Scours BAD!!!! help

Discussion in 'Cattle' started by needstoknowmore, Jun 10, 2006.

  1. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    She had a few loose ones the last couple days but I just kept watching. This morning she seemed fine, I dusted her with sevin dust. mid day runny enough I worried. Gave her electrolytes and oxytetracycline. This evening it was water!!!! Tried to give her some more electrolytes, they where different, she wouldn't touch them. I couldn't get her to take anything I tried. I finally coaxed her into drinking her milk. I was confused as to if I should give her milk, but I needed to get liquids into her. I was going to give her Sulmet, but had no help. I tried to call my vet but he is not available this weekend. I will call another one if I need to.
    She is about 3 1/2 weeks old.
    What should I do for her? I will get more good electrolytes in the morning. But what else?????
     
  2. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    What is her temp?
    What and how much were you feeding her per feeding and per day?
    What breed or size is she?
    Color and smell of diarrhea?

    If you have had her for 3 weeks I am going to rule out that you are over feeding her and giving her digestive scours. Remember 10% of body weight per day in milk. No more.

    She most likely has a case of E-coli. Very common in young calves. If so she should get a shot to help her out. You vet can recommend one.
    http://www.pfizerah.com/product_overview.asp?country=US&species=DA&lang=EN&drug=LQ

    In any case get her off the milk and on a elotrolyte solution.
    Here is one I use.......
    10 teaspoons white corn syrup (dextrose) DO NOT USE TABLE SUGAR
    2 teaspoons table salt
    1 1/2 teaspoons baking soda
    1/2 gal water

    1 bottle of this twice a day for 3 days
     

  3. RLMS

    RLMS Well-Known Member

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    We use Gatorade whenever electrolytes are needed. It can replenish pretty quick.

    Cut the end off a hypodermic syringe if you don't have anything else and force it down.

    Calves, sheep, horses.

    We even dose the racehorses with it after they race. Works as good as the jugs the vets give.

    Good luck.
     
  4. moopups

    moopups In Remembrance

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    Scours are caused by lack of beneficial bacteria within cattle's bodies, the bacteria helps digest whatever is being consumed. Add this bacteria via acidopholis milk (available at larger grocery stores in cartons) or via yogurt, or commercial supplements that are available. Any injected antibiotic kills all the bacteria, the good bacteria must be replaced as immediate as possible. All feeding equipment needs to be as sterile as you would use on human babies.

    Scours leads to dehydration which leads to digging a large hole in the Earth, get the beneficial bacteria into the critter ASAP.
     
  5. Up North

    Up North KS dairy farmers

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    In any case get her off the milk and on a elotrolyte solution.
    Here is one I use.......
    10 teaspoons white corn syrup (dextrose) DO NOT USE TABLE SUGAR
    2 teaspoons table salt
    1 1/2 teaspoons baking soda
    1/2 gal water

    1 bottle of this twice a day for 3 days[/QUOTE]
    John in your recipe you clearly state DO NOT USE TABLE SUGAR. I am not questioning or criticising this, just trying to learn will you please explain why you say this? Thanks
     
  6. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    I have only had her since Wednesday. She was on milk replacer before then but I don't know how much she was getting. I have been giving 2 quarts morning and night. She also had Probios and beef nutri drench. I haven't taken her temp. She is an angus cross. I would guess about 150 lbs. there are pics of her under Ellie got a buddy. Her runs are green. I didn't notice any odor. The only antibiotics she got was what I gave her midday yesterday.
    I can get gatorade and the stuff for to make it myself lots earlier than waiting for a feed store to open.
    I just got up. She was standing at the fence looking looking at me. Now she is laying down chewing her cud.
     
  7. RLMS

    RLMS Well-Known Member

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    Even if the calf is running around like a fool DON'T let up on treatment until the feces is normal.

    Scours are bad, bad. Can fool you.

    Best of luck-and could not mean it more.
     
  8. Hammer4

    Hammer4 Well-Known Member

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    Is she on pretty lush green pasture? Maybe she has grass diarhea from eating a bunch of grass?
     
  9. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    I got a little over a pint of gatorade in her. I even rubbed her bum and that was all she would drink. I won't have help until later to be able to get it into her. I will run into town and get some different flavors. The first electrolytes I gave her yesterday she drank right down. That feed store isn't open today, but there are 2 other one town over I will try after they open.
    I was going to try for a temp, but couldn't get a reading on the thermometer, will pick up a new one. I did measure her. Came up with weight of 105. I found some real runny poop and then a little that looked better. She didn't poop while I was with her.
    I am off to town. Thanks for all the help and support!!!!
     
  10. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    She is on grass, the only safe place I could put her and keep her away from the other animals. The only time I noticed her eating it was last night when I was late with her bottle. Could that cause it?? I will find a place to move her to if I have to! My horse trailer is her shelter and I would rather not keep her locked up in there. Temps are starting to get warm again.
     
  11. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    Green scours. Do you see any blood or mucus?
    I would let a vet look at her asap or at least take a sample of the poop by his office in the morning. He can sell you a shot to give to her if needed. Rotavirus and Cryptosporidia both have a light green poop.

    Use what ever electrolytes you can get her to take. This is why I like the corn syrup because they like the taste. You can also split it up to 1 qt 4 times a day if she will not drink all at once. You just need to try and get a gallon in every 24 hours.

    Lush pasture can give her scours but no temperature. What does she look like? Does she look sick or dehydrated?
    I would tie her to the fence with access to some grass hay only just in case.
    2 qts twice a day is correct for her weight and size.
     
  12. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    I am going to chop down the grass in her pen instead of trying to move her. Might scare her a bit but will be easier than moving her. Hubby brought me home some electrolytes. I forgot to ask him for a new thermometer. I will run to town and get one along with corn syrup.
    There is no mucus or blood. I haven't seen her go recently.
    She seems normal just not as full of energy as I think she should be. But I am still new to this, Ellie was the first calf I have ever raised so I really don't know how she should be.
     
  13. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    John in your recipe you clearly state DO NOT USE TABLE SUGAR. I am not questioning or criticising this, just trying to learn will you please explain why you say this? Thanks[/QUOTE]


    I figure if Mr T. Quinn who has a bachelor of science degree from University of Minnesesota; St Paul can say it I can at least repeat it. LOL!!!

    [​IMG]
     
  14. agmantoo

    agmantoo agmantoo Supporter

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    I think there is nothing wrong except the change of diet to the grass. She is just loose as a consequence. Grab her hide over her rib cage and pull outward. If it leaves a "tent" then she is dehydrated, otherwise she just has the squirts from eating the grass which her system is not accustomed. Give her some hay to munch on instead. This will minimize the amount of grass she is eating.
     
  15. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    I checked her temp. Not sure if I trust the thermometer. It is digital from walmart, that is all they had. First reading 99.9. then they went down as low as 97.4. I did the pinch test on her neck, but will go back and do it on the ribs. Most of it went down fast but left a little pinch.
     
  16. savinggrace

    savinggrace COO of manure management

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    Now, this might be rather old fashioned, but we used to grab a handful of cud from an older cow (yeah, it's yucky) and shove it into the calves throat.

    That gives them beneficial bacteria.

    Best of luck!
     
  17. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    I went out and tested her skin over the ribs. It went down nicely. I took her temp again, first reading 102.7 second 97.6. It is going back to the store, I don't care if I did use it. At least I put a cover on it. I figured out on my old one that it was just all the way to the top. If I can get it down, I will try again with that. I'm getting pretty good at taking temps. Just helps if you have good equipment.
    I did give her some grass hay, but she chose to sleep in it instead of eat it!!
    The freshest pile I could find didn't look to bad. Not good but not like it had been. I am going to go and spend some time with her and hopefully she will go so I can see how it is doing.
     
  18. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    The more this goes on the more I agree with Agmantoo and say you have a lush grass scour. This is the main problem with playing doc over the internet. With scours you have to assume the worst because it can get real bad real fast if you assume less and it is bad.

    You did not see any blood spots in poop.
    She does not seem dehydrated.
    Her temp is normal at 102 especially since she is on replacer.
    She was just moved to a new location with lush pasture.

    The electrolyte is not going to hurt her. It will even help settle her stomach.
    Get her off that green lush pasture even if it means tying her in your driveway. Put her on a grass hay diet. Introduce some green grass a little at a time.
     
  19. needstoknowmore

    needstoknowmore Rattlin Rock Ranch

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    Thanks! I had been told not to put Ellie out on pasture. But when I brought this girl home I was just trying to keep her safe and away from the other animals. The fact of putting her on grass didn't even come to mind. I did take her out some more hay, I put it out on the grass and she ate it. I will take the weed whacker out and cut down all the grass and make sure she has plenty of hay. We have too many coyotes and neighbors dogs, so leaving her where she is is the safest place for her. Leaving a bare spot in the pasture is the least of my concerns. I still have a lot to learn and I appriciate everybody who is willing to help!!!!