DIY first shots for puppies?

Discussion in 'Working and Companion Animals' started by RedneckPete, Dec 10, 2006.

  1. RedneckPete

    RedneckPete Well-Known Member

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    We have a beautiful batch of pure bred German Shepard puppies. Most of the puppies being sold around here are sold with "first shots"

    What is this first shot? Vaccination against rabies or something else?

    Where can I get the vaccine? Is this a DIY proposition?

    Any help appreciated.

    Pete
     
  2. Bearfootfarm

    Bearfootfarm This Space For Rent Supporter

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    Multivalent vaccines are those that have more than one
    disease antigen combined into one injection.
    A typical multivalent vaccine is the DHLPPCv vaccine for dogs. Instead of giving six different injections, all these "vaccines" or antigens can be given in a single small volume injection. Certainly this is easier on the dog than getting six separate injections.

    DHLPPCv stands for:

    D... Canine Distemper Virus... a dangerous viral infection. "Distemper" is an odd name for a viral infection and this disease has no relationship to nor connection with a dog's temperament.
    H... Hepatitis...a viral infection caused by two related viruses that mainly affects the liver.
    L... Leptospirosis... a bacterial infection affecting the kidneys. This class of bacteria can infect humans, cows, dogs, pigs and other mammals.
    P... Parainfluenza... a virus that along with the Hepatitis virus can cause upper respiratory infections.
    P... Parvovirus... a severe and often fatal virus affecting the lining of the intestinal tract.
    Cv... Coronavirus... is very similar to the Parvovirus, can be very severe, but has a somewhat different effect on the intestinal tract and generally is not fatal.


    I buy them at Tractor Supply. Sometimes you can get them from a Vet. Its easy to give them yourself You can probably buy them online but shipping will be high since they have to be refrigerated.
     
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  3. AlaOutlaw

    AlaOutlaw Well-Known Member

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    I give my pups vaccines 6,8,10,13,and16 weeks old. It is very easy and a whole lot cheaper than going to the vet. The key is getting a good quality shot. Most feed stores sell the shots but most of them sell the cheapest ones they can get and the quality isn't that good. If the shots aren't kept refrigerated they will ruin also. I use the Fort Dodge Duramune Max5 from revivalanimal.com

    http://revivalanimal.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_21-264_A_name_E_Duramune Max 5

    A box of 25 shots cost me around $65 shipped. Which is fairly cheap. Most feed stores sell the inferior shots for between $3-$4 each. You have to buy the syringes seperate though but they only cost me $.13 each. You will save a ton of money doing it yourself and yes all pups need shots. If you don't get the shots then you run the risk of several diseases that are fatal to your pups. It's just not worth it to skimp on the shots.

    ETA: I just noticed that you are in Canada. Revival can't ship vaccines out of the US but I'm sure if you ask at some of your local farm stores you will find the "puppy shots" you need.
     
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  4. fieldtrial

    fieldtrial Member

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    Hi RedneckPete - We are quite a bit more regulated regarding administering
    animal vaccines in ON and Canada in general. You will not be able to
    buy canine vaccs in feed stores, etc here. There are perhaps some
    internet sale sites that you might be able to purchase from in Canada,
    the U.S. companies will not ship vaccs cross border, but I have
    no experience in that area to offer you any links.
    Although rabies is the only vaccine that is mandatory by law (laws vary
    and are specific to each province) there appears to be some type of
    regulation that only vaccs administered by licensed veterinarians are
    formally recognized. In ON our by-law reads that the rabies vac is to
    be given by 4 months of age and then re-administered per the vaccine
    manufacturers' expiration date. (ie most rabies vacs that ON vets
    carry are of the 3 year duration, so only need to be given every 3 yrs
    per the by-law). And even though there are no other manadatory
    by-laws regarding any of the other available vaccs you will find that
    most (if not all) vets will not recognize any vaccinations that you give
    yourself and will insist (if not downright bully :flame: )
    the puppy purchasers into having the the pup re-vaccinated.
    (just speaking from my personal experiences here).
    On another personal note, I only have my pups vaccinated for diseases
    that are endemic to the area - if we don't have the problem here
    (or whereever the pup might be going to live) I do not vaccinate for
    it, as such my pups are only given a parvo/distemper vaccine before
    they leave for their new homes.
     
  5. NCGirl

    NCGirl Well-Known Member

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    I also recommend only giving parvo/distemper. I really dislike the lepto vaccine, especially on a younger pup. Rabies I wait till at least 6 months of age. I would wait till 8 weeks for first shots, then not let the pups leave for a few days afterwards, especially if you are shipping them.

    If you pup into your puppy buyers contract that they can not give additional shots before 12 weeks or they won't get the papers that will help cut down on bullying vets. They can simply show that to the vet if he/she starts to give the new owner a hard time.
     
  6. GoldenMom

    GoldenMom Well-Known Member

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    Lepto is not to be given in pups under 12 weeks of age. Hopefully you will have the pups sold by then.

    NCGirl-dist/parvo/etc. shots should be given no more than 4 weeks apart (every 2-4 weeks until at least 12 weeks is on the label, every 3 weeks is typical), so if a pup got a shot at 6 or 7 weeks you wouldn't let the owner have the papers if the vet (correctly) recommended a shot at 9 or 10 weeks?

    Just for the record I don't "bully" owners into giving an additional shot just because I don't believe that the breeder's shot worked. I base my revaccination recommendation on 3 weeks (sometimes 4 if the pup has had a ton of vaccinations) from the last shot. If there is no record, of course I recommend a vaccination. We seem to have more of a problem of breeders vaccinating too much than not enough around here. Some of the breeders vaccinate for DHPP, then the next week just parvo, then DHPP again the next week, etc!!!! Sometimes we see a 10-12 week old pup who's had half a dozen different vaccinations!
     
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  7. NCGirl

    NCGirl Well-Known Member

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    Goldenmom, I wouldn't give the parvo/distemper shot BEFORE 8 weeks. Then give the pups a few days before sending them home or shipping them. We always gave shots at 8/12/16 then rabies after 6 months. My young male had that schedule and just had titers done and he is still protected almost 3 years later. I do plan on continuing to titer him every year and at some point may give him boosters. I go to tons of shows and trial and we used to have dogs here boarding/training at my house all the time so I know my dogs were exposed often on some level. Perhaps this will keep the immunity up all by itself. Does that make sense?

    Not saying YOU are bulling, but I have seen some vets that insist that the shots giving by breeders are no good. We always handled our shots very carefully, after Fed-ex delivered I checked to make sure they were cold then they went straight from carton to my fridge at work, then back into the carton until I got home and back in the fridge.
     
  8. mj1angier

    mj1angier Well-Known Member

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    We recommend that pet get dhpp starting at 6-8 week then every 3-4 weeks per manufactors label. In North Carolina rabies vacc should be given at 12 -16 weeks. 1st Rb good for 1 year then next are good for 3 years. Dhpp every year unless a labeled 3 year vacc. Lepyo every year. Heartworm test every year. Heartworm prevention every month.
    Mickey
     
  9. GoldenMom

    GoldenMom Well-Known Member

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    Gotcha!
     
  10. fieldtrial

    fieldtrial Member

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    by NCGirl I wouldn't give the parvo/distemper shot BEFORE 8 weeks. Then give the pups a few days before sending them home or shipping them. We always gave shots at 8/12/16 then rabies after 6 months.


    sounds like we are on pretty close to the same protocol :)
    I have my pups vacced at 9, 12 & 20 and blatently flaunt our provincial
    by-law and don't give the rabies vac until 6 months also :nono:
    I use Dr. Jean Dodds vaccination protocol:
    http://www.wellpet.org/vaccines/dodds-schedule.htm
    And I tend to run titers also instead of further vaccinations after the
    first year - have never had a titre fail in over 8 years now.
    Like you, I also put my protocol in my contracts.
    My vet also administers a dose of 'Thuya' after a vaccine is given so I
    only wait 24 hrs after their first vaccs before I let them go to their
    new homes.
     
  11. UUmom2many

    UUmom2many Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the great info everyone. We just got a puppy on Sat from a dog rescue we got our bunny from and she admins the shots herself. We have to take the pup to a vet for spaying and then for rabies (required by our county to be registered) but I was hoping to do the rest ourselves. Though she has roundworms (passed the lot of them on Sat night after her dewormer) I'll have her checked out fully by the vet but want to do them ourselves. We'll see how the vet goes along with it.

    We want to move into the country, we prob. have to be our own vet for the goats, chickens etc. why not the dogs and cats too??
     
  12. tailwagging

    tailwagging Well-Known Member

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    Goldenmom are they giving neopar? by Dr Page (one of the vets that developed the first parvo vac in the 70s)
    It is a parvo shot that many show and commercial breeders give at 4 weeks and on. they swear that is has stopped the spread of parvo in their kennel.

    http://www.neotechvaccines.com/neopar.htm
     
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  13. lamoncha lover

    lamoncha lover black thumb Supporter

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    I would never do a tractor supply or other store vaccine. Know several pups who have died from Parvo after such vaccines and I am guessing the vaccines weren't stored properly.
    One was a friends 2000$ french bulldog pup. Bet they wish they'd have spent the extra 10 bucks to get a vaccine that works.
     
  14. GoldenMom

    GoldenMom Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, is who giving neopar? This thread is soooo old I have forgotten what I wrote and it's late and I want to go to bed, so I'm not going to read thru the whole thread tonight.

    If you are asking if I would still booster Parvo vaccines on the normal schedule if a puppy has previously gotten a neopar, you bet I will (and routinely do). Unless I do titers on each and every puppy, I can't possibly know which ones have responded to a vaccination or not and the recommended schedule has been proven time and again to provide successful immunization of the vast majority of puppies.
     
  15. wintrrwolf

    wintrrwolf Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Where I worked DA2PP was given first visit, then boostered in 3 wks and again in another 3 wks with Rabies being given on the 3rd visit(as long as the puppy was at least 12 wks). We used Fort Dodge vaccines. Lepto was generally only given if the environment and type of pup would require it, and we never gave it with other vaccines or before 12 wks, it has a higher ratio of bad reactions or least it did. The vets I worked for I would sometimes hear commenting on how some breeders over vaccinate, and if puppy is vaccinated to young it was a wasted vaccine. You need to wait for the mother's immunities to leave the puppy or so I was told. But the vets I worked for would also accept a breeders vaccine if the breeder included the label of the vaccine next to the date that they gave it. Proof so to speak.
     
  16. Willowynd

    Willowynd Well-Known Member

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    Personally, I vaccinate with neopar at 5-6 weeks, neovac-D the next week, wait 2 weeks and repeat, wait 2 weeks and repeat. I then repeat at one year 4 months- after that just parvo every 3 yrs (and of course rabies). Neopar and neovac-d are high titer vaccines that over rides maternal immunities. I feel this is a good balance between over vaccinating and under vaccinating - neither of which I am comfortable with. I want the puppies protected when they leave my home at 10-12 weeks too, so starting early insures that. I can understand vets revaccinating when they do not know how the vaccines were handled or the quality....if I had a rescue or dog come in that was given farm store vaccines or an off brand or Ft Dodge vaccine- I would revaccinate myself.
     
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  17. Pyrenees

    Pyrenees Well-Known Member

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    You speak wise words.

    Not a judgement against any posters on this thread - it certainly doesn't take a DVM to give a vaccination properly. But all of us who have been around the block a few times have treated puppies for parvo that were "previously vaccinated" by the breeder.

    I am not a bullier (most vets aren't)...but sometimes no matter how diplomatic you are about suggesting another DA2PP, people get offended that you don't trust "their" breeder and the namecalling begins.

    This is a no win situation for the vet -
    1. You suggest one more round of shots = unhappy client
    2. You don't suggest one more round of shots and the puppy gets parvo = unhappy client, and as a bonus they may claim the puppy got parvo from your clinic.
     
  18. cmike

    cmike New Member

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  19. GrannyCarol

    GrannyCarol Well-Known Member Supporter

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    This is a very old thread - 5 years old - and protocols have changed since then. I used to give my own puppy vaccines many years ago. I found out the hard way that giving a lot of vaccines can cause more trouble than it might save when I proudly gave a full set of shots to one of my litters of pups only to find that when I had the rabies done at six months, I had created a puppy that reacted to the shot (the only time any of my puppies ever did).

    I went from there to giving the minimum number of shots that would likely keep the puppy safe. No lepto, as it commonly caused some bad reactions and didn't really vaccinate against the strains of lepto that were common, as few components as would protect against the local diseases, etc. Rabies as required by law. Since most vets want to vaccinate new puppy clients, I would give one shot at 8 weeks (a few days before puppies left) and recommend the second at 12 weeks and to use the vet's protocol after that. By spreading them out a bit, your puppy is a lot less likely to suffer vaccinosis and shot reactions.

    By all means you can give your own shots, but do the research, learn how to handle the vaccines and what the current research shows about when and what to give your puppy.
     
  20. mnn2501

    mnn2501 Dallas

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    Just a word of caution, if your pups will be boarded at anytime in any commercial boarding facility, you will need to give the new owners good complete shot records or they will not be accepted and the pups will need them all over again which besides the expense is a 3 month process.