End of a paradise.

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by cabe, May 23, 2005.

  1. cabe

    cabe Well-Known Member

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    This subject sounds morbid, but it is not quite as bad as I made it sound.Our distant neighbor that we never see, and that owns land beside me, but lives elsewhere , has begun logging operations on his land.Gone soon the giant Red oaks, White Oaks,and Poplars that grace part of our land with shade from the massive tops.The sun will come thru a little more, but thank God we kept a buffer zone from our property line of our own large trees should this ever happen. I hate it, but he is doing what many do when faced with high land taxes, and such.We heat with two wood stoves, and he did offer me the firewood from all the limbs. I like him, and it is his right, but to my old freinds the big trees I say ;" You have seen 5 generations of our family , and now you will be missed." Marty.
     
  2. primroselane

    primroselane Well-Known Member

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    I have little hope for a species that considers a tree to be a right and not a privilege.

    Every creature is better alive than dead, men and moose and pine trees, and he who understands it aright will rather preserve its life than destroy it.
    Henry David Thoreau
     

  3. antiquestuff

    antiquestuff Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, but if I had to choose btwn. losing my property to taxes and cutting some trees...I'd do some cutting. Still, not a nice thing to have to do...
     
  4. Melissa

    Melissa member

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    Our neighbor did this several years back and the first time Kadia walked in the woods with her Dad afterwards (she was about seven then) she cried... Sometimes they make such a mess of the woods, some don't, but many do. We are cutting some of our trees to make pasture, but we are leaving one section to never be cut as long as we own this land. I just want to watch it and see what happens, that will be good enough for me.
     
  5. thequeensblessing

    thequeensblessing Well-Known Member

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    I'm with antiquestuff here. It hurt to have to go in and pick and choose which trees lived and which died while we were clearing our property to build our home.
    But it was either that, or don't build there. We left some of the biggest, prettiest oaks and hickories around the house, but sadly, some big ones had to go. They didn't get wasted though, we milled them into lumber for our wainscotting and furniture. It's nice to have a little bit of those beautiful trees indoors now.
     
  6. Ravenlost

    Ravenlost Well-Known Member Supporter

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    That's so sad. I love trees, especially the grand old hardwoods.

    I do suggest that you keep an eye on the operations though and make sure the loggers don't cross the property line and cut some of your trees. My dad's neighbor had some trees cut and he showed the logger where the property line was and told them to stay on HIS side of the line. They didn't. They chose to cross onto my Dad's property to get a few choice trees I guess were just to good to pass up. Daddy and his neighbor were very upset and the logging company ended up paying dearly for trespassing and stealing.

    When we built our house I was very happy that it wasn't necessary to cut down any trees to do so. Then the stupid power company comes in and says they're going to have to cut a bunch of the trees. I met them out there and put my foot down. They ended up running the line were I said to run it, but still cut down three trees. The day I went out there and saw those trees lying on the ground I cried.

    In January we planted 33 acres in hardwoods...oaks, cypress, etc. These trees are not for harvest and will never be clear cut.
     
  7. Mike in Ohio

    Mike in Ohio Well-Known Member

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    Cabe, you don't specifically say if it is clear cutting or selective cutting.

    We are planting a minimum of 200-300 trees a year as we move into a forestry management plan for our woods. Just leaving the woods to themselves (unless it is a really large geographic area isn't the best thing to do. A lot of what you see in the U.S. isn't first growth/old forest anyways.

    I appreciate what you are saying though. When Columbia Gas came through and cut a 50 foot wide swath across the back of our place ( at the house, not the farm) DW just stood there and cried. That's one of the reasons we feel so strongly about easements.

    Mike
     
  8. Michael W. Smith

    Michael W. Smith Well-Known Member

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    Don't want to sound mean, but it is his propperty and he can do what he wants. All isn't bad though as once you get over the initial shock, as new growth starts growing, it will create more wildlife habitat - as new trees start growing, it will create browse for deer, old limbs and branches will create shelter for small animals.

    I do know what you are saying though. I had a 12 acre piece logged about 4 years ago. It was shocking once they were done. The land I could once go walking through was blocked by limbs and branches, nothing was even recognizable. However, the money was more than enough to pay off the loan. I did go through beforehand, and mark any really large trees that they were off limits. I figured if they had survived to live to grow as big as they were, I certainly wasn't going to kill them. I figured the "grandfather trees" had earned their keep to live.

    However, as it grows up now, wild fruits now grow since there isn't as much shade as there used to be. Little trees have now started growing, creating a lush browse to feed many deer. There is more dense cover now, and rabbits, grouse, turkey, etc. can walk around virtually undetected and hide if they need to.

    Besides, one never knows when a large wind storm may come up, or worse yet a tornado. If a tornado comes thorough, kiss all your trees goodbye, and you won't be able to sell them for logging after that happens - twisted, split pieces are left - maybe possible to salvage for firewood, MAYBE. I've seen what tornadoes do - and it is very close to clear cutting, except you don't get any money for it.
     
  9. sullen

    sullen Question Answerer

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    What is he going to replant with? Is he going to replant or just leave it? My place was clear cut 90 years ago and they trees there now are just junk. Yellow pine, and poplar. Not even any room for some nice mountain pine. If I could afford to take it all down and replant I would. The poplar has to go because I am afraid they will fall on someone or something. I would wonder what will your neighbor do with the land after....it may be a nightmare in 40 years.
     
  10. southerngurl

    southerngurl le person Supporter

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    If he has a responsible logger cut just the good sawlogs, it won't make a huge difference, and in a year or two, it will really look nice.
    Well, hate to break it to this guy, but nothing would be alive if nothing ever died. :rolleyes:
     
  11. VALENT

    VALENT Well-Known Member

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    yep, death is a part of life.
     
  12. big rockpile

    big rockpile If I need a Shelter

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    Should be great for the Wildlife!

    I know my place all around the house I had to cut every old tree because they were hollow because of fires.

    big rockpile
     
  13. Alice In TX/MO

    Alice In TX/MO More dharma, less drama. Supporter

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    I am looking into the possibility of purchasing 100 acres with an eye to timber MANAGEMENT. A friend with more acreage than that has the forest service come in and mark the trees that are ready to harvest. Then, you can let the younger ones grow, replant as desired, etc., and leave a legacy for your grandchildren as well as habitat for shorter lived creatures.
     
  14. GeorgeK

    GeorgeK Well-Known Member

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    for most property owners, cutting trees one year will not pay the taxes for the 30 to 100 years it takes to regrow the forest. If you are cutting trees for taxes, there will very soon be no trees


     
  15. big rockpile

    big rockpile If I need a Shelter

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    Around here if the Forest is managed right you can cut every 5 years.No need to replant because you will have new growth come in fast enough for no need of it.I replant only because I want different types of trees to help the Wildlife out better,give them more variety.

    On my place I put Stock on it so heavy that it is having a hard time to recoop.Worst thing around here the ground is not realy any good but for forest,Top soil is too thin and rocky.But every year you see people bring in a Dozrer push everything off,plant it in Fescue and put Cattle on it.

    big rockpile
     
  16. MTNwomanAR

    MTNwomanAR Well-Known Member

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    I feel for you cabe....as two of my neighbors have done this to their land last fall...and yes, I DO know that it is their land to do with as they please...but the really strange thing about it was, that they both used the same guy to log, and on the one place, he just left tops, but on the other, just one HUGE mess....trees all broken off, piles of GOOD wood[not straight or long enough I guess] and stumps in the pasture..... and HE was trying to tell ME once how we had to manage our places for the future...... :grump: I agree that woodlands can be managed, and wood cut off of it. If one didn't cut some trees, they would all most likely die, or at least be very stunted... the really sad thing about the ozarks, is that a bunch of the old oaks are literally being eaten from inside. You can't always tell if a tree is dead, til you cut it, or it falls over. The NFS has been warning folks not to camp under/around big older oak trees, for fear that the tree may fall on them.... I myself, would like to do some selective logging, just to kind of thin the trees out, to help the smaller, younger trees grow better....One of these days, maybe I can find me a good, reputable logger, that will let me cut my trees in a constructive way..... :)
     
  17. slimecoat

    slimecoat Member

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    I feel your dismay. Its not that bad. At least he is not selling his land to walmart or some greedy developers.
     
  18. cabe

    cabe Well-Known Member

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    I agree with most of you , and it sounds as if some of you have had same type situations.It is his right , and over the years he has slowly cleared off other places he owns, and sold them. I knew his father, he was a grand old gentlemen, always allowing us kids to hunt and roam on his land always preaching to us never to fish on it, he reserved this for himself. They together own one of the largest tracts of land around here , and it is all bounded by Gov. bear sanctuary. I like him and I respect his rights, as he has always respected mine. I am just sad to see some of the giants go away. The people that use the lumber will never quite love those trees with all the memories I have of them growing up and all , but you know the wood from the tops will warm my family for years to come. Me and my youngest girl went out there today and looked at what had been done, and we counted the rings of growth on some of the stumps.I got over a hundred years on the poplars and the oaks were even older.one tree was at least 3 ft. thick and the heart was mineral color black (poplar)they are selective cutting and have left several nice trees. All in all it is a good job so far, and I think it was good of the guy to let me know way ahead of time so my family could mentally prepare.Marty.
     
  19. southerngurl

    southerngurl le person Supporter

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    My dad :D I'm not at all partial, LOL

    Really, he has been logging for about as long as I have been alive, and he's darn good at it. He has a good reputation.