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We’ve never done herd immunity? We have had outbreaks every year which end with herd immunity.
When did sick people dying from viruses become a new thing?

The longer we prolong the outbreak, the more total deaths we’ll have, as the vulnerable can’t hide forever. Not to mention collateral deaths not from virus.
As discussed elsewhere, the most ethical strategy is letting the young and healthy gain immunity so they don’t threaten the vulnerable, and it fades away, like it has for millions of years.
Sweden is done, while the U.S. wants to keep killing people.
As these scientists explain, allowing healthy to achieve herd immunity is basic public health practice.

 

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Those statements may hold true in some situations but not all.
Perhaps you can give me some examples of those scenarios where you feel it is humane or ethical to deny the elderly access to the comfort of family, prevent people from earning a living or forcing businesses into bankruptcy?
 

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Discussion Starter #44
Perhaps you can give me some examples of those scenarios where you feel it is humane or ethical to deny the elderly access to the comfort of family, prevent people from earning a living or forcing businesses into bankruptcy?
Too simple.

When the business or living causes damage to more than it helps.
 

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Too simple.

When the business or living causes damage to more than it helps.
I didn't know that you were in favor of euthanasia. In your world, who gets to decide?
 

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Discussion Starter #48
Sure, we should just let stores sell products full of salmonella and let the customers decide for themselves if they should take the chance. LOL
 

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Too simple.
When the business or living causes damage to more than it helps.
The shutdowns are causing more damage than the virus.

Sure, we should just let stores sell products full of salmonella and let the customers decide for themselves if they should take the chance. LOL
Proper handling and cooking solves that problem.
That's covered in grade school health classes.

We don't need the Govt to protect us from every little thing.
 

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Every time a trip is made to the grocery store there is a chance of some type of health problem that might be encountered. As a shopper you have the choice of the type of product you buy that increase or decreases your chances of a problem. For example, buying ground meat is a risky choice compared to buying quartered or large slice meat. Buying a whole chicken versus one that has been processed into smaller cuts. Buying cut up lettuce in a salad product is more risky than buying a head of lettuce and making your own salad. A shopper has the choice of what they want to buy and the risk level they wish to take.

Many instances of this covid issue is the same. Make a choice, and own it. Let others have the ability to do the same.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
Every time a trip is made to the grocery store there is a chance of some type of health problem that might be encountered. As a shopper you have the choice of the type of product you buy that increase or decreases your chances of a problem. For example buying ground meat is a risky choice compared to buying quartered or large a slice meat. Buying a whole chicken versus one that has been processed into smaller cuts. Buying cut up lettuce in a salad product is more risky than buying a head of lettuce and making your own salad. A shopper has the choice of what they want to buy and the risk level they wish to take.

Many instances of this covid issue is the same. Make a choice, and own it. Let others have the ability to do the same.
I see your tipping point but you don't speak for an entire country just as I dont.. The government is elected to speak for the whole and public health is part of that. They are working on understanding what the tipping point of the majority is. Mistakes are made on both sides.
 

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I see your tipping point but you don't speak for an entire country just as I dont.. The government is elected to speak for the whole and public health is part of that. They are working on understanding what the tipping point of the majority is. Mistakes are made on both sides.
You obviously are unfamiliar with our form of government. It is a constitutional republic, not a mob rule country. Though there are states where it is in doubt at the moment. Churches closed, casinos open. Beaches where people are arrested for sitting in the sand, statue demolition by mob is cool beans. It is obvious that mitigation is not the goal in certain areas. Rather it is subjugation of certain classes of people using "public health" as the excuse.

As to your simple point:

Too simple.

When the business or living causes damage to more than it helps.

have you really thought that philosophy out at all?
 

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The government is elected to speak for the whole and public health is part of that.
No, they really aren't.

They are working on understanding what the tipping point of the majority is.
They aren't working on anything.
They are keeping millions of others from working though.

Americans have nearly reached their "tipping point".
 

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We have had and are going to have drunk drivers. Other than your defensive driving skills your best chance of dealing with a accident from a drunk is your cars design and safety systems that protect you. Trying to keep a car space for every 10 mph is not going to do you any good. The drunks air bags are not going to do you any good.

Someone that’s infected and going out and about in public is going to and has happened. Relying on them to protect yourself is just not a smart thing to do. You need to rely on your safety procedures and your safety systems to protect yourself.
There is only so much you can do to protect yourself. Saying that people who contracted covid have only themselves to blame is like saying innocent bystanders killed by drunk drivers have only themselves to blame. You can't do much when a drunk going 90 mph suddenly veers into your lane and hits you head on any more than you can prevent a covid infected person from jumping in front of you and coughing directly in your face.

The majority of the people infected on that first quarantined cruise ship did nothing to put themselves at risk. The majority of patients infected at nursing homes did nothing to put themselves at risk.
 

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Sure, we should just let stores sell products full of salmonella and let the customers decide for themselves if they should take the chance. LOL
Try cooking your food sometime-- It's yummy. Proper food safety measures, good handling/cooking takes care of that problem. I for one dont need a nanny to tell me my uncooked chicken is dangerous if not properly cooked, ECT. Some of these modern day sheep might need their hand held but I do not. Furthermore, our efforts to totally sterilize our food supply creates an intolerance to small amounts of harmful bacteria which until fairly recently were pretty well tolerated in almost all people. 'Fixing' all the diseases and sterilizing all the food is not the answer.
 

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Discussion Starter #58
LOL, ever heard if samonella on salad. That was one example folks. I could give a thousand but it wont matter to you so I won't bother.

In your world, we don't need, food inspectors or laws about no arsenic in your flour.
 

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painterswife said:
Too simple.

When the business or living causes damage to more than it helps.

While I admire your perseverance......

The people working and living life should make the decision for themselves of when it’s to much risk or damage.
See, the people can't be trusted to make the right decision.
WHO, CDC, the Federal government, they can be trusted.
 

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LOL, ever heard if samonella on salad. That was one example folks. I could give a thousand but it wont matter to you so I won't bother.
If they applied to the topic that may be of some benefit.
The mass lockdown fad has passed and even the apathetic can see it wasn't as it was portrayed.
The few who want to cling to the narrative can mop up and flip the lights when they are done.
 
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