lumpy jaw

Discussion in 'Goats' started by mary,tx, Mar 16, 2008.

  1. mary,tx

    mary,tx Well-Known Member Supporter

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    This morning I was admiring the udder on one of my young two year olds, then to my horror I noticed something else--a big lump on her left jaw. I felt it and it is firm.

    A couple of years ago I saw this in another goat and took her to the vet. Lumpy jaw, he said, and put her down. :cry:

    I believed from what I read that it could have been caused by something stickery getting stuck in her jaw. We, sadly, have a lot of stickery things in the field.

    Before I take this goat in, y'all please give me some advice. What would you do?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. sungirl

    sungirl Well-Known Member

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    Get her tested for CL and move her to a pen atleast 100 feet away from the others. CL isn't something to mess with. It could be she just pricked herself.
     

  3. Alice In TX/MO

    Alice In TX/MO More dharma, less drama. Supporter

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    From the Fiasco Farm Website:

    * Milk Neck - If the swelling is soft, is located on the chin/throat, right where the chin and throat meet, and the goat is a kid. It is probably Milk Neck. The size of the swelling varies greatly, from barely noticeable, to quire large. It is soft. It is not a hard lump.
    * Bottle Jaw - If the swelling is further up on the chin, on the jaw, this could be "bottle jaw" which is a sign of severe parasite infestation. It is soft. It is not a hard lump. The goat needs to be wormed with a chemical wormer ASAP. If not treated right away, death could result. This usually happens in adults goats, not kids.
    * CL - If it is a hard lump, usually about the size of a quarter, and is located in the area of a lymph glad, it could be CL (Caseous Lymphadenitis) and you should consider having it looked at by a vet.
    * Vaccination Abscess - If it is a hard lump and is near a site that recently was the site of a vaccination injection, it could be a vaccination abscess- reaction to the injection. When we used to vaccinate, we had goats get abscesses at the injection site all the time. The bump will go away eventually, but may take up to a year to do so. It also may (or may not) come to a head and burst, but it is not contagious.
    * Insect Sting. - If it is a small hard lump, it could be the result of an insect sting.
     
  4. yarrow

    yarrow Ages Ago Acres Nubians Supporter

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    ... maybe a salivary cyst?
    susie, mo ozarks
     
  5. MisFitFarm

    MisFitFarm Where we all fit in!

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    I'm no expert, but I don't think it's Cl, I could be wrong though. Some people we knew had CL on their place, and I don't remember it looking like that. That looks like it's in the wrong place. Maybe it's a splinter or salivary cyst like Yarrow suggested. Good luck! Take your time and explore all options before you have her put down, she's a beauty.
     
  6. Alice In TX/MO

    Alice In TX/MO More dharma, less drama. Supporter

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    I'd get a fecal test run to find out about her worm load.
     
  7. KimM

    KimM Student of goatology.

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    If she were mine, I'd take her in and have a blood test done. Then I'd have the vet take a good look inside her mouth. Could be a tooth problem or a thorn embedded in there or like someone else said, a salivary gland issue.
     
  8. susanne

    susanne Nubian dairy goat breeder

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    what does that has to do with the abscess on her cheek?

    bottle jaw is soft tissue and would be evenly on both sides.
    i agree, it could be a splinter or an abscessed tooth. i would test her for cl.
     
  9. wooly1s

    wooly1s Well-Known Member

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    We had a llama with a similar lump (hard). Our was a bone infection of some sort, and when the neighbor's llama had it, it was a tooth abcess. We used antibiotics, theirs was drained and cleansed.

    Sometimes we need a veterinary opinion, even if it is the worst news:( , to ensure the health of the rest of the herd...hope yours is something easily treated.
     
  10. yarrow

    yarrow Ages Ago Acres Nubians Supporter

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    as low as it is on her jaw, I too was wondering about a tooth root abcess... sure hope it's not CL. she looks like a lovely you lady.
    susie, mo ozarks
     
  11. Alice In TX/MO

    Alice In TX/MO More dharma, less drama. Supporter

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    Bottle jaw is a symptom of severe worm load, according to the Fiasco Farm website, as well as numerous other websites on goats.

    Do a search on "bottle jaw goats" and see what you find.

    Here's a website with pictures and short explanation:
    http://www.barnonemeatgoats.com/wormsorno.html

    From www.sheepandgoat.com
    The parasites that cause the most damage to sheep and goats are stomach worms and coccidia. Stomach worms can cause substantial death loss in sheep and goats, if left unchecked. The barber pole worm (Haemonchus contortis) is the stomach worm of primary concern. It is a microscopic, blood-sucking parasite that pierces the lining of the abomasum (the ruminant's "true" stomach) and causes blood and protein loss and anemia, as evidenced by pale mucous membranes (lower eye lid, gums, etc.) and/or "bottle jaw," an accumulation of fluid under the jaw.

    From www.goatworld.com
    Bottle Jaw (often mis-spelled as "bottlejaw") is characterized by a hardened swelling beneath the jaw (as seen in pictures above) and is most often caused by worms or liver flukes. It can also be seen when a goat is weak or becoming ill. This can be a symptom of a goat that is sick or is becoming sick. Quite often, worming will cure this condition but one should also consider other herd health management techniques as found in the Goats & Health section and the Worms & Parasites section. A typical treatment plan includes the use of vitamin B12 injections and/or the administration of a product called Red Cell® as well as worming the goat.

    From dairygoatinfo.com
    In my experience, this sudden appearance of anemia and weakness with either normal, or subnormal, temp (and sometimes swelling under the jaw as well) is classic when a goat's system is severely parasitized by Liver fluke. It commonly shows up in young ruminants exposed to pastures containing wet areas, and it's not unusual for kids and lambs affected with it to die so fast they hardly have time to be sick.¹
     
  12. looneytunes

    looneytunes Member

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    Bottle jaw usually starts at the back of the mouth the lower jaw and runs into the neck line.Most of the time it will be smaller in the morning then grow during the day , due to the goats eating with their heads down,its not hard either until it gets full at days end. If you can get the goat by herself somewhere and watch this spot ,watch for hair around the area falling off,if you can do this next step you may want to try this. Take a hoddy knife an make a cut it to the lump , see if you can get anything out of this lump,it may look like toothpaste if it comes out.Make sure you are got on rubber gloves when you do this that you can throw away.Also keeep this areas clean if you try this.As I always tell people at the end of my posting I am no vet. so you my want to contact a new vet. before taking any advice off the web. Good Luck!
     
  13. Loda Farm

    Loda Farm Well-Known Member

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    It does not look like CL to me either. The Cl lumps I have seen have been right under their ears. One of my goats had a smaller size lump in the same place as yours. I freaked out, and called vet. Turns out she was saving her cud for later in her cheek. I started calling her hamster mouth. LOL

    Laura
     
  14. susanne

    susanne Nubian dairy goat breeder

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    rose bottle jaw is not a firm abscess like this one. bottle jaw is squishy feeling, like a soft filled ball and contributed evenly around the neck.
     
  15. wooly1s

    wooly1s Well-Known Member

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    I must respectfully disagree! I would not recommend lancing the lump unless you have a veterinary opinion. On the outside chance it is CL - and not a tooth or bone abcess as we are hoping, you will infect your farm and soil for years!!! How much is the doe worth to you, and how much is continuing to keep ruminants on the farm worth?
    Sometimes a vet bill can seem unbearable for one animal, but if it protects the livelihood of the herd and farm, it is worth the investment. An abcess on a a goat's jaw is a good thing to check.
    I could be wrong, but this does not look like bottle jaw to me from the one picture.
     
  16. Teacupliz

    Teacupliz Well-Known Member

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    I say a tooth abcess I have seen them in goats and cows- given its own time it will pop and drain away-
    It is not in the area of CL-
    If she is eating she should be fine-
    Liz
     
  17. xoxoGOATSxoxo

    xoxoGOATSxoxo when in doubt, mumble.

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    I had this just a few weeks ago. We got a vet out to lance it, but it was too late and popped on it's own. Luckily, it wasnt CL, the vet said. Not a tooth either. just a stick. Vet cleaned it, then prescribed 2 shot of antibiotic a day, plus washing with epsom salts. It' s completely gone now.

    So, I'd call a vet just in case, but not worry about it in the meantime. It's probably nothing.

    Hope she's ok!
     
  18. Lizza

    Lizza Well-Known Member Supporter

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    With our doe that we found a CL lump a few months ago, it didn't look like that at all, it was right under her ear, kind of down on her jaw (in her lymph nodes), but it still didn't look like that. I would vote for a tooth abscess, if we are voting. A decent goat vet should be able to tell you though (and test for CL of course).
     
  19. mary,tx

    mary,tx Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Thanks for all the opinions and advice. My problem, I guess, is that I went to the only livestock vet that I know of in the area with this exact problem in a goat a couple of years ago. He did no testing. He felt the lump, declared it to be "lumpy jaw" and put down the goat.

    How do y'all find good goat vets?

    Since I will most likely be going back to the same vet, what do I ask him to do? If he draws fluid, will that not cause it to leak and be problematic?

    I couldn't go in yesterday, and won't today because of the rain in the area, but will likely take her in tomorrow. I'm afraid the vet will declare the problem hopeless without ever finding out what the actual problem is.
     
  20. susanne

    susanne Nubian dairy goat breeder

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    if you go in with her, let him check our her teeth first. then let him draw blood for testing and wait for the result before next action ;).