Strange oil leak

Discussion in 'Shop Talk' started by HermitJohn, Nov 14, 2004.

  1. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    Ok noticed my '89 Festiva leaking oil and was doing it kinda rapidly. Figured it must be rear main. Removed transaxle and replaced seal and clutch while I had thing apart. Oil pressure since I've got it is when hot around 50psi driving down the road and between 20 and 25 sitting at idle.

    Ok next day I am travelling. When I stop to get gas, I am down over a quart and oil everywhere. Cant see where its coming from. Well went through maybe 6 quart in a 750 mile drive. Underside of car is a big oil slick. People think car is overheating when I am at an idling stop or when I first park because of oil vapor raising from around hood.

    Someone says they see oil dripping from around mechanical fuel pump (kinda buried on firewall side of head). Ok, reseal that with the 15min wally world putty epoxy since I would have to special order spacer and gaskets for this pump and dont have time for that. No more oil leak from around fuel pump. On way home use maybe 3 quart, but weird the oil pressure at hiway speed is dropping. Starts at 50, then 45, by time I was close to home down around 35, but still over 20 at idle (it should drop also with a leak/bad bearing or so I would think--I checked oil level often just to be sure it wasnt that). Get to thinking maybe its the little copper line from block to oil pressure gauge. Ok today I put it up on jack stands and since figure it has to be either that or oil filter, I replace oil filter while engine is cold. Start it, let it get to operating temp. Crawl under with it running. Not a drop oozing, leaking, or otherwise coming from engine can I see nor the copper line to the pressure gauge. Get in drivers seat to turn it off and notice its idling at 30psi (in range of what manual says one of these engines in good condition is supposed to). Rev it and it hits 60+psi (thats really good), let up and goes back to 30. This is a fully warmed up engine.

    Ok, could a faulty or plugged up oil filter cause this condition. Thats all I changed. I guess all oil could be from around oil filter gasket or pinhole in the filter. Know for sure when I take it on hiway again. See if oil is still thrown all over. If I am still getting an oil slick, dont know quite where to look next.
     
  2. wy_white_wolf

    wy_white_wolf Just howling at the moon

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    Pinhole leak could very easily but out that much oil under pressure. I once had a pinhole leak in the line to the oil gauge. At 20 psi it would hardly drip. But rap the engine up to 60 psi, it would shoot 10 feet in the air. Really made a big mess of eveything.

    Have someone hold the rpm up while you look for the leak under the higher pressure.
     

  3. mightybooboo

    mightybooboo Well-Known Member

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    Hate to guess til you retest,but Im thinking you nailed it with the filter replace,Ive had em leak at the seal before.Update us soon,eh?
    BooBoo
     
  4. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    Ok, drove to town today to help my ex and her friend move couple dressers. Oil all over. Opened air cleaner and oil all over inside it. Air filter oil soaked. Apparently oil was from pcv system and leaking from air filter can. I mean I must have stopped some of it when I epoxied fuel pump flange and I'm sure a little from rear main, but this is the significant oil leak. The only car I've really went through this before with was an old Volvo. It would douse itself and engine bay in oil everytime I drove it. When I replaced cam and lifters, the oil puking from pcv stopped.

    For now I can tie an old pop bottle somewhere and run hose for pcv air intake to it, but need a long term cure. Need to adjust valves anyway so see what kind of oil baffle they put in valve cover. Am betting not much of one. Maybe I can improve it enough to stop the puking. I am sure this indicates big time blowby although none of this the first 1500 miles I drove it, just used a quart every 500 miles and suspect that went out the rear main or fuel pump flange as sparkplugs showed no signs of oil burning. So what would cause an engine to just suddenly start spewing oil big time from pcv intake? The pcv valve is functioning properly.

    This must be a known problem with this engine as I noticed air cleaner can was designed so any oil from pcv tends to drain away from filter and carb and out the air cleaner intake neck.
     
  5. mightybooboo

    mightybooboo Well-Known Member

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    \
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    John,did you see this?
    www.automotivehelper.com/topic197826.htm
    BooBoo
     
  6. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    Yep saw that, dont think that is way to go. Also about 7th post here: http://www.allpar.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t47173.html You might as well plug the air inlet on valve cover. I've thought this out and for now am going to epoxy a reversed pcv valve onto air inlet of valve cover. It will allow engine to suck all fresh air it wants but wont let it puke back into air filter can. Now this isnt best solution and could cause leaks elsewhere if enough pressure built up.

    The best solution I've found is to do this: http://www.allpar.com/fix/pcv-breather.html Then maybe put a T in dipstick tube and run a line from bottom of this setup to the T, thus letting any oil collected drain back through gravity. Shouldnt be problem as there sure hasnt yet been pressure enough to pop the dipstick. I think problem is a combination of some excess high mileage blowby and a poorly designed oil baffle on the pcv air intake. Not some kind of super duty blowby.

    I havent found any mention at all of this problem with the Mazda B6 engines so suspect they have a better baffle and the SOHC version of B6 should have valve cover that would bolt directly onto the B3.

    By way I have found couple $500 delivered price B6 carb engines from those places that sell low mile used Japanese engines. Think if I got one of these, I'd convert to Weber carb and forget all the mirad of vacuum hoses and other crap. I swear pic of one of those B6 carb engines looked like a dang porcupine with all the crap on it. Probably lose some gas mileage going from B3 to B6, but maybe not that much. Still this engine in car now is peppy and not burning oil, just puking it, so seems silly to even consider anything major.
     
  7. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    Ok, tried the reversed pcv valve on air inlet. Yep stopped oil from going to air filter can, but apparently enough pressure build up that I have oil from new places. Thats no good. Ok, can try that more elaborate oil trap that I gave link to above. Not pricey to build and probably work much better than the reversed pcv valve. I may even want to open things up with bigger pcv valve and bigger lines. I just really hate to give up on an otherwise good engine because of this oil problem especially at only 123k miles.
     
  8. mightybooboo

    mightybooboo Well-Known Member

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    Know how you feel,its a nice feeling to stretch out all the miles,esp. when its moving along so well.I like the flow back thru the dipstick,would be a great fix!
    BooBoo
     
  9. Beeman

    Beeman Well-Known Member

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    Do you have a compression gauge? Do a compression test and see what you get. Then if possible do a leakdown test by blowing controlled pressure air into the cylinder with the valves closed. If you get a low compression reading and air bypassing into the crankcase you will know what your problem is. Unfortunately you will also know what the fix is.
     
  10. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    yep, have compression gauge. Think I have been avoiding it because of what I knew might find. Well warmed up car this morning and compression readings: 140, 142, 135, 120. Yep dang it. I mean its possible its a leaky valve, but most likely ring on cylinder #4. I dont have good air compressor any more, just a noisy toy thing that takes 15min to inflate a tire, so the leak down test is out although yes that would pinpoint problem.

    I'll price out parts but they tend to be pricey on these Jap engines. Plus there is some noticable crank end play when I changed timing belt, so whether better to try and patch this thing or just replace it is a question. Have to pull engine anyway if I replace main bearings.
     
  11. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    Yep, I was right, $100 for set of rings and close to another $100 for set of bearings. Plus $$$ for gasket set. That is assuming no machine work involved which is a foolish assumption. If one is going to do this sort of thing, then just as well do it right. I can get a low mile used B6 carb engine from one of those places that imports them from Japan for minimum delivered price of $450. That would seem way to go. Just grunt work then.