Dog food

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by Rob30, Feb 10, 2005.

  1. Rob30

    Rob30 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Hello
    I wrote a thread on dog droppings that was very popular.
    So I decided to submit a new one asking what everyone feeds their dogs?
    I feed a middle of the road dog food with supplimented meet and nuckle bones. However my doberman can not keep any wieght on. He looks like we are starving him. No worms. He has always looked like this. Except when we were feeding organ meet that we purchaced from the local butcher. But the organ meet makes the dogs stink.
    My parents always tell me they never bought dog food. Just fed leftovers etc. Even the chicken bones. Our dogs were healthy, happy, and long lived.
    Any ideas on an economical feed for dogs. I have an old blk lab, doberman, and great pry. The eat about 60lbs of food in 2 weeks.
    Rob
     
  2. rio002

    rio002 Well-Known Member

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    Hi Rob, We have 9 dogs of various breeds, ages and sizes--some of them are referred to as walking stomachs lol. We feed all of them (none are puppies) the same food--Kibbles and Chunks--it's a knock off of Kibbles and Bits, but we have dogs who will eat all the Kibbles and leave the chunks for the others :) Depending on which dog it is, some get raw eggs, some get vegetables but all get table scraps of meat but no bone unless it's a beef bone (fowl bones can splinter off in the dogs' stomach/intestines and cause awful problems). When I was younger Mom worked at a nursing home and was able to bring home all plates scrapings she could fit in the buckets and they ate that with dry dog food to help cut the bill. Dh works in a restaurant and on occasion he'll bring home a 5 gal. bucket of meats, scrapings etc. for the dogs and old biscuits for the chickens, that helps cut the food bill too. Back in the day when Mom and Dad raised and showed German Shepards they bought pallets of food (cheaper by the pallet) directly from Purina (they delivered back then) and would get the excess moon pies and treats (can't remember who the manufacturer is for those) etc. for the pigs too.
    If you have a buddy in a restaurant you could check with getting leftovers, we split the leftovers bi-weekly with another woman who also has dogs, chickens and potbellied pigs. I also have one of those "starved" looking dogs--Rio she is 1/2 blk lab and 1/2 whippet--she has this thing about watching you eat out of the corner of her eye and when you look at her she'll suck up her gut and pull in her cheeks to look even more pathetic lol she has fooled more guests into giving the poor starving dog a handout than I can count LOL
     

  3. HilltopDaisy

    HilltopDaisy Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Unless you've done multiple fecal exams yourself, you don't know how easy it is to miss worm casings/eggs under a microscope. I'd have him checked again-it's only $10, and I'd bet anything he's showing false negative results.
     
  4. jgbndaudio

    jgbndaudio Well-Known Member

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    Sometimes we home cook but when feeding kibble we use strictly Canidae or Wellness. These are not cheap options but our boxer/AMPBT mix was having a lot health problems when we first got him and were feeding him IAMS. Actually, come to think of it where we used to buy Canidae was cheaper than IAMS, but
    that's not true now that we moved.
     
  5. daffodil

    daffodil flower lover

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    My dog gets leftovers a lot too just because he seems to prefer them. We buy Ol Roy beef flavored canned dog food at Walmart. My dog likes it mixed with either bread crusts or cooked spaghetti. He doesn't like it plain--takes him too long to eat it plain.

    Also do use cheap dry food and poor over some veg. oil on it and then some hot water to make a gravy. I make sure he is really hungry or it will sit and get soggy. (seems to make his coat shiney)

    I guess my dog is kinda picky. I just think to myself, if I was a dog, would I want to eat the same thing all the time--i.e. dry boring food.

    It makes me happy and relieved to see him gobble something down.

    My MIL just cleaned out her freezer and gave us some freezer burnt meat, so he's been eating that. Only trouble is then when we go back to his regular routine, he is reluctant.

    Growing up on the farm, we would feed our dogs stale bread smeared with bacon grease. And leftovers. My folks never bought dog food.

    My dog has been caught eating some strange things--it's a wonder he is alive. You have to watch your socks around here.
     
  6. Little Quacker in OR

    Little Quacker in OR Well-Known Member

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    ***************************************

    :haha: I don't wonder that you have to watch your socks! That is a terrible diet for your dog! Poor thing!
    ******************************************
    :) When we talk about diet for our dogs it gets really complicated. That is because each of us looks at our dogs differently and we each catagorize them in varying ways as to where they fit into our lives and just how much we want(or can)do for them. Some of us want the very best for our canine friends(and I don't mean what is percieved as good, but is, indeed, healthy) , some are more casual about this...some just don't care as long as it keeps the dog "happy"and alive(See the above post). I think most of us are sorta in between here. We don't want to starve our dogs but we don't go to any great lengths to really research what the average dog needs in the way of nutrition.

    There is absolutely no doubt that there are many grades and qualities of dog foods available to us. If you go online and look up the most popular commercial dog foods you will readily see that most of them are just junk and used by the companies that make them as garbage bins for whatever they have leftover from their "real" business, whether it's cosmetics or frozen foods etc. Will these feeds keep our dogs alive...yes, at least if the dog already has a good inherited immune system and has inherited the genes for good dentition and is not prone to other health problems.

    There are many people who have researched this topic and revolted by what's in the usual commercial diets have gone to the BARF alternative preferring to get the meats themselves, mix in the appropriate veggies, vitamins and minerals and their dogs do well on this when it is well researched. It's a whole lot of work but these are people who put their dogs wellfare and health way up at the top of the list in their daily lives.

    Some of us take our dogs health and thus their diet very seriously, but we don't want to go the BARF diet for whatever reason. We have healthy alternatives out there that, with some research, will give us a healthy diet for our dogs.

    Myself, I like the "California Natural" route for one of my cattle dogs. She is prone to be really aggressive with other dogs and research has shown that you can help these tendancies(inappropriate aggressivness) by limiting some proteins/enzymes in their diet that are found in many popular feeds. The other dog has been on a very low fat diet for years as he has been prone to pancreatitis.

    So, it depends on the dog you have, their health as to what you feed them and on just how much you want to research into the whole thing, how much time and trouble you wish to go through and on what you can afford.

    LQ
     
  7. sancraft

    sancraft Well-Known Member

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    I feed Pro Plan. I don't skimp on dog food with my dogs. You are what you eat. I find my animals much healthier on the premium foods than they were in the past when I fed cheaper foods. My Shepherd only eats ProPlan, but my poodles likes Iams. None of them would eat Eukanuba. My cats didn't like it either.
     
  8. daffodil

    daffodil flower lover

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    Actually there is quite a bit of controversy regarding BARF. Type in BARF fad on you computer and you can read some cautions on feeding raw food. I may feed leftovers--but it is cooked meat. Cats and dogs are living much longer lives due to the commercial dog and cat foods available today. As far as I have researched all the foods on the shelves such as Ol Roy are safe for dogs and have been tested, which is not so with the experimental BARF diet.
     
  9. jgbndaudio

    jgbndaudio Well-Known Member

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    I'd rather have a dog food that was considered good for my dog than safe for my dog to eat.

    Scotty
     
  10. Maura

    Maura Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I feed BARF. I think it is the best way to feed your dog. I realize that it is not in everybody's lifestyle to handle raw meat. If I didn't feed BARF I'd feed a food that had no BHA or BHT in it. That eliminates any grocery store brand. It would have to have no artificial flavors or preservatives or sweeteners or colors. The Whole Dog Journal tests dog food, a good place to start deciding. I suppose I'd have to try Wysong as it is madein my homestate.
     
  11. lonelyfarmgirl

    lonelyfarmgirl Well-Known Member Supporter

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    excuse me in advance for ranting, but if there is anything I consider myself a selfmade knowitall on, its dogfood, and performance dogs. I am shocked at the people on here who feed the worst dog food on the market, and add all kinds of junk to it to make up for it. Read the ingredients!. Old Roy dry, Purina, kibbles and anything, are nothing but ground yellow stock quality corn, and ground bone and soybean meal, and ash. :no: There are alot of decent midpriced foods out there that will suit most dogs just fine, but these aint it!

    Thumbs up to the canidae and california natural users, allthough those to are on the super expensize end of the spectrum. Canidae did wonders for my growing Great Dane, but my APBT's were skin and bones. Not enough fat.

    For the person with the doberman, you never said what you did feed, but I suggest this. First of all, Hookworm and whipworm dont always show up in vet fecals. Forget the vet.Never worm with the same wormer more than twice in a row. The worms become immune.
    Let me tell a story. Had a nice APBT female dog that I bought at 3yrs. old. Kinda skinny, but ok. Fed her 8cups a day of a decent food for 2 yrs and was never able to get the weight up(she was very active). I had wormed her bimonthly the whole time with Ivomec and strongid. Well, and old hunting dogman told me about the worm immunity one day. So I went to the feed store and bought a bottle of NEMEX2 for round and hookworm. Double dosed her, and again 10 days later. She gained 5 pounds in 3 days.
    So to the Doberman person. Get a different wormer. Use the Nemex2 if you havent tried it, and double dose the dog, single dose in 10 days. Put him on a high fat, low protien food. Try Diamond sporting dog mix. Dark maroon bag. Its 24%protien, 20%fat. But dont use it for the old lab or the pyr. Put them on a senior diet for the lab, and if the pry. is active, a 26/18 for him.
    If the dobe has any skin issues at all, give him a can of pink salmon once a week, because the diamond sporting doesnt have any omegas in it.

    for those of you that dont know, unless you have a working dog thats puts in at least 6hrs a day of hard physical work, dont use a 30% protien. you'll burn out the kidneys.

    A barf diet is a great way to go, if you know what your doing. If you dont, you could be hurting your dog in the long run, by lack of nutrients.



    So here goes: fyi a list of foods that are good and bad.
    Good - expensive
    canidae, california natural, wellness, biljac(mix with something), nutromax, blackwood(only for real working dogs like itidarod trainers for example)

    good, or ok - midpriced for most people
    sportsmix, diamond, prism(eagle pack in a different bag), pro plan, Sams club has a good food, cant think of the name

    there are other brands Im not thinking of, but these are some common ones. I personally did not like the results I have got in the past with Iams or Eukanuba (same company), but I do know a lady who is a senior research chemist at Iams in Ohio. She claims they are on the cutting edge of dog nutrition, and have an entire facility full of dogs and cats used exclusively to test their food. Their cat food is wonderful.

    OK now for the NEVER list:
    Kibbles and bits/chunks, purina, pedigree, ol roy,science diet (dry), dollar store brand, dads, paws and bones, hound dawg, gravy train, most grocery store brands, nutri-cal, all this stuff is junk.

    Ok sorry, Im done for now.
     
  12. DayBird

    DayBird Big Bird

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    Why is Science Diet on the never list?

    What do you suggest mixing with BilJac? Why do you need to mix anything with it?

    What about Nutro Natural Choice?

    What about Nature's Recipe?
     
  13. rio002

    rio002 Well-Known Member

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    LOL ok ok enough already.. did anyone hear/read themselves lately--the barf diet, what is that for bulimic dogs? Feed them raw meat so they can barf it up on the floor?? LOL

    Alright got that out of my system, now can someone actually give the long version of the BARF diet--never heard of it, not that I could afford to feed the dogs all meat as we are often meat poor for ourselves come dinner time. But the idea is interesting if it is based on the idea of what would the wild dog eat, but is that balanced with the realistic plan that the domestic dog doesn't have to expend the energy to "hunt" it's food nowadays? Just like the reason most people are pudgy is because we have never had to track and kill that pint of Ben & Jerrys' prior to devouring it..........just curious.
     
  14. kppop

    kppop Well-Known Member

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    Here are some useful links to help with Understanding Commercial Dog Foods and their ingredients:

    http://www.api4animals.org/79.htm

    http://www.doberdogs.com/foodcht2.html

    If ppl took the time read the dog food labels, like they do their own food labels, they'd realize that they are feeding their dogs nothing but junk.

    Most health problems that dogs have are food related. Of course there are some that are due to faulty breeding (back yard breeders who just have to have a pup from Fiffy and Fido..just because they are sooooo sweeeet) and genetics but that's another thread. :)


    Kppop
     
  15. creeklady2000

    creeklady2000 Well-Known Member

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    I agree that most dog food is junk the cheepo stuff that is however how do you propose to feed 16 dogs on adog food that runs 16 to 20 dollars abag at 10 bags amonth and dont give me that they will eat less garbage yes they might need less but if I fed my dogs only 3 cups of the good stuff a day they woudl chew there house down from being hungry I know as I tried it and I almost went bank rupt doing it when I rescue dogs I feed a food by tradition it is 10 to 12 a bag and itis what I can afford my dogs live long lives and they are helathly and wormed and vaccinated but I am on avery limited budget no way can I pay for the good stuff and ya I coudl get rid of my dogs but I also know that here they are loved and fed and considering in the old days they never even bought dog food , I think the cheep stuff is just fine when you supplement with rice and meat like I do and I can affored it that way
     
  16. daffodil

    daffodil flower lover

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    BARF :haha: Does kinda have an awful connotation!

    I think the commercial dry dog food is really more of a convenience for people rather than dogs. I agree it's not the best and that is why I give my dog a lot of cooked meat that I eat myself along with cooked starches and some vegetables. And I get the canned beef dog food. I feed a variety.

    I would be cautious about raw as it could carry salmonella and such things that really could be a problem.

    One thing no one has mentioned is that the dry food really expands once it's wet. It gets about three times it's size and I did read one fellow's experience of that being hard for his dog to digest. All dogs may not be affected by this. I picked this up in a dog book at the library. I'll have to check it out again.

    I do give my dog raw carrots to chew on for his teeth as he does get a lot of soft foods.

    What about rawhide? I've heard that is not good? Any opinions?
     
  17. kppop

    kppop Well-Known Member

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    *******

    Diamond brand dog food is good food..not the top of the line but a good food. It's $20 for a 40 lbs bag. Costo carries Kirkland that is also made by Diamond..again another reasonably priced food.

    Go to those websites I posted and compare the daily feed amounts of the different foods.

    My dh's family raised many dogs without the aid of commerical dog food. So yes it can be done. Now it's BARF, back then it was called feeding the dog. :)
     
  18. GoldenMom

    GoldenMom Well-Known Member

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    Maybe some people call throwing the dog scraps BARF, but that's not how really how it's meant to be done! I feed my two goldens a specific BARF "ration." They each get approx. 60% RAW meat and bones, approx. 20% GROUND RAW vegetables and fruit, approx. 13% organ meat, about 3.5% eggs (shells included), and about 3.5 % yogurt. I also supplement with alfalfa powder, kelp powder, salmon oil, and Vitamins C, E, and B.

    Like has been said before, commercial food is for the owner's convience. I spend about 4 hours once every 4 weeks preparing and freezing meals for my dogs. I make a mix of the veggies, organ meat, yogurt, eggs, and vitamins; then freeze them into meal sized portions. I also buy my meat/bone in bulk and refreeze into meal sized portions. Except for the "food-making" day and remembering to defrost the food I think I've got things down to a pretty easy system, but no where as easy as opening a bag of kibble and dumping a little bit to the dogs twice a day.

    I feel that BARF is definitely the right diet for me and my specific dogs. BARF is very low carb/high protein which is what is recommended for dogs with cancer (neither of my dogs has cancer, but goldens are very prone to cancer so I am hoping to head it off at the pass). No conventional dry diet can offer this (there is one canned diet-Hill's n/d-but it costs about $50 per case). While this is right for me, it is not right for a lot of people. I do spend more money than with a convential "good" food and spend a lot more time, so if you can't make the commitment you're way better off feeding a convential food than doing BARF half-a**ed.
     
  19. farmy

    farmy Well-Known Member

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    I love HT. You know you're among like-minded folks when you can write this with a straight face. :)
     
  20. kppop

    kppop Well-Known Member

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