen with bottle babies while you feen they may wonder what the heck they are missing. If you are offering the bottle babies grain, that will help to feed the wild ones with them.
Just do whatever works and they should at least not be half as wild as mamas.

 

--can't understand how 5 months isn't that long--

Goats can be notoriously stubborn. LOL

 

--can't understand how 5 months isn't that long--

Goats can be notoriously stubborn. LOL

LOL ok point taken. I gotta get my brain wrapped around that

 

I feel for ya. I have had 2 wild ones. The first one took a year! Then she became so friendly out of the blue and allowed me to touch her anywhere. I got frustrated as well and I just decided she was there to eat weeds and have babies and I gave up. Well she saw all the attention everyone else was getting and saw that they got more animal crackers if you eat them out of my hand that she came up to me one day and that was that.
My other wild one had a baby last July. I handled that baby from day one and could care less what her mom thought. Her mom could avoid me and run but her kid ran up to me to jump in my lap and be pet. She was a great little girl till this mom broke down my barn door one night letting baby Becca out and the next morning she was gone :Bawling: I truly do not like this goat and am hoping she is pregnant again this year so she can have babies and get out. I was working with her and food was her great motivator. She would allow petting and jump up on you when you have food.
It takes time and sometimes far longer than you want but maybe they will come around. If not sell them and keep their kids. The bottle babies really will help the new kids come around.
jBlaze is right bottle babies do not leave you alone! They are always in my business, try to climb up ladders after me, steal my box of nails and etc. My big Nubian still thinks he can sit in my lap!

 

I would've pulled babies and bottle raised them, then probably sold the mothers unless they were super stock.

I personally don't 'sit' with untame goats, because then they only trust you while you're sitting down. As soon as you stand up, you're evil again and they are off running. I tend to go about my chores daily with treats in my pockets (I use this mostly on dam raised kids) and if one comes up close to me, I pass it a treat or a pet. Once they realize I'm not simply out there to bother them - that I'm feeding them, going about my own business - they come to get used to me and trust me.

I won't have extremely nervous goats on hand, because if they need to be treated/vaccinated/handled, I can't catch or trust them.

My advice is to NEVER EVER EVER chase them, no matter what. That will undo all you've ever done, and enforce to those goats that you are evil, lol. No matter that all you're catching them to do is to pet them - they won't remember the niceness, they'll remember the terror of being chased.

 

I have 2 that I'm currently trying to tame. 1 that WAS tame and decided to pick up on the other's bad habits and not come near for me to pet them. So, I've separated the herd into nice ones vs. naughty.

So they are both in a stall together, and I've been offering a little bite of treats here and there. Just going about my chores, and not noticing them until they "ask" for something. They've been getting to where they let me pet them again, but it sure is taking a LONG TIME! I just love on them and tell them how pretty and good they are... even when they are not so good.

Last time, I got this same problem doe tame by putting her in with the chickens for a little while... that sure did straighten her up quick! But sadly, it didn't last because I put her back in the big pen too soon, where she has more room to get away (I was worried about the chickens and possible diseases too)... so I'm doing it this way for a bit, then I'm going to sell or trade her out. I've been tempted to keep her now that I know her momma can milk a gallon a day at early freshening.. but if she doesn't get tame and STAY tame this time... I will let her go as I do not have the time to take away from the other good ones.

Hope yours do well for you soon!

Cricket

 

Absolutely true about chaseing!!! If you are going to catch them, you must do it without having to chase them. I wail till mine hide under the feeders and I grab a leg. Thanks you for making that point Mygoat.

 

I would've pulled babies and bottle raised them, then probably sold the mothers unless they were super stock.

I personally don't 'sit' with untame goats, because then they only trust you while you're sitting down. As soon as you stand up, you're evil again and they are off running. I tend to go about my chores daily with treats in my pockets (I use this mostly on dam raised kids) and if one comes up close to me, I pass it a treat or a pet. Once they realize I'm not simply out there to bother them - that I'm feeding them, going about my own business - they come to get used to me and trust me.

I won't have extremely nervous goats on hand, because if they need to be treated/vaccinated/handled, I can't catch or trust them.

My advice is to NEVER EVER EVER chase them, no matter what. That will undo all you've ever done, and enforce to those goats that you are evil, lol. No matter that all you're catching them to do is to pet them - they won't remember the niceness, they'll remember the terror of being chased.

I wish I had thought about bottle feeding them but I didnt. I will be glad when I can get them away from their moms though. How long do they have to stay their moms?