The child support issue/for cyngbaeld, any others who are curious (long)

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by WillowWisp, Aug 22, 2004.

  1. WillowWisp

    WillowWisp Well-Known Member

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    HI, I just thought I should clear things up on my opinions and the whole child support issue. My husband and I had my stepdaughter every day during the day all day until she started preschool in January of 2004. We also had her two full nights. After that we still had her in the mornings until she went to preschool, and because my husband works nights we only had about 4 hours of sleep before my stepdaughter got here and it would be about 5:30 am in the morning and she would be wide awake. For about four months, my husband was a complete Zombie, and I got even more exhausted picking up his end and I even watched her for awhile about 2-3 hours a day until the mom came after work and picked her up. Yet, eventually we still have to pay back support, cuz my husband didn't have it garnished until May. His ex wife last October refused to sign the house over that he owned so he could get it refinanced and by the time she signed over the quick claim deed my husband had no more money to pay his other bills. He has been terribly depressed for several months, and I have tried, asked, begged, for him to get amendments to the parenting plan. Because of his lack of motivation, and her not signing the house over, we ended up having to sell the house and got nothing for it. Part of that was his stubborness and also because his ex wife is very controlling, and he will not confront her and did not want to have the courts force her to sign the quick claim deed, so our refinancing fell through. His ex wife is the one that filed for divorce because she was cheating on him. She also makes 3,000 dollars more a year than he does. Call it depression, procrastination, whatever on his part, but he and she got a quick divorce with shared parenting and he did not seek legal help. I definitely believe in parents paying child support. But everyone's circumstance is different. This past winter 2004 my husband injured his shoulder twice and ended up off work. He still took care of our daughter every day and the two full nights until the end of April even after he had surgery "luckily he had PTO and workers comp. Well, after his daughter was out of preschool, he had to take a daytime job at the hospital security dept. until his shoulder healed so he could no longer watch her. By then his checks were being garnished and prior he tried to pay what he could for daycare. Well because of the shift switch he could only watch his daughter a few days a week, and he told her he would every other week. Well, now he is back on his regular shift, and the mother is refusing to have him have his daughter back during the day so daycare would not be necessary. She wants daycare and child support, and doesn't want to ever bring her on alternative nights so we don't have to get woke up unreasonably early and the little one can get extra sleep before she goes to preschool at noon once it starts. If I was able to work, that would be one thing. But, until I find something that will pan out from home, I am stuck. I was even refused by state vocational rehab until I get all my medical things under control. Well, that costs money. In this state with 50/50 parenting neither parent ends up paying support because both have the child half the time. We had her almost half the time for quite awhile and my husband was too blind to see that before when he agreed to what he agreed to. I don't feel he should pay daycare if he can offer it. I feel he should pay child support unless we have her 50/50. I just don't know what to do anymore to get him to go to court and at least get things straight. By the way, there is alot more to this that even this and part of it includes the mother hitting the child in the head as a form of discipline. She is a very mean, verbally abusive woman to us, and whenever we have tried talking to her, she swears every word in the book. My husband is too afraid of her, afraid of talking to her, etc. Truthfully, I am at a loss. But, I am not against fathers or mothers doing their duty to take care of their child. My husband has not abandoned his daughter, but his ex wife wants it her way or no way. God bless
     
  2. Terri

    Terri Singletree & Weight Loss & Permaculture Moderator Staff Member Supporter

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    WillowWhisp, there are some fights you cannot win, and this War of the Exes sounds like one of them.

    Give it up. Don't even TALK to the Bio-Mom. Drop the subject with DH.

    Do you knowwhat one of the most stressfull things in the world, is? It is being held responsible for something that you cannot control. You cannot control anything about what your DH and his Ex do.

    So, in my humble opinion, kiss the child while she is with you, love your DH, and let the past go. If possible, don't even TALK to the Ex, because she is a real trial.

    If she calls, tell her that you will tell DH that she wants to talk to him. If he is home, tell him she is on the line. If he is not home, take a message and say a polite good-bye, and hang up. The end. If he refuses to talk to her, that STILL does not involve you. Don't get caught between them, they can fight without you.

    Yes, I KNOW you have money problems, but find another solution. Fighting with your husbands Ex will make you crazy. Worse, I don't think you can win.

    Notice, please, that I am NOT! addressing the matter of right verses wrong. This ONLY adresses what is likely to work. You cannot force another adult to do anything. And, as the step-mother, you have no legal standing in this matter. Even if you DO provide a lot of loving care. Legally, this is between him and her, only.

    So, put your energies in something that you might be able to succeed at. You have received a great deal of advice, and it is well-thought out advice from people who have ALSO known hard times. Consider their advice carefully. Some of it will not apply, as they do not know many details about your situation. No mtter: some of it WILL supply!
     

  3. RAC

    RAC Guest

    It is very typical for most men not to seek support from their ex-wives, even when entitled by law to do so--I think a lot of it is based in old chauvinistic behavior. The only really famous case I know of was the Joan Lunden divorce, and that is of course because there was real money involved.

    I don't know if your working will help--it could just force you to pay more in support, some states take both spouses' (even the non-related one) income into account.

    I agree, just put the answering machine on, and let the woman swear away, you've got it on tape, and take it to court if you want.

    Good luck.
     
  4. Mudwoman

    Mudwoman Well-Known Member

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    Get a grip on this one!

    He is going to pay until this child is 18----period. Doesn't matter if he is working or not. Doesn't matter if she makes more money or not. Doesn't matter if he has the child more than she does. Doesn't matter if you are left with zero to live on at the end of the month. Doesn't matter if you have to suffer because of the financial and emotional obligations. Accept this and move on.

    Next thing about the day care. Divorced people use a variety of issues to continue the conflict. Just because there is a divorce on paper doesn't mean there is a conflict resolution. Get out of the middle of this. Let him handle it even if he handles it poorly. You are wanting him to handle this situation in a manner that you think would be better, but it isn't your fight and if he handled it your way, he would be different and if he were different, he might still be married to her.

    If you continue this, you will lose!!!!! Doesn't matter if you are right or not. It is a battle that you can not win. You have to decide to either accept things the way they are and make the situation as happy as possible or move on. If you move on, things will not necessarily be better. So, suck it up, get a grip and deal with the cards you have been given.
     
  5. rambler

    rambler Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I didn't see the beginning of this whole deal I guess, but what the others say is all true.

    1. The male will always pay, & pay in full - in cash, for child support. The law & peoples' perceptions on this _no longer_ reflect actual ecconomic realities in this country. But that is not the point - the point is, the male will pay in full in cash until 18 at least. Period. You can disagree with that, but it WILL NOT change, and you are better off to accept it & move on. You will never, ever, get any other satisfaction on this. It will take a monumental shift in peoples' preceptions to change this. Not in your or my lifetime it won't. Yes, you are 100% right - but your spouse will still be paying until 18. That is how it is.

    2. Do not get involved with the ex or the relationship between your spouse & the ex. You'll just get ground up & spit out. They've had years & years to build up their issues & games to play on each other. You will just become a pawn in that. Stay out of it.

    Be nice to the kid, but don't bother trying to motivate your husband or the ex to change on how it is being handled. Just figure out how you can fit in until 18.


    Now, all easy to say.... Sorry you have to live it, and yes hard to accept & deal with. You can't change the ex at all, and you can only nag the spouse - neither of which will endear you in the long run - right? Accept the way things are, understand it's not your issue (directly - yes you have to live with the results of it) and try to move forward - beyond it all.

    Good luck.

    --->Paul
     
  6. WillowWisp

    WillowWisp Well-Known Member

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    I see that things are unfair in the world of divorce. It is a sad shame that good fathers get screwed out of more time with their children even if they do have to pay child support. That is the way the cookie crumbles I guess. I am going to have to do my best regardless of what happens, to just let those two duke it out, even if my hubby wont talk to her. He tried talking to her today, and it did not a bit of good. So, perhaps his not communicating with her is really the only choice anyway.

    Life will go on.
     
  7. Okay, here is my take on things as a stepmother myself. You will never get the acknowledgement from "outsiders" for the effort that you put into the child's life. You will probably be told you are not the child's "real mother" and other hurtful things that you will have to ignore.

    My DH and his ex are not good at communicating with each other. I am so glad that my stepson is 16 and we will only have to deal with her for another 2 years. I intend on hanging up the phone when he turns 18 and never dealing with her again.

    I do have a very good relationship with my stepson. I have to tell you that over the years I have made an effort to try to teach him that he has to get along with her - when he tells me his mother is crazy. I have told him that he has to respect her because she is his mother.

    My advice is be there as a support system for your stepchild, and make decisions with your husband regarding anything that goes on in your house with regards to the child because you are a team and will parent this child together in your house.

    Have as little to do with your DH's ex as possible. Avoid joint gifts and joint parties - what a nightmare! If you are having trouble with her - threats, etc - document, document, document!
     
  8. You know we have a somewhat simalar situation, where my husband is the good guy, but here in america the dads are always treated like the bad guys. He pays support on a child who he found out isn't his. If we ever won the lottery, witch we never play LOL! I would love to have him sue the biological father for child support. I don't see why He has to pay when she never kept her vows and its not his child. But it will take someone who doesn't need the money to tackle a case like that. And here in our state you pay till the kid is out of school or age 25 with ever comes first at least till 18. On the other hand he also pays support on a child who he has only saw once at the paternity test when the kid was 5 yrs old. He is now 19 we had to go to court to find out he was going to college, and his support payments will continue and continue.. Why does he have to pay on both just because he was married to the one woman? Not fair. The biological dad should share in support.!!
     
  9. RAC

    RAC Guest

    If someone has ANY doubts at all, as soon as a child is born, find the money and get a paternity test done. If you wait, and later find out, the courts will rule in favor of the CHILD--after you may be the only man they know as "dad", and how fair is that to the CHILD?

    The other option is not always waiting until 18--most children are allowed to choose which parent to stay with by 12 or 13, and if Dad gets full custody, he probably will not pay any more support (unless to make up back support). Yes, you have to go to court, and it is sometimes tough on the child, but on the other hand, children know what's going on, even when you don't, and they are ready to change parents.

    As to paying only until 18, most spouses are hopefully smart enough now to make certain the support goes through college--especially when you know that if the parents had stayed together, college would have been paid for. The child will NOT be able to get financial aid for college if either Mom or Dad has the means of paying and they are living with either one at home.
     
  10. fin29

    fin29 Well-Known Member

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    Was this an issue before you got married to your husband or did it only start after you were married?
     
  11. WillowWisp

    WillowWisp Well-Known Member

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    Hi there,

    I was dumb to the fact of what exactly was going on that I can say.
    I didn't know about some of this till after we were married but the situation was weird from the get go.

    My hubby is a sweetheart, but lets just say there were some lies involved on his part in the beginning. We are working on our marriage, but it is very young. I came here to be with him stupidly after leaving an abusive situation regarding in my previous home. Sometimes we make foolish mistakes, but this situation is still far better than being abused. I just want to make better choices here on out.

    WillowWisp
     
  12. VAkat

    VAkat Member

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    You have internet service. Start doing something about it. This is an election year for goodness sake. You need to start writing your state senators, congress men/women & the rest of the elected officials telling them that the dingdang antiquated family law system of your state & the rest of the country is changed, you will not vote for them. That as a matter of fact you will continue to vote against them and request that others do the same until they (and others like them) are removed permanently from office. Join the growing Libertarian Party.
    The laws need to be changed folks. Children are not property; they are not a piece of furniture. Studies show that children need BOTH parents equally in their lives. Studies show that children growing up in single parent households have a 70% change of committing suicide, high school drop out, heavy drug use & unwanted pregnancy. This is the future we are raising here! We need to go with a 50/50 PARENTING plan with no one having “custody” and no child support changing hands. Both PARENTS are equally involved in the raising of their children. BOTH PARENTS, not one being a visitor & a wallet. Unless one parent is proven unfit (mandatory jail time for false allegations) or moves away, then there can be a financial support award. The states already KNOW how much it costs to raise a child they pay it out in welfare benefits. Therefore, the award would be based on the amount the amount each states provides in welfare with each parent being financially responsible for 50%. Say the state pays a combination of cash, food stamps & medical costs apporx. 600 a month, half of that, minus any days the move away parent has the child for parenting is what the award will be. No large support awards, its pretty standard for everyone. Guess getting an education & job before you start having children just might be a new novel way of thinking in the future.
    I know this isn’t a popular opinion, but the system isn’t working. It has never worked. If anyone has any alternate ideas, I for one am all ears.
    KAT
     
  13. Hum, in that order too??????? That would be difficult.


    ;)


    Maybe a 70% chance of _being involved_ in one or more of those activities, but not actually succeeding? ;)


    Just poking a little fun. I strongly agree with what you wrote otherwise.

    --->Paul
     
  14. AngieM2

    AngieM2 Big Front Porch advocate Supporter

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    OUt of curiousity, VAkat - are you telling research statistics or do you know, or have you been a single mom raising children.

    And it's not the other parent, it's family, both sexes respresented that makes a difference, and it's stability (not being bounced back and forth).

    The best thing that happened to my children is not being bounced back and forth, and I have the qualifications of being a single mom since 1984 and my girls have none of the above problems, and the ex- which grew up in a two parent home is the one that tied suicide, etc. drug (presecription ) etc.

    Don't be so quick to spout off unless you've been there.

    It's sorta like the saying " those that can do, those that can't teach". No disrespect meant to teachers.

    AngieM2
     
  15. rambler

    rambler Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Try being there for a while. Any teacher can pick out the single parent kids long before parent-teacher meetings.

    This isn't a universal apply it to everyone thing. It's statistics.

    Us human beings, as individuals, can be pretty screwed up.

    Coming from a single parent household increases the chances of that. No one is saying _every_ single parent child is messed up, and no one is saying all dual parent children are perfect. And I have no idea where that 70% number came from. Could be a typo even? But maybe you never hit a wrong key in your life, so it's ok for you to blow up on the person.

    It's just a statistics thing. I know it's terribly non-PC to say that. How dare anyone! and all that.

    But in the end, it's true.

    I think the root of the problem is that the children become pawns between the 2 arguing adults. As you say, in a stable household with access to real adults, single parents certainly do well, and kids have a good chance - as good as anywhere else.

    You gotta read things with a bit of understanding, not just blow up on some PC-speak & ignore the point.

    --->Paul
     
  16. AngieM2

    AngieM2 Big Front Porch advocate Supporter

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    Sorry about the blow up Paul

    Just had a big struggle and to see "all" single parents put down gets me. I react.

    The courts thought the girls should never see their father alone again in their lifetime. They did have uncles, grandfather/mother, aunts and friends. And they are very well balanced - and people have asked me how I did it.

    I've fought to have, keep and raise them "my" way. So I react.

    But I've seen the ones you are statics are talking about. I'd say those are about the ones that give up and don't get angry enough to prove the statics incorrect.

    Pax.
    AngieM2
     
  17. wr

    wr Moderator Staff Member Supporter

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    WillowWisp, firstly, good parent or poor parent, if the child is away from her for short periods of time (under 6 months) she still has to pay the same in rent & utilities and basic costs. Secondly, there's no need for your hubby to be tired and worn out from her stays, can you not invovle yourself with the child enough to let him sleep? It sounds to me like you're resenting the wrong person, the child was there long before you and if the child is inconvenient or a hassle, you really aren't seeing things correctly. That child did not asked to have a divorced family, nor did she ask for the arrangements she's living with and she deserves a lot more that the resentment I feel in you assessment of the situation. What good will it do for the child (not you or you husband) if he were to scrap with her mother, face to face or in court. I'd bet my soul you aren't all that unwilling to make nasty comments about mom anytime you're upset. Have you thought how that makes the child feel? I think my husbands ex is the text book example of an idiot, she's bought horses, truck and just about anything else with child support and as far as the son knows, I think his mom is a really cool lady. In reality, I'm the cool lady, I buy his jeans, school books and anything else extra that he might need. Mine get a bit less but that's just too darned bad, they learn about sharing and they learn to be good people. Kids first, my dear, adults last. We made them or married those that did so we'd best be willing to step up to the plate and give them the best we can offer them in the way of love and time, the only two things that a kid really needs.