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Discussion Starter #1
Our President continues to give away the store while getting nothing in return. He continues to crush our economy. The Chinese government must be having a good laugh over this "agreement".
AP: “President Barack Obama announced Wednesday that the U.S. has set a new goal to reduce emissions of greenhouse gases by between 26 percent and 28 percent over the next 11 years as part of a climate change agreement with China. The new target is a drastic increase from earlier in Obama’s presidency, when he pledged to cut emissions by 17 percent by 2020. By contrast, Obama’s counterpart, Xi Jinping, did not pledge any reductions by a specific date, but rather set a target for China’s emissions to peak by 2030, or earlier if possible. Xi also pledged to increase the share of energy that China will derive from sources other than fossil fuels.”
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Wow we pledge to do something we would anyway And you think we gave away the store?
Yes, AmericanStand, I do see it as another giving away of the store.

1. He raised it from 17% to 26-28% by 2020...btw, without consulting with Congress. This will hurt our economy even more since many industries that have high carbon outputs will not be able to adjust to what will have to be drastic regulations in about 5 short years. Those that can't will either close or move overseas where regulations are, and will be, more lax. This will put more Americans out of work.

In addition, China which is one of the 2 worst carbon polluters on the earth (the other being India) is not pledging to cut at all....BUT is saying they will peak with their carbon emissions by 2030. So, we will cut by 26-28% while China doesn't "peak" until 10 years later.

It would be like us signing a treaty with Russia where we agree to cut our nuclear weapon arsenal by 26-28% by 2020, while they agree to "peak" their nuclear arsenal by 2030. Insane!

Are you getting the point? I'm not saying we shouldn't cut carbon emissions for the health of the planet in general, but it will make only a negligible difference in air quality and the so-called global warming scam if we do it while hugely populated countries like China and India keep increasing admissions, not to mention all the third world countries. This is not a way to negotiate.

Get used to "Made in China" on more products and goods, larger unemployment numbers, a continued devaluation of the dollar, and a further deterioration of our country.

Yes, he is giving away the store again, to the detriment of the American people.

Jim
 

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Jim, don't forget higher energy costs. Because there's no way he can make those numbers a reality without closing down most, if not all, of our coal-fired power plants. And unless I slept through it, we've not yet come up with something that replaces coal. So if you're lucky enough to have cheap energy now, don't take it for granted. When electricity rates triple or quadruple, which they will if he gets away with this, there goes the neighborhood. That'll be the death blow for companies and families.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Jim, don't forget higher energy costs. Because there's no way he can make those numbers a reality without closing down most, if not all, of our coal-fired power plants. And unless I slept through it, we've not yet come up with something that replaces coal. So if you're lucky enough to have cheap energy now, don't take it for granted. When electricity rates triple or quadruple, which they will if he gets away with this, there goes the neighborhood. That'll be the death blow for companies and families.
Good point happycat.
 

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Yes, AmericanStand, I do see it as another giving away of the store.

1. He raised it from 17% to 26-28% by 2020...btw, without consulting with Congress.
This will hurt our economy even more since many industries that have high carbon outputs
will not be able to adjust to what will have to be drastic regulations in about 5 short years.
Those that can't will either close or move overseas where regulations are, and will be, more lax.
This will put more Americans out of work.

In addition, China which is one of the 2 worst carbon polluters on the earth (the other being India) is not pledging to cut at all....
BUT is saying they will peak with their carbon emissions by 2030.
So, we will cut by 26-28% while China doesn't "peak" until 10 years later.

It would be like us signing a treaty with Russia where we agree to cut our nuclear weapon arsenal
by 26-28% by 2020, while they agree to "peak" their nuclear arsenal by 2030. Insane!

Are you getting the point? I'm not saying we shouldn't cut carbon emissions for the health of the planet in general,
but it will make only a negligible difference in air quality and the so-called global warming scam if we do it while hugely
populated countries like China and India keep increasing admissions, not to mention all the third world countries. This is not a way to negotiate.

Get used to "Made in China" on more products and goods, larger unemployment numbers,
a continued devaluation of the dollar, and a further deterioration of our country.

Yes, he is giving away the store again, to the detriment of the American people.

Jim
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except the part highlighted, underlined and enlarged above.

Math was never my forte, but shouldn't that figure be closer to 15 yrs?
 

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Why do we need to get anything in return for doing the right thing?
So you support subordinating Americans to China and other nations?

You think wages have stagnated?

You think we've lost jobs?

You think too many people rely on the goverment for support today?

You think taxes are high today?

You think fuel and utilities are expensive now?

You ain't seen nothing yet.

BTW - why do we have a political section if this section is used for political discussions?
 

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He's only trying to distroy the Country, no big deal.
I guess people don't remember what he said. He wants to get rid of coal companys/plants and his other words, electricity will nessassarly sky rocket.
Yea then in thirty year they will being figuring out a way to increase co2 because all the vegetation is dying by fining people that don't produce enough :facepalm:

It's a scam
 

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Discussion Starter #18
*****************
except the part highlighted, underlined and enlarged above.

Math was never my forte, but shouldn't that figure be closer to 15 yrs?
??? We're pledging to cut by 2020. China will peak by 2030. That's 10 years after.
 

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Why do we need to get anything in return for doing the right thing?
All depends on which side of the isle you sit on. If you believe the "man-made" global warming theory, I guess cutting, without the consequences involved when others won't, makes sense to you...with that mindset.

In my opinion, even if the so-called global warming caused by man had an ounce of truth, it does not warrant us cutting back while others go hog wild. We actually put out much less carbon emissions than China, India, and a good number of third world countries. Our cutting will be negligible on a global basis.

But, if you have researched yourself, read extensively and listened with an open mind to both sides of the argument, and understand how the climate of the earth has changed drastically many times without man in 4.5 billion years, then this is "doing the dumb thing". It will further fracture our economy while building the economies of others, some of which wouldn't main taking our spot as the pre-eminent world leaders.

Problem is so many people don't think for themselves today. They think based on the 10 second sound bite.
 

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This will create two major classes of people in America. The investor class, who benefits most from the global economy. The other class will be those dependent on goverment subsidy of some form. I guess maybe three classes if you want count the ruling class.

Maybe said better as; Those that eat cake and those that eat crumbs.

Or maybe you like this one better; Those that rule, and those that are ruled over.

If you think I am exaggerating or overstating the negative, do so at your own peril.
 
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