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Some states are higher, some are lower. Still high enough to be worried about. Also, the NYT isn't a place that is trusted as they lie constantly. I was hoping you would post from an unbiased source like the JAM or the Lancet or from a university. 2 of my local hospitals are not even keep track of these breakthrough cases as told to me by my friends wife...a contracted ICU nurse. Ill take her word before i take yours. There's a reason TPTB don't want the true numbers to be publicized.
I posted a good source. Why don't you post something that proves my post wrong? Can you? I estimated the 2 percent by looking at the charts though they say 3 percent in the article. Still shows that breakthrough hospitalizations are minuscule compared to unvaccinated hospitalizations.
 

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Those extra hospitalizations can be greatly reduced in this pandemic by people getting vaccinated.
Simple, in a free country you can't force people to participate in a vaccine test. No matter what the current experts say. No matter how much you may believe in the vaccine, you have no right to tell other people what they should or should not believe. I know it is difficult for a Hive Minded individual to believe but the world does not revolve around your opinion.
 

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Simple, in a free country you can't force people to participate in a vaccine test. No matter what the current experts say. No matter how much you may believe in the vaccine, you have no right to tell other people what they should or should not believe. I know it is difficult for a Hive Minded individual to believe but the world does not revolve around your opinion.
I have a right to an opinion. I have not forced anyone to get vaccinated.

The courts of this free country have upheld vaccination mandates but I sure wish that people would understand that I did not make those rulings or make any laws about vaccines. I do have an opinion on them that is correct. You seem to have one as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #66 ·
Simple, in a free country you can't force people to participate in a vaccine test. No matter what the current experts say. No matter how much you may believe in the vaccine, you have no right to tell other people what they should or should not believe. I know it is difficult for a Hive Minded individual to believe but the world does not revolve around your opinion.
Now use your argument on women’s right to choose.
 

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If you’re familiar with my posts you’d know that I agree with most of what you said other than the trump part.
I am not here to court your agreement. And it doesn't matter what you agree with most of the time. If you think I am wrong then say so, and when you are wrong I will point it out to you.
 

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I posted a good source. Why don't you post something that proves my post wrong? Can you? I estimated the 2 percent by looking at the charts though they say 3 percent in the article. Still shows that breakthrough hospitalizations are minuscule compared to unvaccinated hospitalizations.
I looked at that a few days ago. Those percents are based on "AS A PCT. OF ALL COVID HOSPITALIZATIONS". The same applies to deaths.

It appears that ALL goes back to the first hospitalazion and death. That would skew the numbers.

In addition, I doubt all breakthrough cases/deaths are reported.
 
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Discussion Starter · #69 ·
I am not here to court your agreement. And it doesn't matter what you agree with most of the time. If you think I am wrong then say so, and when you are wrong I will point it out to you.
I was showing a consistency in my thoughts.
I do think you’re wrong and I think your argument is inconsistent.
 

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I looked at that a few days ago. Those percents are based on "AS A PCT. OF ALL COVID HOSPITALIZATIONS". The same applies to deaths.

It appears that ALL goes back to the first hospitalazion and death. That would skew the numbers.

In addition, I doubt all breakthrough cases/deaths are reported.
No, It is from Jan 1 of this year I believe.
 

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Now use your argument on women’s right to choose.
If a woman chooses, or even if the majority of women choose to have an abortion, it doesn't justify killing babies. And no government should make it legal to kill babies, just because it is a popular choice. No more than they should require that people be vaccinated, even if the majority of people choose to do so. You can't justify something just because "everybody is doing it".
 

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Discussion Starter · #73 ·
If a woman chooses, or even if the majority of women choose to have an abortion, it doesn't justify killing babies. And no government should make it legal to kill babies, just because it is a popular choice. No more than they should require that people be vaccinated, even if the majority of people choose to do so. You can't justify something just because "everybody is doing it".
Why should people who aren’t vaccinated be allowed to kill others because of their refusal to follow medical advice?
 

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i wonder how many arguing here are vaccinated.
What does that have to do with the argument about choice. I have not been vaccinated, but even if I had, I would still insist that it is a choice.
 

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It is clearly not logical. I never said anyone should wait or go to the back of the line, vaccinated or unvaccinated. You went there all on your own.
I did. If you think that those who are not vaccinated need to wait to see a doctor, so should those who have been vaccinated and made poor choices that caused them to become infected. Simple.
 

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Why should people who aren’t vaccinated be allowed to kill others because of their refusal to follow medical advice?
Nobody is being allowed to kill anyone. The vaccine does not guaranteed that you won't become infected, or that you can't infect others. It may lessen the effects of an infection, but even that is an opinion. My opinion no matter how strongly held, does not negate your right to have a differing opinion. My choices no matter what they are, do not prevent you from making different choices. If you have a very strong opinion, and I have a very strong opinion, doesn't make either of us right. It does allow us to choose, what we do and how we act.

Because of my wife's medical practice, I happen to know a lot of doctors and nurse practitioners. Some of them are in favor of the vaccine, and some are not. Who I choose to believe is my choice. Who you choose to believe is your choice. Neither one of us is killing anyone. We are all taking our chances, based on our choices.
 

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Discussion Starter · #78 ·
Nobody is being allowed to kill anyone. The vaccine does not guaranteed that you won't become infected, or that you can't infect others. It may lessen the effects of an infection, but even that is an opinion. My opinion no matter how strongly held, does not negate your right to have a differing opinion. My choices no matter what they are, do not prevent you from making different choices. If you have a very strong opinion, and I have a very strong opinion, doesn't make either of us right. It does allow us to choose, what we do and how we act.

Because of my wife's medical practice, I happen to know a lot of doctors and nurse practitioners. Some of them are in favor of the vaccine, and some are not. Who I choose to believe is my choice. Who you choose to believe is your choice. Neither one of us is killing anyone. We are all taking our chances, based on our choices.
But you are in favor of taking the abortion choice away.
im not in favor of taking away a choice. I’m just saying that those who make their choices live with the consequences.
 

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I didn’t say it did. Just wondered.
I haven’t had an abortion either but I still insist it’s an individual choice.
I have never murdered anyone, but I have talked to murders who insist that they were justified. I have arrested thieves and drug smugglers who insisted that they did it to feed their families. Should I have let them go because they thought they had a good excuse?
 

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Discussion Starter · #80 ·
I have never murdered anyone, but I have talked to murders who insist that they were justified. I have arrested thieves and drug smugglers who insisted that they did it to feed their families. Should I have let them go because they thought they had a good excuse?
For self defense…yes.
None of us are obligated to sacrifice our body for another.
 
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