? for you carpenters.

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by r.h. in okla., Jun 1, 2004.

  1. In my new used building that I'm buying, and putting in a bakery for my wife, there is no bathroom at all. So I'm in the process of installing stud walls and I need to frame a door in. Do I make the stud deminsions exactly 32" for a 32 inch door or do I need to make the door frame a little wider to allow for the thickness of the trim? Say maybe I make the stud opening 33". This would allow 1/2" trim on both sides. Any help would be very much appreciated. Thankyou, thankyou, thankyou. RH in Okla.
     
  2. agmantoo

    agmantoo agmantoo Supporter

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    For a 32 inch door (*2- 8* or 2' 8" in carpenter lingo) you will have to make the rough opening wider. The door, if prehung, will have a frame (jamb) around it. You have to allow for this frame thichness and you need to allow additional space so that you can get the door plumb in the opening. You will shim between the frame and the studs on the hinge side of the frame to get the door hanging plumb. Once it is hanging correctly you will then fit up the remainder, shimming that also and securing to the studs. I am unsure of the exact size of the rough opening for a 2'8" but it is somewhere near 34 and 1/2 inches.
     

  3. moopups

    moopups In Remembrance

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    Allways make the RO (rough opening) at least an inch and a half larger than the OUTER frame demensions of the door and jam to be installed. Fill in the space with shim shingles at at least 4 heights in the upward frame. Enter the shims, small ends together behind the jam verticals, match the inclines horizonally so that you have equal distances and support, plumb often to create exact distances, checked with a long vertical level for plumb. Once the verticals are established, finnish nails are installed through the jam, use a utility knife (box cutter) to score the shims, slap them with your hammer turned on edge. Trim the excess, install the jam materials, rehang the door, then install the trim if your door is not pre hung. There is a PM button if this is not clear.
     
  4. Jolly

    Jolly Well-Known Member

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    The only thing I can add to moopups discussion is that most home centers stock the pre-hung door, making it much easier to install. They usually have the rough dimensions stamped on their info sticker. (If not, you can always measure the durn thing, and allow shim room.)
     
  5. Blu3duk

    Blu3duk Well-Known Member

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    For what its worth, when getting doors delivered to the jobsite, most of the time when in doubt what i had coming, i would call the building supply and ask them the exact RO of each door, of course one time they gave me the wrong size and it was fun cutting 3 inches out of the log wall.... these were speacial order doors, generally kept at no extra cost for us at the building supply until we were ready to finish.

    One extra piece of advice .... nail or screw THROUGH the shim or you will "pull the jamb" and have it lleak a lot of air... not generally a problem indoors, but can be a major problem to an outside door. Caulk is not meant to cover more than a 1/4 inch gap.

    William
     
  6. bare

    bare Head Muderator

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    Will this bathroom be accessable to the public?

    If so, before you get too far down the road, you should reconsider.
     
  7. j.r. guerra in s. tx.

    j.r. guerra in s. tx. Well-Known Member

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    Bare has a good point r.h. - any restroom accessible to the public in Texas (I know you are in Oklahoma, correct?) is required to be handicapped accessible. Even a restroom for employees or even yourself has to comply - you leave yourself open for a lawsuit.

    This means that your door opening has to be a minimum of 32" clear, as well as have certain clearances so that a wheelchair bound person can operate them. I'll try and make the requirements concise, and you can check my 'math' with your state requirements: ;) :haha:

    12" clear from adjacent wall to door opening edge on push side (door swinging away from you). 18" clear from adjacent wall to door opening edge on pull side (door swinging toward you). The door controls should be handicapped accessible, meaning a lever which does not require grasping to operate. The force needed to operate cannot exceed 5 lbs).

    Depending on the layout, you will need at least 60" turning radius inside your restroom, the amount of clear floor space necessary for a wheelchair bound person to turn their wheelchair around. There is an alternate 't' space clearance if the circle is not workable.

    Grab bars next to the commode (capable of holding 250 psf - requires blocking with wall to attach them) should be located as follows: a 48" l. minimum side grab bar, located a maximum 12" from room / stall back corner. The 36" l. minimum rear grab bar should be located 6" maximum from room / stall back corner. The top of the seat of the commode should be 17" - 19" high above finish floor (they do manufacture seats which convert standard commode to become accessible). The toilet paper holder should be centered 17" - 19" above finish floor (a.f.f.), located no further than 12" beyond front of commode lip.

    The sink requires a 29" minimum knee height at apron front, and a maximum of 34" to top of apron. The mirror reflective surface (not frame) must be a minimum of 40" a.f.f.. The controls of your soap dispenser / slot for paper towel dispenser should not exceed 40" a.f.f. The valves / P trap below your sink should have protective sleeves which protect the shins / knees of wheelchair bound.

    Before you go any further, I would highly recommend you check your state handicapped accessiblity laws and ordinances. In Texas, they check your facility after a year after occupancy permit has been granted. Any violations found have 30 days to be repaired. After 30 day grace period, the fine is $1000 PER DAY until the situation is corrected!. Really cuts into profit, no?

    Better safe than sorry bud - I wish my news was better. Do a google search on Oklahoma ADA requirements - that should find quick references to some dimensional requirments.
     
  8. Yankee1

    Yankee1 Well-Known Member

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    34 1/2" RO for a 32" door
     
  9. j.r. guerra in s. tx.

    j.r. guerra in s. tx. Well-Known Member

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    Oops, reread my post above and noticed I stated a mistatement.

    Its not a 60" radius, it is a 60" [/B]diameter, or put another way, 30" radius. Sorry about that - hope it didn't cause a major snafu.
     
  10. Well we talked to our county health department and they said we could get by without being ADA since we are not in a major populated city. However we do not want to discriminate against anybody regardless of the circumstance so we are going to design the restroom with handicapp in mind. So therefor we have already built the bathroom big enough to accommadate handicapp people and we are putting in a 32" door. I just didn't know how much extra room we needed for rough in.
     
  11. bare

    bare Head Muderator

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    The reason I asked, is most handicap doors are 34 or even 36 inches. The reason being you need an actual 32 inches and with door stops you won't have that ''mimimum clearance, and making exceptions for the occasional larger person you'll need it. It really costs little at the planning stages to make room, but it does get pricy if you ever want to change things around.

    Edited to add: that you might particularly WANT to cater to those larger individuals, since it's going to be a bakery and all!
     
  12. nobrabbit

    nobrabbit Transplanted Tarheel

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    We just finished a major addition (kitchen, bath, and mudroom). Our bath has a 32" prehung door so we made the rough opening 34". According to all of our friends in the building industry, 2" wider than the door is pretty standard for rough openings. Even if it's just a doorway, the trim is usually 1" thick on either side, so it makes sense to me. Also, around here 36" seems to be the standard for handicap compliant doorways.
     
  13. j.r. guerra in s. tx.

    j.r. guerra in s. tx. Well-Known Member

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    Glad to hear problem is solved r.h. - only reason bare and I brought it up was we didn't want to see a friend get in hot water without their knowing about it. People are generally surprised to see how many stipulations / regulations come with dealing with handicapped building clearances.

    I hope your project goes up without a hitch. :)
     
  14. bethlaf

    bethlaf Homegrown Family

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    allow one inch added to each side of the door for the rough opeing, simple math !

    make sure that you make the bathroom safe and acessable, it would be more embarrassing to say, sorry you cant use the bathroom , because its not wheel chair accessible, or what i see an awfulll lot down herein branson "no public restroom" , which i understand , but i think is crude ....

    make sure you do a good installation , and finish it well, so if someone comes in and needs it , you can be ok with that !
    i personally as a mother have been known to here in branson , drop an entire cart of what i would have purchased because my child needed a potty , and the place listed "no public restrooms"
    the last was at a bookstore,i had about 150.00 in books selected when my 3 yo daughter had to go to the bathroom, after inquiring to the store worker, and then the manager, i was told under no circumstances did they have a restrom , and i could go to the citys public restrooms about a block away...
    i said , well if thats the way its gonna be , you have lost a sale , and i dropped the stack of books on the floor in front of the manager and left , and no , i didnt return

    so at least , it seems from what i read you have the right idea on making it a public accessible restroom, congrats on your considerations !
    Beth, Tri-Lakes Construction, Branson Mo.
     
  15. ajoys

    ajoys Well-Known Member

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    You are doing the right thing.

    No matter what the county person says (I bet he wouldn't put it in writiing) you can still get sued over it.