How much Thiamine?

Discussion in 'Goats' started by GoatsRus, Jan 24, 2005.

  1. GoatsRus

    GoatsRus TMESIS

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    I have a goat that has been sick for the last month. First I think with goal polio and then with maybe retained afterbirth. The vet did blood work and the white count was high but he didn't know exactly what was wrong with her. She's been on Genamycin, pen and now she's on baytril. The vet gave her dex which caused the abortions and I think resulted in the retained afterbirth. I've given her lutalyse to make her uterus contract and expell anything that may be left. My question being... since she's had so much antibiotic I know her vit b is probably low, but how much thiamine should she get (1/2 cc?) and how often? I'm also giving her probios powder mixed with gatorade.
     
  2. Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

    Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians Well-Known Member

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    The textbook dose of thiamine for polio is 10 mg/kg (100
    lbs is about 44.5 kg, so 445 mg thiamine at 100 mg/ml is about 4.5 cc of
    straight thiamine per 100 lbs of animal) IV to start, then repeat every
    6 hours (subsequent shots can be IM or SQ) for a day or so.

    The above is the textbook info, you can give all shots after the first intial shot subq. Give the first initial shot IM, unless your vet will IV it for you. I would continue giving her Thiamin until she is cudding on her own and is 100%.

    How was her red cell count when he checked her blood? Is she anemic, hence the reason she is not coming around? With all the trauma this last month I would be fecal testing her for worms, checking for anemia and having her on oral Albon for the opportunistic cocci when a goat is ill.

    With polio, you see a remarkable recovery with the above amounts of Thiamin given every 6 hours, you can use B complex without a vet script but make sure you are using enough of it, disregard the dosage and only treat with the B1. With the Dex and the Thiamin and she is not better, it is unlkely it was polio to begin with. Did you treat her with calcium? This could also explain the retained placenta and the high white blood cell count if she was aborted with her calcium low...hypocalcemia. Vicki
     

  3. GoatsRus

    GoatsRus TMESIS

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    Thanks Vicki - I knew I could count on you to provide the answer. We moved her into the garage yesterday since the weekend was quite cold. I don't know what her red count was as the vet said everything looked OK in his lab but when the blood was sent out, it came back with a raised white count. They checked her for worms and she was clean. She aborted because he had us giving her dex and she was doing much better before the abortion, so I'm hoping it's just an infection for retained placenta. I'll start giving her more thiamine (I believe my bottle is 500mg). I was just afraid of her getting to much, but now I can see that's not the case since I've only given her 1 cc for the last 2 days. What's the best way to get calcium into her?
     
  4. Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

    Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians Well-Known Member

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    CMPK...there is an oral liquid that you would use 60cc twice a day once improved go down to 30cc twice a day then 30cc once a day. If you HAVE to use the paste, than put the dosage, like 1/8th the tube into a blender with a small amount to make 60cc of gatoraide and then give it to her. The paste is very slow to swallow so is very caustic to their throat. Valleyvet.com has the liquid, as do some big feed stores.

    Then slowly start switching her diet. There is something going on that she is not absorbing the calcium carbonate and sulfate in her minerals and grain. Ours is because of our copper defficiency. So we give each of our goats alfalfa pellets everyday.

    Read Sue Reiths article on hypcalcemia, it explains dietary needs of calcium better than I can. My girls get about 3 pounds (after saying 2 pound a day for awhile a friend was over during feeding and said, that is not 2 pounds, so we took it in the house and weighed it, oooops! it's 3 pounds :) a day of alfalfa pellets. This and a good mineral mix is fine for dry does, once 100 days bred and on the milkstand milking they also have more calcium in their grain mix.

    Our keeping quality of the alfalfa hay we can get for mega bucks is way to poor to rely on it during this time of the year when the girls at 4 weeks from kidding, or for kids born in March who need all that calcium to grow. If you are not happy with the size of your dairy kids compared to someone elses, hands down if you are on top of cocci and worms on your place and it doesn't help, look to your calcium. Vicki
     
  5. GoatsRus

    GoatsRus TMESIS

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    Thanks, I'll look for the CMPK in the feedstore/co-op. If not found, I'll order the liquid.