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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Is it trespassing when bees do what bees do in California's tangerine groves?

That is the question being weighed by state agriculture officials caught between beekeepers who prize orange blossom honey and citrus growers who blame the bees for causing otherwise seedless mandarin oranges to develop pips.

"Both sides are unwilling to give any ground, and both have valid points," said Jerry Prieto, the former Fresno County agricultural commissioner who has spent six months mediating the dispute. :help:



http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090109/ap_on_bi_ge/farm_scene_bees_vs_tangerines
 

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Appalachian American
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If the tangerine growers can't grow seedless oranges because of something that is entirely natural, then they have a problem, not the beekeepers.
 

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If the tangerine growers can't grow seedless oranges because of something that is entirely natural, then they have a problem, not the beekeepers.
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Totally agree with you on that issue.........the PROBLEM is that the growers are making it the beekeepers problem and threatening litigation for perceived losses attributed to honeybees doing what honeybees do. Can the courts actually enforce a natural function and if so, how can they state that it was honeybees belonging to beekeeper Y, rather than beekeeper Z?
Better than that, if enforced, would beekeepers Y and/or Z NOT have a defense to have the plaintiffs PROVE that it was their honeybees who did the pollination and not native bees/insects/wind???

That being said, it will come down to who has either more money to spend or public support or BOTH........someone is going to loose in the end......my honest guess would be, that the beekeeperers will come up short......again.

This is a real sticky-wicket should the courts decide to intervene.......honey is sticky enough by itself!!! :stars:
 

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Appalachian American
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****************************
Totally agree with you on that issue.........the PROBLEM is that the growers are making it the beekeepers problem and threatening litigation for perceived losses attributed to honeybees doing what honeybees do. Can the courts actually enforce a natural function and if so, how can they state that it was honeybees belonging to beekeeper Y, rather than beekeeper Z?
Better than that, if enforced, would beekeepers Y and/or Z NOT have a defense to have the plaintiffs PROVE that it was their honeybees who did the pollination and not native bees/insects/wind???

That being said, it will come down to who has either more money to spend or public support or BOTH........someone is going to loose in the end......my honest guess would be, that the beekeeperers will come up short......again.

This is a real sticky-wicket should the courts decide to intervene.......honey is sticky enough by itself!!! :stars:
Unless the tangerine grower can identify each honeybee on his property, and prove that there are no wild bees, they would have a difficult time getting anywhere in court. Since honeybees occur naturally, it is up the orange growers to deal with nature, rather than trying to force beekeepers to stop their bees from doing what they do.
 

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They will just demand that we microchip our bees through NAIS. That way they can keep track and start charging you for the nectar.

UGH.. craziness!!!

Cricket
 

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Actually, the beekeepers should go after the tangerine growers for creating a constructive nuisance. If they weren't planting something the bees like then there wouldn't be a problem.

Mike
 

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well I am not a beekeeper,I only hope to be. I am also not a lawyer which I hope to never be(I'm sure most of you could Imagine why). I do know a bit about animals. Bees are not the only pollinators some mammals(bats) and birds(hummingbirds) and then you also have the wild bees(not just honey bees) and other insects. I belive the burden of proof lies(little lawyer pun there) with the plaintive. I would also belive under the circumstances that the fault would be found to rest with the plaintive. there is no way you could hope to keep domestic or wild pollinators of out of a orchard (for the most part you want them in your orchard) with out some form of prevention(happy farm wifes row cover)! so the measures to guarantee their seedless fruit would rest with them. If I was one of those keepers I would enlist the support of growers who depend on pollination from various sources and show that the bees support the greater good. I always was under the assumption that seedless fruit was bred to be just that(Never grew citrus little cold here for that). So maybe these folks don't have a seedless variety. but I know that you can buy seedless citrus in the stores and I imagine that where this is produced there are pollinators. So I would contact someone who does produce said product and see how they do it. then if it goes to court I would think that would be more than sufficient to prove that said bees are not the culprit. counter sue for legal costs and what ever else I would be entitled to. I dont think these growers are not really after the beekeepers though I think there looking for an easy out and hopeing the state make up the difference in the crop price. Other wise I think they would of taken it to court already.
 

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another thought should the growers spray to kill the polinators could the bee keepers sue for destruction of property and hardship due to their loss of possiable income and or contamination of thier product...
got to love law (ya if we could all just be civil with each other and find a happy medium
wouldnt need it... and if thier wernt so many sheeple that need to be coddled,and shiesters that seek to manipulate the rules to thier whim!)
 

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All our bees wear bright yellow ear tags. We are kept real busy in the summer tagging them all.

So if your kids get stung and you didn't see an ear tag it wasn't one of ours.

:D Al
 

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I read an article written by one of these growers that called it hogwash that the bees were the problem. He said that he had grown seedless for many years with bee pollinators and no problems until another grower close to him started growing a seeded variety and then when bees went to both farms his crops were cross pollinated and the problems started. As he states it was not the bees fault but that of the other grower planting too close to his groves with other types of citrus.
 

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another thought should the growers spray to kill the polinators could the bee keepers sue for destruction of property and hardship due to their loss of possiable income and or contamination of thier product...
got to love law (ya if we could all just be civil with each other and find a happy medium
wouldnt need it... and if thier wernt so many sheeple that need to be coddled,and shiesters that seek to manipulate the rules to thier whim!)
Absolutely. I had a neighbor in GA that didn't like bees and sevin dusted his whole yard. Killed my beehives off. Asked him to pay for the hives and he told me to get bent, took it to court and the judge awarded me damages as well as cost of hives, court costs, and contaminated honey costs.

Farmers that spray fields have to notify the beekeeprs that have hives near their land to keep bees in while they spray.
 
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