Sub-q shot photos

Discussion in 'Goats' started by Caprice Acres, May 2, 2006.

  1. Caprice Acres

    Caprice Acres AKA "mygoat" Staff Member Supporter

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    Can someone supply a pic of giving a sub q shot? I can't for the life of me figure out where to give goats a sub-q shot!! Thier hide is thick over the shoulders where I tried it origionally, and ended up with lumps that were there for at least 3 mon, and one even lost hair over the lump, which thankfully grew back.
    I think I'll always prefer giving an IM shot, it's just plain easier. I just think that things like antibiotics might work longer if given sub-q, because they are absorbed slower? I think I read that on this forum sometime. Something like IM working fast but being used up quickly or somethin, and sub-q working for a long time. Plus there are alot of things that you can only give sub-q. I would just like to know both ways to inject stuff into goats. I can practice with fortified vita b shots if I need to.
     
  2. Susan n' Emily in TN

    Susan n' Emily in TN Well-Known Member

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    Hi, Some things you shouldn't give im, ambiphen for one. It can cause some sort of tissue reaction. I don't know about the other things, I just know that there are some real no no's. Each injectable has written instructions on the bottle about whether it is to be given IM or SQ
    When you give a shot SQ, pinch the skin and pull away from the body, making a tent, stick your finger in the tent to see if you can feel that the skin is raised from the muscle layer. If you can feel it, that is where you want to place the needle, and give the shot. once you have inserted the needle pull back on the syringe to make sure you have a vacumm, that means you haven't gone out the other side, the first few times you are shaking like a leaf, but then you get used to it. You should feel a lump there if you are successful. I don't know what shot you gave before that had a reaction, so I can't help you there. susan
     

  3. Dr.Who

    Dr.Who Well-Known Member

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    Here is a picture of where I give Sq shots. In the area behind the arm there should be some loose skin. I pull the skin up to make a tent, I insert the needle just under the skin and inject it fast. I remove the needle, I feel the lump I just left, and I rub the lump down as hard as I can until it is gone..(a few seconds). The lump never has come back after I rub it down.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Susan n' Emily in TN

    Susan n' Emily in TN Well-Known Member

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    If I were you I wouldn't rub it in. You can also give it between the shoulder blades, or anywhere really around the shoulder area. Say from where you gave that shot, all the way up and around to the other side. Don't always give it in the same place. There is more loose skin than you realize. susan
     
  5. Caprice Acres

    Caprice Acres AKA "mygoat" Staff Member Supporter

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    I know how to give a sub-q shot in cats and dogs and others that have loose skin over the shoulders, but where I would give my cat it's shots, there would be no way to pull up skin!! I haven't given anything that isn't good to give as an IM shot, but know that some shots must be given sub-q. The time I tried a sub-q shot was with bar-vac and 1 month old kids... Tried to give it right over the shoulder. Not only did the kids SCREAM thier heads off, I couldn't get a clean jab at the skin, which was really really tough to puncture! Just made em scream more. Hardly would tent, too. This is over the shoulders, though. I didn't know you could give it in the armpit area... Anywho, I did a bad job with sub-q vaccinations. Lumps were there for ages and one lost hair over the site... The other had two injection sites, one over each shoulder, because the darn baby wouldn't sit still enough to get 2cc in her!! The next time I vaccinated I used a IM cd/t shot. I sat on a tall bin, used my calves to grip their barrel right behind thier front legs so thier head was under my thighs, and lifted both ther back legs up into the air so I could easily reach them... They baa'ed when the cold vaccine hit ther muscle, but didn't even flinch for the jab or the withdrawl. Crawled into my lap afterward. Took me at least a week to get them to come back up to me after the sub-q shot...
     
  6. Jen H

    Jen H Well-Known Member

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    The problem with giving CD/T shots IM is if they get an allergic reaction to the vaccine it will happen too quickly to get the epi into their system to counteract the shock. If you can't counteract the allergic response, the goat will die. An SQ shot is absorbed more slowly, so if an allergic reaction does develop you have time to get the epi into their system to counteract it. (epinephrin shots are given IM)

    The vast majority of goats will never have an allergic reaction, but the possibility is always there.

    What you also run into is some goats lump up more than others do. I have one goat that routinely forms an absess wherever he gets a shot, and three others that never get lumps.
     
  7. Terre d'Esprit

    Terre d'Esprit Boer-ing Mom

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    Mygoat, what size needles are you using? 18-20's are recommended for goats. Maybe your needles are too wide if it's hard for you to inject? Just a thought. : ) Good luck!

    T
     
  8. KSALguy

    KSALguy Lost in the Wiregrass Supporter

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    are you useing an older syringe? we would clean and sterilize our needles and use them a few times and after we used them a couple times they got dull and not as effective,
    try down at the front elbo joint behind where there is thin loos skin, and come in from the side of the tent not the top
     
  9. Sweet Goats

    Sweet Goats Cashmere goats

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    Why would you not rub it? All the vets around here and at all the clinics the kids go to say rub it to disperse the medication.
    I have never heard anyone say not to rub it.
     
  10. Dr.Who

    Dr.Who Well-Known Member

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    I used to work as a Vet assistant and the lump was always rubbed in. Also.. who wants a bunch of little lumps all over a goat? Especially if you plan to show them.. people might think your goat has CL. Susan n' Emily in TN I am curious as to why you believe that you shouldn't rub the lump in??
    Dr.Who
     
  11. Caprice Acres

    Caprice Acres AKA "mygoat" Staff Member Supporter

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    Hmm, the needles I have now are 20 ga, but the ones I had then might have been either 16 or 18 ga... think it was 16. I know the vaccine came back through the passage, so they were probably 16 ga. Too big, I know now. That was the size my vet had given me before, so that was the kind I ordered... Well, now I have 20 ga.

    Also, they were clean, new syringes/needles. I don't reuse disposable needles or syringes. The stainless heavy duty needles I will reuse once, but that's only after sterilization. They were the heavy duty stainless ones, but I believe it was thier first use.
     
  12. Susan n' Emily in TN

    Susan n' Emily in TN Well-Known Member

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    hey all, I work as a Vet tech. My vet looked at me agast when I told her that you were rubbing it in. She said that the tissue damage is much greater when you rub it in, it also makes it hurt more. I just knew that we never did. The lumps shouldn't be there more that a month or so. she also said that even though it is easier to give shots IM you can do much more damage that way. Nerves are easy to hit and so are bleeders.

    18 g is good for ambiphen, and the thick stuff but you could use a 22 g for the more fluid things. We also don't reuse our needles, unless we are giving SG fluids to the same animal, and then only twice, and we have to KNOW it is the same animal, when in doubt use a new one. Of course we have to be extra careful here. We do resterilize some of the 3cc syringes and use them for dewormer but not for injections. Susan
     
  13. homebirtha

    homebirtha Well-Known Member

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    You might want to try a 22 ga, especially for kids. 16 or 18 is pretty huge for a baby goat.

     
  14. Dr.Who

    Dr.Who Well-Known Member

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    Well every vet is different. But I would still rub it in. Don't think I would use a vet that reuses syringes even if they were just for oral use and were sterilized. That vet should know better.
    Dr.Who