Overdue Pasture Rent

Discussion in 'Cattle' started by lo6xzm, Sep 13, 2006.

  1. lo6xzm

    lo6xzm Well-Known Member

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    I am an out-of-state landowner and have been renting 90 acres to a local rancher for the since 2003. The rent has been paid each year but this year he is almost 2 weeks late. We have not signed a contract/lease. Does anyone out there have any suggestions how to handle this? He has 21 cow/calf pairs and a bull on the land. I am about 3 1/2 hours away.

    rs
     
  2. Rockin'B

    Rockin'B Well-Known Member

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    Call him and talk to him about it? Your post doesn't mention if you've done that.

    Things do get lost in the mail occasionaly.
     

  3. Hammer4

    Hammer4 Well-Known Member

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    I'd call and politely ask about it, he might have forgotten it or had something come up that has distracted him. Just ask 'I was wondering if you were wanting to continue that lease as I hadn't heard from you?'
     
  4. Alice In TX/MO

    Alice In TX/MO More dharma, less drama. Supporter

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    Call as suggested above. Next year send a bill about a month before the rent is due.
     
  5. Up North

    Up North KS dairy farmers

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    If you don't have any signed contract or lease maybe he doesn't realize he is late paying. Maybe those other years he was just early. LOL Seeing he has a good track record established I wouldn't get worried. They check will show up. If not, give him a call.

    Heather
     
  6. swollen tongue

    swollen tongue Well-Known Member

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    get it in advance before the grazing starts..........that's the way they do it here.
     
  7. lo6xzm

    lo6xzm Well-Known Member

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    Well the check came in on Friday Sep/15.

    Maybe I should have a contract.
     
  8. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    I may be wrong for saying this.... BUT.................
    While you should have had a contract from the start you may be biting off the hand that feeds you by looking for a written contract now.

    Lets review.......
    The rancher has been renting since 2003 and the check has always been there. He was (in your mind) 2 weeks late once.

    Now all of a sudden you are coming across as if you do not trust the rancher and want everything in writing. This may get you a quick boot in the rear side and a education on renting land.

    You did not say what state we are talking about but I will bet that the state has laws concerning land renting and when payment is due.
    Even if I knew your state I could not answer specific questions because I am not up on the latest laws but I can tell you that rent is usually paid in the fall for the next growing season. If you are the renter you need to pay by a certain date and if you are the land owner you need to inform the renter of the previous year by a certain date if there will be any changes in the rent situation for next year.

    Lets just use dates off the top of my head to explain.
    Lets say notice is due by Aug 1 and rent is due by Sept 1.
    If you tell a renter on Aug 2 that you no longer want to rent to him.
    He has the option of paying you rent on or before Sept 1 and you would not be able to terminate the lease until the next year.
    These laws are on the books more for row crop farmers than ranchers but they still apply to both.
    They are used to protect a farmer because fields are fertilized well in advance and seed needs to be ordered. You need to plan for next year this year.

    If a renter was renting land from a previous owner and you buy the land. You still can not terminate the lease till the set date. The renter may even send you a check that you did not expect was coming. While it is rare I have heard of city folk buying some land in the country not even knowing the land is under lease. All of a suddon a rent check shows up and they find out they can not use their own land for another year because the date has passed for lease termination for this year.

    I would definitely find out what your laws say on land rent before I went waving a contract in a ranchers face.
     
  9. lo6xzm

    lo6xzm Well-Known Member

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    I rent the 90 acre pastures for $1500. The land is in southern Missouri. I have checked around and this price is at the low end of what others are paying. $125 per month for 21 cow/calves and a bull. I am happy to have the guy raise beef cattle out there. I am also happy to get a rent check each year. In late 2004, he was instrumental in getting the local authorities...a meth bust, which really cleaned up the neighborhood. We have a pretty loose agreement. Sept 1st 2003 is when he started...so the rent is due on or around the 1st. America needs people to raise cattle. This past year he got 19 calves (2 died in January) which I'm thinking netted him about $600-$700 each or about 11-$13,000. He feeds 150 big round bales a year, which costs around $25 per bale...lets say around $4000 per year. So he clears, after medications about $5,500-$7000 per year. This is a good deal for him, and I'm glad he is doing it. When I retire (sometime during the next 10 years) I want to raise the cattle myself, and he knows this and is ok with it. If I retire with full graces I may not want/need to raise cows in which case he may be able to keep doing it but this is down the road aways. But either way there will be cows grazing on the land.
     
  10. rambler

    rambler Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There's a little bit of overhead, management, fuel, and paperwork costs these day. Might want to add, oh, maybe $10 or so to the costs. ;) And maybe add $5 or so for the capital costs of the breeding stock if you feel generous. :) :)

    But yea, raising cattle is really the gravy train year in & year out. ;)

    Seriously, sounds like you 2 have a good deal, I'm not really sure what you were worried about but glad things worked out in the end.

    --->Paul - grain & cattle raiser
     
  11. susieM

    susieM Well-Known Member

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    Two weeks late and already you're counting the $$$? Shame on you!
     
  12. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    I am glad to see you have his profit margin all figured out. When you retire you may want to try raising dairy cows instead of beef. You could turn that 11-$13000 gross into 44-$48000 gross. With your over head cost you could be making mega bucks.
     
  13. savinggrace

    savinggrace COO of manure management

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    John-LA, do you mean raising heifers from bottle to first freshening? On what sort of scale would you need to do this a year? Is there a market for (say) 20 heifers at a time?

    Starting baby calves is something I know how to do, and at least in the past, I had a pretty good record! Actually, that is how my friend and I bought our first cars; the local farmers would give us the unthrifty/sick calves and we turned all but two around; we would take turns staying up with them all night-feeding every two hours, hand feeding every two hours, blanketing them and keeping everything super (almost surgical) clean. Like I said we only lost two, one was stepped on by it's mother and didn't have too much of a chance and the other was malformed....

    It's hard to make money farming around here with the high cost of land, and I am always looking for another way to make it worth my time!

    (fwiw, I have discovered meat chickens is NOT a place to make money LOL!)
     
  14. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    Sorry if I got your hopes up but do not pay attention to that last post. I was being sarcastic.

    See he has it all figured out about all the money someone else is making but has no idea what cost are. Yes his renter is making money but only because his land rent is low.
    But have you ever tried to estimate the cost of fence install and repair for 90 acres before. That is unless the land owner is providing fence repair out of his $1500 a year. He also forgot to figure that this guy has about $25,000 worth of breeding stock that needs to be replaced every so often.

    So if he can make that kind of money on beef why not try dairy.
    Lets see...........
    45 lbs of milk a day X 21 cows X 305 days a year = 2882 cwt
    2882 cwt X $15= $43233
    Plus he will have 21 calves to sell every year.
    He will be making mega bucks with his way of figuring cost.

    Let me leave you with this.
    If money can be made on a small farm of any kind (row crop; dairy; beef; eggs; meat chicken; pigs; ect) someone has already figured it out and is doing it on a large scale to allow them to cut prices and putting the small guy out of business.
     
  15. rambler

    rambler Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Several around here are doing that. It does work pretty well. What you need to provide is results - good fit fresh heifers, no problems. If you can do that _and_ live near a dairy area, it is one way to go.

    --->Paul
     
  16. savinggrace

    savinggrace COO of manure management

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    So true.