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Discussion Starter #1
Do any of you listen to National Public Radio? they have had several interviews with folks affected by our presidents move. I'm torn on this subject. If you take this issue individual person by person it really is heart-breaking. One mother who has been here 16 years may be deported and separated from her children and grandchildren. Of course she has worked. With no social security number, anyone who has employed her knows she is illegal. She has been paid less than half what a citizen would have been paid. Her employers have also not paid SS, fica, etc. If American employers weren't interested in hiring illegal immigrants (stealing in effect) would they come here? My neighbor hires them during hay making season and construction contractors in this area depend on illegals. These same contractors will only take "cash" if they do work for you. Income that is not disclosed is tax fraud and theft in my book. Thou Shall Not Steal applies.
American citizens can stop illegal immigrants by NOT HIRING THEM. Bashing our President will not have any positive affect. I may not agree with everything our President has done, but as a country I think we are not stronger over all if we bash the "coach". Can-O-Worms now open!
 

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As long as greed rules the working world, people will hire the cheapest person thy can...

I can't feel sorry for any of them. They took the risk, and they broke the law. They knew the consequences if they got caught. Bosses, and illegals.

The problem with Obama is, he's overstepping his authority. He's not listing to the will of the people who put him in office.. Remember for the people by the people?
 

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This POPTUS must be stopped. And a flurry of Lawsuits is just the start. Making a mockery of the presidency should not be taken lightly.
And stopping him now making him a disgrace to the highest office in the land maybe the only way to do it.
And it should have started with Stopping At The Border Secure it once and for all. Even Halting ANYBODY from getting into the uSA until this mess is cleaned up.~!
And Send those illegals Back Across and let them fend for themselves and make something of themselves in THEIR COUNTRY. Harsh You bet. But this do nothing way has proven to be the wrong way. And this EO is just another nail in the constitution that is getting all trampled on and rip the shreds.
We HAVE laws on the books now the System is NOT broken Enforce what is there~!

How many REALLY KNOW that ONLY 700K can LEGALLY get citizenship into the USA in a Years Time?
Immigration Act of 1990 think a few on here better read up on it and that Includes visas increases of 40% LAWS ARE ON THE BOOKS. Enforce Them~!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Simi, The Supreme Court has the authority to determine whether an executive order is or is not constitutional. I'm not going there. I stand by "no jobs no Illegals" Corporate America created this problem and now our President has to deal with an ugly subject.
 

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Yes, another way of thinking about it is that she got away with it for 16 years. The local news interviewed a "latino advocate" about this. He said that Latinos have been living in fear and now don't have to. Imagine breakinh the law and no longer having to fear the consequences. That's another way of saying open border.
 

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LAZY americans created this problem. Those that want to sit on their behinds and suck of the government instead of picking lettuce or milking cows. ~!
I worked at jobs back in the late 60's and early 70's that would make a billy goat puke~!
Dead animal pickup
Worked at making dog food, dumping 55 gallon barrels of blood into a cooker
Worked at a milk range feeding stinking mink, furthering deal cows horses and grinding them up to feed to the mink
Ands went out and picked pup dead and downed cos on farms to take back to that mink range.

Jobs today that No young american would be could dead doing.
They want to sit home play games on their iPhones Watch HDTV and play with their X-Boxes while getting Food Stamps and Welfare off the American Tax Payer.

I Shed No Tear for these lazy non workers that will not Work at jobs that would turn a veterinarian green~!
don't put the entire blame on American Companies It lies directly into the lazies that have been brought up to suck off the government teat.
 

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The problem is, people who grow lettuce don't want to pay even minimum wage, of course people don't want to pick lettuce... That doesn't make them lazy. That means they have standards...

There are a ton of highly skilled American citizens who want to work, but the government passes out H1B permits to all these corps who don't want to pay a fair wage for fair work..

Yes, some people are lazy, but many are not, and can't find a decent job..

As far as the Supreme Court, it takes a long time for an issue to get there, and once it does, a long time for a ruling.. In this case, Congress needs to act and force the fraud out of office.
 

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Go talk to many companies that PAY good wages and hire 3 Mexicans 5 Americans that will work say at a cement factory ALL 5 Americans Will be GONE in less than a week and some will not make it in to work the 2nd day.
TALK to REAL companies and factories whoo do pay wages to live and you will very very few Americans.
And SO WHAT if the wage is low? Tis better than sitting sucking off the tax payer.
This mentality of I won't work unless I make a high rate of wages has got to GO~!

Food Stamps has got to be Lowered so people are FORCED to get off ones backside and FEED THEMSELVES and their families. If that means 2 jobs than so be it.
Many did in there past they can do it again~!
 

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Simi, The Supreme Court has the authority to determine whether an executive order is or is not constitutional. I'm not going there. I stand by "no jobs no Illegals" Corporate America created this problem and now our President has to deal with an ugly subject.
Your President.....not mine.
He may or may not be, president of the US but I will never call him mine.
 

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Do any of you listen to National Public Radio? they have had several interviews with folks affected by our presidents move. I'm torn on this subject. If you take this issue individual person by person it really is heart-breaking. One mother who has been here 16 years may be deported and separated from her children and grandchildren. Of course she has worked. With no social security number, anyone who has employed her knows she is illegal. She has been paid less than half what a citizen would have been paid. Her employers have also not paid SS, fica, etc. If American employers weren't interested in hiring illegal immigrants (stealing in effect) would they come here? My neighbor hires them during hay making season and construction contractors in this area depend on illegals. These same contractors will only take "cash" if they do work for you. Income that is not disclosed is tax fraud and theft in my book. Thou Shall Not Steal applies.
American citizens can stop illegal immigrants by NOT HIRING THEM. Bashing our President will not have any positive affect. I may not agree with everything our President has done, but as a country I think we are not stronger over all if we bash the "coach". Can-O-Worms now open!
Get congress to wright a law with a large fine for hiring an illegal on each case. In other words for each lleagal you will be fine $5000 and two it will be $10000. That way the jobs will be limited to those that are willing to pay the fine.
 

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I worked at a tomato greenhouse...NO ONE in town would work out there....minimum wage but I loved being outdoors most of the time...they had to hire illegals to come in and help...then Immigration came in and arrested them and sent them back....the only thing left for the owner was to shut every thing down...and he sold all the huge greenhouses...so it was all gone......those who could have worked out there would not..they got to stay home, get a check from from the state, go fishing and laugh at those who would work......
 

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What is bad the way I understand the President is giving them Green Cards. Most I know don't want Citizenship, so President is giving them what they want and taking away from United States Citizens.

Ok right now I know several families that are over here because of my two step kids. Their father whom never paid a dime Child Support because we thought he was in Iran is using them to come and go as he pleases.

big rockpile
 

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When minimum wage provides less of a life than what the government is giving out, what would you do?
Make the government to Give LESS in handouts. ~! Raise the limit for F good Stamps so those that don't need don't get them.
When people get hungry enough they WILL FIND WORK, and if they have to give up cable in the process so be it, if they have to give up iPhones that have tons of Gigs in hours, and on and on and on.
They WILL make live better for themselves.
 

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Obama's aunt is an illegal immigrant and she is on record as saying she deserves all the free entitlements that working folks pay so she can sit on her ass and do nothing all day long. So no surprise Obama thinks all illegals should be welcomed here.

The bottom line is the whole ILLEGAL perspective. You do not let people spit on our laws and come here illegally and then be welcome. They all need to be shipped home. In addition, we need to change the law that anyone born here is an American citizen. They should only be an American citizen if one of their parents is legally an american citizen. Our government is a pathetic joke. We really need a revolution and overthrow the government. Get rid of the career politicians and get back to what our founders intended.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Some of you need to read "The Grapes of Wrath". It is a heart breaking documentary of families forced off their farms during the dust bowl and lured to California to pick produce. You need to read this.
Until lightening strikes and there is an amendment to "Love thy neighbor as thy self" that excludes immigrants I for one will not condone the separation of families, exportation of an elderly person to a land where they have no home or family, or any cause of human suffering caused by "The land of free and the home of the brave! Can any one of you really, REALLY state one negative effect you have had because of someone being here without proper documentation?
 

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I worked at a tomato greenhouse...NO ONE in town would work out there....minimum wage but I loved being outdoors most of the time...they had to hire illegals to come in and help...then Immigration came in and arrested them and sent them back....the only thing left for the owner was to shut every thing down...and he sold all the huge greenhouses...so it was all gone......those who could have worked out there would not..they got to stay home, get a check from from the state, go fishing and laugh at those who would work......
Blame it squarely on the government for providing freebies to able bodies people who don't want to work. They distort the free market. The tomato place you worked for could have stayed in business if managed properly in a free market where every tomato grower had to play by the same rules. Look at your local McDonalds and most other businesses, or even yourself if you hire anyone to do anything for you. You, McDonalds, and everyone else wants to hire the cheapest people you can get capable of doing the job. When you can no longer get people to do the job, you must raise wages enough so that some will do the job even if they don't like it. While your tomato employer paid minimum wage and couldn't get locals to work, I'd bet he could get locals to work for $10.00 an hour. Yes, tomatoes would increase in price a little but other tomato growers would have to raise prices too. Illegals distort that equation by working cheap. They work cheap because they are willing to live in a run down shack with 20 other illegals and live on Ramen Noodles whereas most Americans live in a house with their families and try to have a decent living. Our economy is is a downward trend because of illegals who keep wages low and legals in other countries who we hire to make clothes, toys, and many other things we consume at lower wages too.
 

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"Love thy neighbor as thy self"
Nothing wrong with that good advice for Your NEIGHBORS.
Not what the Government is doing now making them a ward of the State and A Ward of The Government

And whatever happened to
Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country.
Now who said that do you suppose? And what political party did he belong to? Hmmmmmm . Something to REALLY THINK ABOUT.
Oh ya I do believe he was SHOT DEAD.
 

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Get congress to wright a law with a large fine for hiring an illegal on each case. In other words for each lleagal you will be fine $5000 and two it will be $10000. That way the jobs will be limited to those that are willing to pay the fine.
Isn't this the real problem.
Getting this congress to vote on the bill would do just this and more. But it might also be good for the country and the Republicans in office can't have that!
Or Congress could come up with their own bill on immigration but they refuse.
So should we just do nothing?
 
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