help old pymy buck down

Discussion in 'Goats' started by furrflys, Dec 6, 2004.

  1. furrflys

    furrflys Member

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    i have 2 pygmy's, a 9 year old buck and a 6 year old doe. the buck was found in paddock lastweek down and emaciated he was "normal" 3-4 days ago. he has normal appetite and has been wormed, yet he is skin and bones and has soft stools and has pale mucus membranes, he also cannot stand without help up. He's not bloated and dosnt appear to be in pain. the doe that shares his paddock seems "normal" can anyone tell me whether this sounds like an illness or could it just be his age catching up with him. any info is good info thank you for yer time marilyn
     
  2. Milking Mom

    Milking Mom COTTON EYED DOES

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    What kind of food do you feed him? What was he wormed with and when?

    I had an old horse one time that started getting really skinny and I put some powdered FasTrak over his food and gave him a little red cell in it and it helped him.
     

  3. furrflys

    furrflys Member

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    he grazes on pasture and a little alfalpha and costal normally. since he's been sick we've been giving him alphalpha and minerals. he was wormed on dec. 3rd with safe-gaurd (fenbendazole)
    I will try the redcell thank you
     
  4. Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

    Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians Well-Known Member

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    Using safeguard will not worm a goat for the blood sucking worms we have here in Texas, well pretty much all of the south, hemoncous. Safeguard is fine for tapes, but really that's about it. It SAFE alright, safe for the goats and safe for the worms!

    Anemia takes a very long time to get over. A goat can look like they have lost a ton of weight quickly when they are dehydrated, and usually die from things like dehydration or pnemonia, when they are actually down orginally from anemia (from cocci or blood sucking worms). Vicki (think I am talking about this with you privately?)



    EDITED TO ADD:.................................................This post was just on Nubian Talk about something similar. The time and amount of nursing care it takes to get an animal back from the brink is why I will always preach prevention on lists like this. Vicki

    Subject: weak doe

    Often an initial dose of dex (if she is NOT pregnant) will be indicated
    to kick start the bone marrow to produce new RBC. For some reason some
    animals won't start making new RBC even when severly anemic and given the
    TLC needed to provide proper nutrition. This will NOT be evident until
    about +30 to +45 days AFTER your initial problems and goat ends up dead
    as a result of severe anemia. So, for good measure, when you can, give
    that initial dose of dex if doe is not pregnant.
    It takes 45 days from start to finish to get new RBC into blood stream.
    B vitmins are also very important (along with iron) to make new RBC and
    you have to inject it, as the rumen will render it useless to the goat if
    given orally.
    BEST would be if you have a healthy, closely related animal to get at
    least one blood transfusion as that is surest way to get her back to
    feeling better.
    You need to deworm every ten days for at least two more dewormings when
    you have a goat as overloaded as yours sounded. The L4 stage of the
    barberpole worm (haemonchus) will encyst in digestive tract wall and come
    out after that first deworming. They are NOT mature so are NOT laying
    eggs and won't show up on a fecal.
    Check everybody else in the herd- if you have one with problems you
    usually have several more on borderline to having problems. I have had
    them to be very slow to recover, too. Just TLC and time is all you can
    do for them.
     
  5. furrflys

    furrflys Member

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    thanks for the good advice, gives me a place to start. hopefully he's not too far gone.
     
  6. debitaber

    debitaber Well-Known Member

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    so what you are saying is to give a blood transfusion? well that idn't as easy as it might sound. where are you going to get the blood, and it is going to be mighty expensive.
    why not just deworm when you are supposed to .
     
  7. Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

    Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians Well-Known Member

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    why not just deworm when you are supposed to
    .....................

    That's a given, yet this time of the year there will be goats who go unwormed, worms that will encyst in the body of the goat and overwinter in the built of hay and shavings, and come spring right after kiddings we will have anemia and death on the boards. Then the kids get infected at birth, and you have dead kids or massive diarhea and small unthrifty goats by 3 weeks.

    Most folks don't fecal sample, they use the wrong dosage, they use the wrong wormer, and get horrible information from even their own vets. It was in some ways easier for us before the internet, you saw folks and their goats in person, you wouldn't glean information from someone who had horrid nasty animals, yet on the internet none of us know each other, yet you are taking information from them as gospel. There are even goat magazines and catalogs that give out goat medication information that we know is incorrect, yet is talked about as if it is gospel.

    In my beginnings of goats, it was actually quite common to keep wether kids around to be used as blood doners. We didn't have all the wonderful information about how to use wormers correctly.............. lots of us who injected Ivermectin, back when TBZ paste was around, and sheep oblets where used, with little to no success. Cocci was rampant and we didn't know how to control it or really even the cause, so transfusing became the topic of conversation at every goat meeting, it was pretty common practice back then.

    There will always be those who don't want to use chemical wormers or vaccinations, the problem is that by the time they do choose to do something it is nearly too late. I am not talking about this case. When you make decisions about the herd managment of your goats that includes not worming, you have to accept the loss you will have, which is unacceptable to me. Vicki
     
  8. debitaber

    debitaber Well-Known Member

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    you are so right on this one. I can't begin to think of having goats, and not worming them, or giving them vit's, or minerals. this is just crazy. I understand Vicki, that you don't give vitimans, but I have a very small herd, so for me, I can do it, for now, when Iget bigger, [herd size, I won't probably]. but there is no excuse for not worming, and loosing animals, or having sick animals, to the point of death. that is just plain cruel. IF you are going to have goats, then be responsable enough to take care of them .