[stranger]

not where i live, just cross the creek with a tractor and wagon, the DEC would be all over the place, testing the fish, the crayfish, the water for miles, anything to justify their job.

 

[Gary in ohio]

The classic IT depends most likley applies. How large a "creek" you talking about? Is it a creek, stream, drainage ditch? If a spring is feeding it and the spring is on your property, I am not sure the "creek" part will matter. DO you have the right to cap a spring? divert a spring? use it?

Local legal knowledge is your only real true answer

 

[baldylocks]

Hardly! Legal is what is allowed UNDER the law and no way what you can simply get by with.

The more I read these forums the more disappointed I am in my fellow homesteaders.

I agree! I think it is a good thing to do environmental impact studies and check what will happen if you mess with a stream. I think it is good to hold people accountable for the changes they make to the enviroment. Trying to skirt the law is ridiculous. Your impact may seem low to you but it may not be in the grand scheme of things. And what about the next person who wants to do "x-y-z" to the area? I am disappointed with some of the responses here. The OP was asking a legitimate question; not one to be answered with "just do it and hope you get away with it".

Back to the OP...find out what is legal. It varies by state and even locality. Do this the right way please.

 

[kjmatson]

I don't think you can, in fact where I live I can't even clear a tree out of the water after it has fallen for fear of disturbing the ecosystem in the water.

 

[meanwhile]

Thank you everyone for the tips and advice. It is good to have input from others to think about as we think this one over. Thank you.

 

[wy_white_wolf]

In Wyoming or any other state that I know of, NO. It would be a good way for your nieghbor to end up owning your place.

 

[jross]

What the heck, in true independent living style, I say redirect the creek as you see fit.

I would. See if the neighbor complains and deal with it when he or she does. It's always easier to ask for forgiveness than for permission.

Pete

I'd be real careful now that satellite imaging is so accurate. Stream encroachment is a serious charge, let alone any lawsuits that would come from the treehuggers who would take offense because you had the silly notion that you could do what you want with your own property with out their permission. And if they find one little snickel snail, heaven help you. And if they do not find that snail, they will put one there for you.

 

[kjmatson]

Seriously I would not do it, once the state steps in they will put more fines on you than you can get through in your lifetime. Talk to an environmental officer first and let him look at the stream, see what he has to say.

 

[Spinner]

If all the property owners that are involved agree, then I'd go for it. People have been doing it for centuries, then suddenly some old uncle decided he knows what's best for all of us. Sometimes you just gotta do what's right even if it's not what that old uncle thinks is best.

 

[BaronsMom]

You know - when you are visiting with the officials - ask them about alternatives. Maybe they have some cost-share programs that would benefit you in other ways without so much diverting the creek, but something you may not have thought of...can't hurt to ask.

 

[the mama]

In Florida, you can not divert or dam flowing water. Seasonal drainage ditches can be 'improved', but not filled in. Some @@@ss has filled in and sodded a major water drainage area, it is even down hill! So far no one has made him remove it, but wait until the first hurricaine and that sod will be across the road.

 

[big rockpile]

I'm thinking you have what I call my spring which I can do whatever I want with it.But it runs into a Creek which I can not even take gravel out of because of an Endangerd Fish.

big rockpile

 

[highlands]

Even if it is legal it is mighty unneighborly to remove water from their property.

 

[PyroDon]

is this for drinking water ?
Im curious . it seems you need a short tank .
For rain water storage swimming pools make decent low cost tanks .
an 18x4 ft round would hold roughly 5400 gallons a 12x3 roughly 1700
or a 15 x 3 easy set roughly 2500 they might be an option

 

[Mike in Ohio]

Have you ever heard the phrase "water wars"?

 

[OkieDavid]

Placement or removal of fill material (dumping stuff in or taking stuff out) from the waters of the US are regulated by section 404 of the Clean Water Act. Depending on the action and effect on the environment, some are easily permitted with a single letter and others are tied up in the courts for years. Personally, as I understand your question, I believe this is one where your proposed action will have a negative impact on your neighbor and falls into the "not so fast" category. Do some searching on Clean Water Act and you'll be reading for a while. Here is a short and sweet review of section 404 of the Clean Water Act.
http://www.usace.army.mil/cw/cecwo/reg/sec404.htm

 

[KindredSpirit]

This site might provide some info or contact info:

Riparian rights

North Carolina water law is based on the "riparian rights" concept, rather than appropriated water rights. (Appropriated water rights refer to the "first in time, first in right" allocation system used in the western United States.) According to this concept, a riparian owner is entitled to the natural flow of a stream running through or along his land in its accustomed channel, undiminished in quantity and unimpaired in quality, except as may be occasioned by reasonable use of the water by other like owners. Some types of water resource projects are subject to state or federal regulations that establish parameters and procedures to determine what is a "reasonable" use. If a water resource development is not subject to any of these regulations, then a water use dispute could be handled as a civil law matter between riparian owners.

http://www.ncwater.org/About_DWR/Water_Projects_Section/Instream_Flow/introduction.htm

 

[meanwhile]

Thanks everyone - a lot of good ideas and things to think about before we do anything. We have been given two numbers for this area and have one of those agencies plus the survey man coming back out on Friday (when my husband can be here).

PyroDon: good idea about the pool however there is not room for a pool at this area and even if there were, it would be too dangerous for the wild animals, or they would tear it up (wild boar / feral hogs / bear). But we do make use of a small pool at the top of the ridge and plan a second one. No, it is not for drinking, it is for gardens/orchards. Good idea about the pool.

BigRockPile: yes, it is a spring in one spot but the overflow from a creek joins it on our property, then it goes about 700 feet more to join the 3rd neighbors section of the creek, then back to ours. We are looking into tapping into our spring and see how much water is there. It could be it will be enough (and there is enough "head" from it to work with). to fill the tank.

highlands: Yes, it would be ver not nice to remove water if they put the water to use and I would never do that. They do not use this creek since they have a bolder creek and pond. In fact, they do not maintain the area and that is partly why we thought it was on "our" side. We certainly will not remove water that anyone uses. The neighbors further down DO use the water for cattle and horses and we have already talked with them about what impact if any would occur if we re-directly the creek. There would be little to no impact for us to fill the tank since it would fill in about 4 hours, then overflow go back in the creek.

We have the people coming back out on Friday and will keep everything in mind as we plan what to do. In another thread, we also were given plans for how to fix a 2nd set of tanks, and we just bought the parts to do that project. If that works, then the problem of water is 3/4 solved!

Thankyou.

 

[fantasymaker]

Im not sure iof you are saying the 2nd property owner wont help or will object those are much different things.
which is it?

 

[TedH71]

Meanwhile,

I'm drooling because you have feral hogs. My hog dogs and I would be having a blast but I digress. Here in Kansas, there are some creeks/rivers that have endangered fishes...I believe KS has the largest population of several different species of darters and shiners and in some parts of KS, they are only in one creek in the whole country so I would be careful and see what kind of fishes you have in your creek before I do anything.....