Minimum age to castrate bucklings to prevent blockages

Discussion in 'Goats' started by StockDogLovr, Sep 15, 2010.

  1. StockDogLovr

    StockDogLovr Well-Known Member

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    We almost had the 5 mo old buckling done yesterday by Burdizzo! I had given him the Banamine and the owner was ready to go, but then her smart-*ss 14 year old kid said no, the vet said he has to be 6 mo old to prevent the possibility of urinary blockages! Nevermind that they own three wethers that were done by banding practically after birth and have never had problems with stones! But thanks to the vet, who then wants $160 for surgical castration, 6 mo it is! Wasted my Banamine!

    Has anyone had problems with blockages in their wethered bucklings who were done at 2 mo or younger? She's got another 2 mo old buckling who also needs to be done.

    TIA
     
  2. mekasmom

    mekasmom Well-Known Member Supporter

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  3. praieri winds

    praieri winds Well-Known Member

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    we always band asap after birth have not had any problems
     
  4. CaliannG

    CaliannG She who waits.... Supporter

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    Blockages from using a burdizzo before 6 months? What kind of nonsense is that? Most people either band, burdizzo, however they are going to do it, at around 2 weeks or so. Some people do it as soon after birth as possible, and other wait until a couple months old.

    But I have never heard of having to wait until they are six months old!
     
  5. Backfourty,MI.

    Backfourty,MI. Katie Supporter

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    I had an intact male(Buck) get UC but never a wether & I band usually around 4 weeks old.
     
  6. Creamers

    Creamers Lucas Farm & WV Raw Milk

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    It is true that the sooner you band, the more chance of UC.

    "Prevention

    As is the case with many health problems, prevention of this condition is much easier and more effective than attempts at treatment [...]:

    1. Delay castration of young lambs/kids as long as possible.'"

    http://uvalde.tamu.edu/staff/Machen7.htm

    Which, you can find that same info anywhere on the subject.

    The urethra hasn't finished growing and will be smaller the sooner you band.
     
  7. Cannon_Farms

    Cannon_Farms Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There have been many studies done that have shown it makes no difference, Vicky normally has the link so maybe you can find it on dairy goat info. They did a control group and butchered them at a year and there was no difference in the size of the urethra from the ones done at a week than the ones done at several months of age.
    Diet is more to blame and concern than age
     
  8. Backfourty,MI.

    Backfourty,MI. Katie Supporter

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    I agree with Cannon Farms. I don't believe that age of banding or castration has much to do with UC. I believe it has to do with their diet, your water can also have something to do with it & also the chemistry make up of the male goat.
    Just in my experience.
     
  9. KimM

    KimM Student of goatology.

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    I've actually seen and heard about more intact bucks having UC issues that wethers. Personally, I band at 8-10 weeks old. MY reason for waiting as long as I do is that it takes little guys some time before they can extend the penis out from the sheath and IF they should ever come down with UC, at least then it would be easier to snip the pizzle.
     
  10. Alice In TX/MO

    Alice In TX/MO More dharma, less drama. Supporter

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    Lost a buck to UC. It's diet, not urethra size. You MUST balance the feed correctly for bucks.
     
  11. Creamers

    Creamers Lucas Farm & WV Raw Milk

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    Because diet causes the problem, it does not mean that urethra size is not causing the diet to be an issue. I've never had a buck come up with UC; however, I always do a top dress of AC.

    I would be curious to read the studies about banding age having no effect on incidents of UC. Makes it easier to decide when to band if they are compelling.
     
  12. Tallabred

    Tallabred Cathy Supporter

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    My vet told me I should have waited until 10 months! Of course my vet charges $36 for a fecal and $70 for disbudding - I can't imagine what he would charge for castrating at 10 months.
     
  13. Backfourty,MI.

    Backfourty,MI. Katie Supporter

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    I have never heard of waiting until 10 months to castrate.
    I would check with Susanne here. She had an intact buck get UC & I believe he was over a year old. She is a fickler on her diet, has beautiful, registered nubians. Her buck was in U of M hospital for 2 weeks, had surgery where they re-routed his urinary tract & she still has the buck. It cost her alot of money though.

    I don't think it's so much the urethra not developing as it is all the curves & the way the actual urinary tract is all coiled around inside there bodies.
     
  14. StockDogLovr

    StockDogLovr Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, everyone - I'll pass this on to my friend, pretty compelling arguments FOR earlier castration! I'm not a goat owner, myself - I have sheep - but I'm intrigued by this spraying the bucks do! It would seem that their penis has some kind of special apparatus that allows them to produce this fine spray, and might that be the problem with the blockages?
     
  15. Backfourty,MI.

    Backfourty,MI. Katie Supporter

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    It's called a pizzle & it's at the end of there penis, & yes the hole is very tiny & stones can get lodged in the end. If you ever have a male goat get UC the best thing to do is have the pizzle cut off by the vet or yourself if you can do it & give them Ammonium Chloride in water as a drench! It's not fun but if you don't you may as well put them down because they will die a terrible death otherwise.
     
  16. StockDogLovr

    StockDogLovr Well-Known Member

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    Okay, so I did some online hunting for the evidence that early castration does NOT effect urethra size, and could not find it. However, all that I read said it's not the small urethra size from early castration that causes the blockages, but the out of whack Ca:p ratio from too high a concentrate diet (grain, etc.). So, such a diet can also cause blockages in intact males. If the diet is right, then the early castration isn't a problem. AND, earlier is better from a welfare standpoint.

    Hopefully this will be good enough for my friend and her son. Thanks, stupid vet, for saying don't do it earlier than 6 mo, without educating them about the role of diet in UC!

    Thanks, everyone!
     
  17. CaliannG

    CaliannG She who waits.... Supporter

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    Ca:p ratio should be 1.5-2:1 Grain is anywhere from 1:2, to some forms being 1:17!

    You can see why several of us will say, "Please, please, PLEASE don't feed your buck or wether grain! Just don't do it! Hay, browse, and if you are feeling VERY into spoiling, alfalfa pellets, but not grain!"
     
  18. Minelson

    Minelson Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if someone is confusing goats and dogs/cats. 6 months is the usual time to do a dog/cat.
     
  19. andiplus8

    andiplus8 Well-Known Member

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    We band at 2 weeks. If I tried to do anything to our 5 month old bucklings out there it would have to be surgical. They are HUGE! I can't imagine waiting that long then trying to castrate, band, or whatever. Poor goaties! LOL
    We have never had a problem with urinary calculi here. Not in bucks or wethers.
    Sorry about the problem though. Some ppl's children.......
    Andi in OK