farm insurance woes argghhhh

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by lilsassafrass, Jun 16, 2005.

  1. lilsassafrass

    lilsassafrass Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    ohio
    I am so angry ..
    My long standing theory has further evidence that banks and insurance comapanies are the real movers and shakers behind world politics !!!!

    So , I had some changes to make in our farm policy ... we have been with this company for 20 years or so , we have recomended them highly to many people , who have then done buisness with tehm .. its a small mutual company , localy owned .. you know .. get teh buisness reports can attend the annual meeting if tou want , that sort of company ...

    because the changes I wanted to make were pretty major .. and we have since built new barn since tha last time and agent was out .. teh agent needed to come out and do a review .. it was a new agent that they had just hired with in the past 3 months .. I had mmy appoint ment set at 1 pm .. unfortuantly off farm work tied me up and I was half hour late .. he had been there and gone .. not bothering to call the alternate number where some one can be reached at all busness hours .. So called the compny as soon as i had gotten home to appologize and set a new appointment ....
    well seems there is a problem .. ohhh they will re ajust the policy and keep us as customers .. thats fine no problem there .. but as of right now and untill I get rid of him .. our policy is cancelled ... seems the agent saw ans even petted our mutt dog who needs to go in kennel when no one is home because I have never been able to break him of the habit of cocking his leg in the house when no one is there .. he also took pictures of him .. he went intop teh kennel to take pictures of him ...
    why are they dropping me until I show proof i no longer have the dog ..?
    well some where in his ancestry he has a breed with black and tan markings .. dobie , rotty .. coon hound ? some thing , though since he has black and tan markings he is considered a dangerouos breed .. (he is a heinze .. weighs forty pounds and will lick you to death )
    our companies underwriters have changed and the new ones have a whole list of breeds that they will not insure homes and farms where those breeds reside .. or if there are any charachteristics of those breeds.. and the black and tan markings our on that list !
    so I am to get rid of a family member or so thay want

    Sigh I tlaked yesterday to the nationwide agent who insures our store (commercial policy ).. you know farm bureau ... and explained to him the problem and was truthfull about it , as when inspection time came it would be evident anyway ..
    he is going to try to get the underwriters to make an exclusion if needed since he knows the dog .. but he thought I would prlooy run into the same problem with nationwide .. their underwritting policy has changed as well ..
    He told me there is a whole list of dogs that insurance companies are trying to eliminate .. totally in teh US the entire breeds .... I am sure the AKC is going to have a say ....
    With my mutual company I couldnt even buy a rider to include the dog .. there isnt one .. I am now unisured oficially till I destroy .. not find a new home , but destoy and have proof of .. he has never bitten anyone , I dont let him run loose ever .. since he wont stay home ... ( I did call the bank and have them put their high high premium insurance on teh house at least untill this isue is resolved)
    and all this occure becaue I was held up and missed appointment ... teh agent actually went into teh kennel to take pictures of the dog !!!!!
    I am furious !!!!!!!
    WEe have been with this comany for 20 years !!!!!!

    Paula
    Hyde Park farm !!!!
     
  2. Jen H

    Jen H Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately this is happening all over. I just got a notice with our annual renewal from Allstate that they will not insure properties with more than 3 dogs - period. Doesn't matter what breed, or what the dog is used for.

    One neighbor's State Farm policy was pulled when she (without thinking) told her agent that her Marrema's job was guarding the stock. To someone with no animal experience, that means an attack dog. The rest of us realize that unless we try to get in that pasture, the dog is totally not a problem.

    Good luck to you!
     

  3. fordson major

    fordson major construction and Garden b Supporter

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    i would contact the company about the unprofesional and some what(in my opinion) illeagal approach this new agent has> then ask for a list of their banned breeds. have your vet fill out papers stating this dog has none of these breeds and has a great disposition. hate when companies get high handed with good customers!
     
  4. Pony

    Pony Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Man, I am so with you!

    We have HAD it with insurance companies!! They act like they're out to protect you and your possessions, but all they're protecting is the increase of their bottom line.

    Bloodsucking bottom-feeding <fill in the blank>!!!!

    If IL didn't REQUIRE insurance, we'd be telling Farmer's to insert their policy into any strategically available orifice.

    ARRRRRRRGH!!! (tension breaker, had to be done)

    Pony!
     
  5. Wags

    Wags Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I own a couple of dogs that are on the "bad list". It is just another form of descrimination. Dosen't matter that they are certified therapy dogs - they are "bad dogs" that could turn on a person in a heart beat (but only to lick them to death!).

    There are a few insurance agencies that do not descriminate - although you have to watch individual agents who ignore corperate policey. State Farm and Farmers both will accept dogs of any breed - providing there are no bites on record.


    <img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v178/Wags374/Pitties.gif" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">
     
  6. fordson major

    fordson major construction and Garden b Supporter

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    we run a boarding kennel and the blood sucking pond scum wanted to jack the premium through the roof!! we have no idea what dog will be there boarding at any time so there could be a "bad" dog here at any time . never ever had a bad pit bull ,did have a lasa that bit mom though and a golden try and bite my father ,you have to judge a dog on a personal basis not a breed basis. we had german short haired pointers and was amaing how often people mistook them for "killer"dobes .after explaining to the new agent(old one had taken us for a ride)the details of our operation we were paying 1/3 for far more coverage!! the old agent we had to cover two ancient horses for some one leasing them!!they were pasture ornaments! however if they got on the road we were not covered !we now are covered for any animal at large(with 3-4 hundred fence busting sheep) and liability in the mill plus ,our new agent (acctually been with him 12 years now) has been way better!
     
  7. kathy H

    kathy H kathyh

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    What does your vet have it listed as? If the vet lists it as a coon hound mix or something like that then I would send a copy of it to insurance company.
     
  8. mzzlisa

    mzzlisa Well-Known Member

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    I have a serious problem with this. I would call the company and ask them if they have an exclusion rider to exclude the dog from being covered on the policy. If they say they don't have one then ask them if they have ever excluded a dog. If they say "no" then ask why they are excluding yours. If they say "yes" then tell them you want one of those. An insurance company can exclude anything they want. And you either take it or leave it. But don't tell me they can't. The company/agent is lying. And some agents don't know what all their company has as far as policy additions.
    Its very possible your particular agent had a bad experience with a rottweiler type dog, so every brown/black dog he sees is now dangerous. No excuse, but as there are millions of dogs in the United States, and insurance companies insure houses with those dogs, I would be doing some serious questioning.
     
  9. edcopp

    edcopp Well-Known Member

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    So which Mutual is it?
     
  10. Jack_IA

    Jack_IA Active Member

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    It seems to not matter.All insurance companies I have calle will not issue a policy for my rots at any price.Tho never a record of any bites ,loose or anything else.SF has tho I would hate to see the day when I loose the local agent.
    Not much you can do about it, As there is no law saying they have to cover.Definitely a racket and a scam.
     
  11. jack_c-ville

    jack_c-ville Well-Known Member

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    Virginia
    I'm a licensed agent (though I only work as a wholesale broker, doing business with retail agents) and I have to say that the whole thing sounds ridiculous.

    First of all, did they cancel you midterm or did they non-renew? In most states, an admitted company cannot cancel you midterm without 'a material change in the risk.' There's no change in the risk if you had the dog last policy term and you have the dog now. The dog did not attack anybody. If they were using sloppy underwriting in years past then that is their fault, not yours. So long as you did not lie to them on any of your applications (that is called a 'material misrepresentation' and would be grounds for cancellation).

    Even a non-renewal on this basis would be legally tricky for a company to get away with in many states. Especially when you can apparantly make a good case that this dog is not an example of any of the prohibited breeds.

    Depending on what the Commisioner of Insurance is like in your particular state, you'd have a good chance of getting coverage back if you call the Commission to file a formal complaint. Most companies will just gracefully bow and reinstate coverage rather than get into a debate over it with regulators. Basically, if you live in a 'red state' you are more likely out of luck because they tend to have regulations that favor large corporations (like those who I make good money doing business with, to be honest). Regulations in 'blue states' tend to favor the consumer (you) over the insurance company. I do a lot of business in both Maryland and Virginia. In my experience, Virginia will probably hang you out to dry and Maryland would force the company to reinstate coverage.

    Note that dachshunds have black and tan markings. It's not rational to call that a characteristic explusively found among breeds commonly bred for aggression.

    Bear in mind that most of what I'm saying only applies to a situation in which the company has already been insuring you. Companies have much more latitude in deciding what to get on in the first place than they do in deciding what to dump.

    By the way, no insuance company is trying to eliminate entire breeds from existence. The Nationwide agent has no clue what he is talking about (which is typical of 'captive' agents). Some companies don't want to bet their money on whether one of those dogs will bite somebody. It's their money and they have a right. If their calculations are wrong (and I think they are), then some of those companies will go back to insuring rottweillers and make money on it.

    If you can't get a reinstatement then go find a new agent. An INDEPENDENT agent. Not Nationwide, State Farm, Allstate or Farmers. All of those agents only have one company's products to sell and they are the laughing stock of the rest of the industry because they don't know anything about anything except their one company. An independant agent has relationships with a whole bunch of companies and will know that ABC company is not concerned about insuring dogs or that XYZ will write it with a surcharge. He's going to be able to solve your problem rather than just try to beg for a favor from underwriting that is never going to happen for an ordinary-sized account.

    Whatever you do, be as loyal to your dog as he is to you.

    -Jack_Cville
     
  12. mysticokra

    mysticokra Well-Known Member

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    Estillfork, Alabama
    Jack,

    Thanks for adding a pro's perspective on the matter.

    In cases where certain farm risks are problematic, can the owner sign a "waiver" on that exposure and get coverage on everything else?
     
  13. COUNTRY WISHES

    COUNTRY WISHES Well-Known Member

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    I find the whole "color/marking" thing to be quite strange. Pit Bulls are the most common breed to be mishandled and cause harm so should every dog that comes in every possible shade that these animals come in be barred by every insurance company.

    I guess since my skin is similar in color to Jeffrey Dahmer's and Timothy McVeigh's that I shouldn't be insurable either. You know us palefaces are always looking to harm someone. :no:
     
  14. ralphsmom

    ralphsmom Well-Known Member

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    Location:
    No. California
    A while back, I called AARP to check on their homeowner's insurance. The first thing they asked was if I had a dog and what kind. I said yes, a Pug, didn't mention the other 7 dogs. Anyway, I was turned down because I didn't have central heat. Must be something new because I know of other people who have their insurance and don't have central heat. I wonder if they know that most people they insure in this area, even though they have central heat, heat with wood. They even sent me a form letter explaining that to keep costs down they will only insure homes with central heat. I know of a case where a family bought a home and went to an insurance company and was turned down because of income. They made enough to get a loan for a house but not to buy insurance. It's pretty bad when these insurance companies can pick and choose who they want for a client.
     
  15. caballoviejo

    caballoviejo Well-Known Member

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    Insurance is fast becoming a form of slavery.
     
  16. Quint

    Quint Well-Known Member

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    I know a guy in town who is constantly running afoul of his homeowners insurance company. He's been bit (pun intended) by the no pitbull policy, the no trampoline policy, the your yard is messy policy, the your house is in disrepair policy, the fence around the pool policy, the freezer on the unlocked back porch policy among others.
     
  17. lilsassafrass

    lilsassafrass Well-Known Member

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    ohio
    I was at teh end of term , I asked for teh review , dogs have never ever been an issue before , I have had a series of dogs over the past 20 years or so , all of them have been muts , and all have lived to a ripe old age here with me and my family on the farm with the fold of 40 or so highland cattle , various horses , geese goats and hogs .. I would be more afraid of the hogs biting someone ...
    I have never kept an aggressive dog ,there have been a few over the years that have been dropped off here that were aggressive in nature , I simply take care of the matter . I wouldnt pass on the problem to some one else ..

    The company we have been with is a locally owned, well central ohio mutual catering to farmers. I have never made a claim but have contacted them in different situations over the years to see if I was covered under certain situations ... drunk crashing through high tensile fence and not having enough to cover damages .. teen age son who was driving the farm truck that I had just bought and forgot to call and put on teh policy before i went on the fair cuirut and was one day out of the grce period for being covered ( they also had our farm vehical policies as well .. but that changed after that five years ago when we coulldnt get tehm to budge on thqt issue .. I inssuered on road vehicals with another company my choice .. they didnt drop me on that )
    but other than that .. and it was reasonable I have been very happy with them ...
    I must say .. that I am not always on time with my payment .. like many folks in this world ... farming isnt always as lucritive as many think .. but they have always gotten my money .. around 3,000 a year .. so i guess i have paid some ones salary over the years .... so what .. around 15 years x 3000 ... 45,000?
    would buy quite a few cows , feed , could have used that to pay off my morgage .. hmmmm...


    I know the agent .. (whom I had never met he was new) was irritated that I was late with my appointment .. but at the same time he didnt stop or call at the alternate number where some one could be reached .. and he had the number and he would have had to pass the store on his way back down to new franklin .. and the store wasnt 2 minutes from teh farm .. he was ****y with my husband when he called to reschedule about an hour later ... ( wish my old agent who we have dealt with all these years had come , but he had a promotion to ceo and doesnt do field work anymore .. sigh .. )
    So :
    As I talked to teh nation wide agent , I prolly wont go with tehm .. but I had to pay the buisness premium that same day .. I have found nationwide to be costly over the years ...
    I have a call in to another small farm mutual based in Burton ,
    I heartily dislike dealing with insurance companies if any sort but such is life ...

    Paula