Organic Certification / Certified Naturally Grown

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by highlands, Oct 6, 2005.

  1. highlands

    highlands Well-Known Member

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    I just ran across this web site: http://naturallygrown.org/ which is an alternative to the expensive, high paper work Certified Organic labeling. Check it out if you aren't otherwise certified.

    Cheers,

    Walter Jeffries
    Sugar Mtn Farm
    in Vermont
     
  2. seedspreader

    seedspreader AFKA ZealYouthGuy

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    Nice site, thanks... I was telling my wife the same thing what a bunch of crapola the "organic" name has turned into with the fees etc.
     

  3. pinemead

    pinemead Well-Known Member

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    Excellent!! Thanks so much!
     
  4. foxtrapper

    foxtrapper Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Certify yourself as "naturally grown". It's a lot easier and you can use the same labeling. You can certify yourself as "all natural" and a host of other interesting titles.
     
  5. FarmerJeff

    FarmerJeff Well-Known Member

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    I am a Certified Organic Farmer. We run a very successful farm in NH. We follow the national organic standards to a "T" and have never had any difficulty with the exorbitant "paperwork" people are always carrying on about. Its just good business practice to keep excellent records. Our whole certification paperwork process takes one afternoon in the winter of reviewing our records and filling out the year' application and then two brief inspections with inspectors that we have developed a strong rapport with.

    Many, many small farmers broke their backs to establish the certified organic movement. I think to just write off the term "certified organic" is a slap in the face to those pioneers.
     
  6. seedspreader

    seedspreader AFKA ZealYouthGuy

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    Everyone is VERY HAPPY that you have a very successful farm and that CO has worked out well for you. This is not a "slap in the face", it's called a free market. To me a system that follows the same compliance as CO and doesn't cost me anything is a LOT more economically feasible AND you don't have a ton of haranguing over who will lead and lobby the multimillion dollar conglomerate beast. Many people like having the control in their own hands and not the hands of another.

    I think most people here are concerned with the costs and the way that the CO label has been stolen from thousands who practiced this way of growing for many years before. I guess I am talking about the TRUE pioneers, the ones who did, and have been doing it, but don't want to or can't spend the cash to become CO. In some peoples opinion the term "organic" has been stolen from the majority and given to a minority who could afford it.
     
  7. pcwerk

    pcwerk Well-Known Member Supporter

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  8. seedspreader

    seedspreader AFKA ZealYouthGuy

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  9. Jeff54321

    Jeff54321 Well-Known Member

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    "In some peoples opinion the term "organic" has been stolen from the majority and given to a minority who could afford it."
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    I agree, once the US government got their greedy little hands on the definition of organic, it signaled the beginning of the end for real grassroots organic farmers. I look for locally grown food of which I have first hand knowledge. Not always so easy. I DO NOT trust the government to truthfully label anything.
     
  10. .netDude

    .netDude Well-Known Member

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    how do I find out what is used to treat lumber? Will treated 4x4's in the corners of a pig tractor disqualify me?
     
  11. james dilley

    james dilley Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There is A huge Organic farn here in Mission Texas,Its called South Texas Organics. They ship dozens of truck loads of Organic produce weekly. Even more whem the Citrus runs. They are doing it right. And have been in bussiness over 15 years that I know of.They just got done planting, And they are going to be planting again in about a week. this is just A F Y I
     
  12. patarini

    patarini Well-Known Member

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    Only 600?? WOW! I am starting up -- everything is done with no chemicals pesticides etc, so where do I get the spare 600 from??? If u got it -- great -- but for me -- thats a lot of money to spend on a name!
     
  13. gobug

    gobug Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I might be mistaken, but I believe the widespread mis-use of the term "Organic" led to a set of standards and inspectors. For awhile, anything could be called and sold as organic. To some people this is extremely important and they are willing to pay for the word on the product. While the expense may seem high, the use of the term qualifies you for a different and more profitable market than the term "naturally grown".

    It makes sense if you are just starting out to work toward the organic standard and label your produce as naturally grown. Perhaps as you build a customer base you will be able to evaluate the return on the extra cost to add the organic to your label.

    Also, it is incorrect to assume that the term organic means NO pesticides. It means ONLY APPROVED pesticides.
     
  14. pcwerk

    pcwerk Well-Known Member Supporter

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    "Also, it is incorrect to assume that the term organic means NO pesticides. It means ONLY APPROVED pesticides.[/QUOTE]"

    What would be an approved pesticide? I don't think this is true. Unless the
    pesticide is an organic compound and not a man-made chemical? From what
    I've read, you can't use chemical pesticides of any kind. Farmerjeff what say
    you on the matter?
    james
     
  15. gobug

    gobug Well-Known Member Supporter

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    First of all, Pesticide is a WORD. There is no physical test that can determine whether something is a pesticide. ANYTHING used to kill a "pest" is a pesticide(dictionary). The government defines a pesticide as anything SOLD to kill a pest. It is not a chemical classification. It is our cultural interpretation that equates pesticide with man-made poison. In truth, there are many man made pesticides that are less toxic than household products like soap. Bleach is the most heavily used pesticide on the planet.

    One example of an approved (OMRI and NOP) pesticide is Diatect V. There are many others. I have a bottle here in front of me. It contains pyrethrin and silicon dioxide. Pyrethrin is a man made extract of the chrysanthemum and one of the most heavily used pesticides. Silicon dioxide is like diatomaceous earth. These pesticides are processed (by man) to be soluable in water (not a natural effect). It is labeled as zero days to harvest.

    There are others. Many organic compounds are not usable in an organic garden. Nicotine used to be sold as a pesticide, you could buy it in an aerosol or "bomb." It was far too toxic and removed from market decades ago. Arsenic is organic, by your terms.

    Most of the dangerous pesticides are gone now. The politically correct impression that we are in grave danger from them lingers.
     
  16. highlands

    highlands Well-Known Member

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    Wow, a little ticked off are we? Did you miss your anger management class or run out of meds?!?

    Actually there are plenty of physical tests to determine if something is a pesticide and you can test for specific known pesticide residues which indicate the use there of.

    Pesticide is not just a word, it's a way of life (for some people.) :)

    Aye, well, you can use them if you like. It is your funeral. Enjoy.
     
  17. highlands

    highlands Well-Known Member

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    The "Organic Certification process" and the coopting of the term Organic by the government and big business was a slap in the face to the thousands of people who have been practicing organic farming for decades. All of a sudden one day we were no longer allowed to use the term "Organic" - even though we followed even better practices than those defined by the "Certified Organic" program. The word Organic became reserved for big businesses and those who had the time and personnel to spend on learning the rules, ensuring they were followed and paying the fees. The fees are high enough that very small farms can't afford the cost - it would eat up all of their profits.

    Additionally, the organic practices defined in the standard leave quite a bit to be desired. The standards allow some bad things to get the Organic Certification while making it hard for small farmers who practice better standards to get the certification. The standards were not written to protect the consumer. They were not written to protect the small farmer who already farmed organically. The standard was created to make it so that big business could use the term so they could cut in on a lucritive market. It was a feel good political move for the politicians and a marketing move for big business.
     
  18. pcwerk

    pcwerk Well-Known Member Supporter

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    "Most of the dangerous pesticides are gone now. The politically correct impression that we are in grave danger from them lingers.[/QUOTE]"

    I think your a bit biased GoBug. And wrong. Dupont and Monsanto
    are constantly spinning out dangerous chemicals, and some of them
    are used as pesticides. (And with the corporate control of the EPA
    and their lack of funding, consumers are in grave danger indeed).
    Just a few months back I was reading an article about the known
    carcinogen Peroclorate(?) being sprayed on lettuce! It is an additive
    in JET FUEL!!
    Btw, I hope your jaundiced view doesn't lead you to take unnecessary
    risks at your job. I've heard that there is a very high cancer rate in
    exterminators.
    james
     
  19. rambler

    rambler Well-Known Member Supporter

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    As the organic market became a bigger fad and more profitable, it had it's share of cheaters. People sprayed all night, & sold 'organic' stuff all day..... Got to the point of the 'cheap meds' email spams we all get, need the FDA to ensure us a safe & useful drug supply.

    As with all govt programs, there are 2 sides to it. The Organic labeling requirements ensure a uniform product that consumers can count on. On the other side, the rules can create a hardship for some.

    So it is. The eternal battle of big brother vs the hucksters, with the consumer & the honest producer stuck in the middle.

    As to pesticides, Gobug has it right, if you look at what he said. Anything product used to get rid of bugs, weeds, fungus, etc. is a pesticide. if organic producers don't use pesticides, they don't have any produce worth selling. They just need to select from an approved list of pesticides, which is much shorter than the full body of pesticides. I guess it is natural for organic producers to want to protect their higher prices, but some of the claims are just silly - such as here. Pesticides are used by organic folks all the time. Get over it.

    --->Paul
     
  20. Marilyn in CO

    Marilyn in CO Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the website, Highlands. Yep, I did the CO thing for wheat for several years but when the inspector turned into a jerk and the rules tightened up so much, I quit. Also the price for the CO wheat didn't justify all the hassle. One year I did get $6.25 a bushel contracted but hasn't been that good since. We are doing 50 acres of sunflowers this year and they actually are organic just not certified. I was once so excited about the certification but now I won't touch it with a 10 ft. pole. I have too many other hassles on the farm I don't need that one. We do certified natural beef and have since 1993. That actually is much easier for us.