depressed, limping wether

Discussion in 'Goats' started by Vicey, Oct 28, 2004.

  1. Vicey

    Vicey Member

    Messages:
    13
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2004
    Need help with 5-YO Boer wether that has not been himself for @ 1 week. He seems depressed and is not his healthy self--had him since very young. Wish I had some specific symptoms--tail and head not up as usual, not as active laying down more, coat "rumpled," but is limping--sometimes hard to detect, but appears to be both front and/or back. Today he is noticably favoring a back foot today but I do not see anything wrong with the hoof itself. The only other thing I notice is that he scratches somewhat but I don't see anything in his coat. He may be losing some weight as his sides are starting to look a little sunken (he is heavy). He will eat grain when I offer and is going out into the browse and brush and trees which is all that he is fed 3/4 of the year. He has had CD&T, wormed, and hooves trimmed. Temperature yesterday was 101.7. Could his feet be the problem and making him ill? Does he need an antibiotic? It has been warm and wet here (Iowa) but my ground is sandy. I have limited knowledge with illness. Any suggestions/ideas welcome--or call vet (have not had much success there--he admits not much goat experience)--thanks.
     
  2. Milking Mom

    Milking Mom COTTON EYED DOES

    Messages:
    425
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Location:
    Texas
    Are his joints swollen or inflamed or hot? Has he ever been tested for CAE? What was he wormed with and when? If you pull his eye lid down are the inside pink or light colored? Does he have a runny nose or can you hear any congestion in his chest? Does he have a goat friend or has he been alone? Does he share his space with any other animals?
     

  3. Vicey

    Vicey Member

    Messages:
    13
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2004
    Thanks!!!!!

    Joints do not appear swollen. Will check for inflamation/heat. (I should be able to feel this?)
    No CAE test. Purchased from a large group of market wethers from a local Boer breeder whose herd always appears healthy. Do not know the symptoms of this disease.
    Wormed 3cc Valbazen April; 2 ml Ivomec August.
    Will check eyelid color--know what to look for.
    No runny nose or congestion.
    1 other goat--2 YO Aline who is sleek, fat, onery.
    No other animals (barn cats, pet dogs, lots of wildlife).

    Could he have eaten anything that would cause this--pretty rough area--and I'm grasping at straws.
     
  4. Milking Mom

    Milking Mom COTTON EYED DOES

    Messages:
    425
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Location:
    Texas
    If it were me, I would take a stool sample in to the vet. Did you give the Ivomec orally by mouth or inject it? If you know of somebody that has some Cydectin cattle pour on wormer you can give that orally 1 cc per every 25# body weight. I would get a bottle of Red Cell from the feed store and put a little on his feed every day for a while. (blood builder) Limping? hmmmm....could he have just simply hurt his leg or pulled a tendon or something? Is there anything, fence or anything that he could have gotten caught in? Could his "pen" pal have butted him too hard? Is he chewing his cud like normal? Does he grind his teeth at all? That means he is in pain. Did you look good between his toes, no thorn or anything? Hoof walls look ok? No separation?
    Maybe Vicki McGaugh might have some idea. She is really good on goat health.
    Vicki.....what do you think?
     
  5. Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

    Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,817
    Joined:
    May 6, 2002
    Location:
    North of Houston TX
    Today he is noticably favoring a back foot today but I do not see anything wrong with the hoof itself. The only other thing I notice is that he scratches somewhat..............

    Just a couple of thoughts and will start with this. Menengial worm (protozoal mileitis) starts with scratching of the coat, they actually can then self mutilate, causing ringworm size circles gone from their coat down to bare skin, and a dragging of the rear foot. Do you have white tail deer around you, on your pasture or where the goats hay is baled? If yes email me.


    And....................

    "eat grain when I offer"

    how much grain did you offer? Could he have foundered (laminitis) which can effect all legs when it is an acute attack, but always settles into the front feet. They walk like they are walking on egg shells, are depressed, mostly because they are hurting, and during the acute case their hooves are so warm that the hoofwall seprates from the frog, and the frog tips. You can feel grooves later on around the cornonary band (where the hoof meets the meat of the leg at the hairline).

    Also is he peeing, boys with urinary calculi problems and even mastitis, will hurt when walking, their teats are inflammed and up near their scrotum you can miss this. Get him up on the milkstand, look for crystals around his sheath and really give him a once over including his testicles and teats.

    Get back with us. Vicki
     
  6. JenQH

    JenQH New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2004
    Location:
    IL
    Vicki, We purchased a goat years ago that had developed a lame foot...looked fine from the outside but paring it down with a good hoof trim we found foot rot inside. We soaked her foot two times daily with a copper sulfate solution. She had been off it for almost a year according to the folks who had her. She began partial weight bearing within two weeks.
     
  7. Vicey

    Vicey Member

    Messages:
    13
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2004
    Thanks for all your replies.

    My wether is still not himself. And lame. Both front and back, although now the right side seems to be worse. The only thing I can see is that his hooves are not as solid/strong looking as I would think they should be. One place on the inside has a small part of the wall missing; a couple small places are a little split/peeling looking just on the bottom. I do not smell ordor, feel heat, see anything between toes or around coronary band. Not do I see any swelling.

    My two goats are on @1 1/2 A. of pretty brushy weedy Iowa pasture 3/4 of year. I am careful to start them slowly on hay and a little grain in the fall and reduce it in the spring. I can not imagine he foundered from any feed change--unless he got into something in the field.

    Yes, there are a lot of deer. He does still scratch more than usual.

    There is something that is affecting his feet/legs making him not feel well.

    As I said in my initial post, I just feel very lost vet-wise when it has come to my goats. Any further info or ideas appreciated.
     
  8. Jen H

    Jen H Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,832
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Location:
    Washington
    "The only thing I can see is that his hooves are not as solid/strong looking as I would think they should be. One place on the inside has a small part of the wall missing; a couple small places are a little split/peeling looking just on the bottom. I do not smell ordor, feel heat, see anything between toes or around coronary band. Not do I see any swelling. "

    Has it been really soggy around your place lately? One of my wethers always has foot problems this time of year because we get so much rain that nothing except the barn itself stays dry. When their hoofs get loose and soft all sorts of dirt and crud get lodged between the hoof and the softer foot (like getting a splinter under your toenail).

    Get a container of bleach water made up to disinfect your hoof shears, and pare away all of the loose and separated hoof that you can - disinfect your shears after each cut. Disinfect a hoof pick (knitting needle or crochet hook will work in a pinch) and get out as much crud as you can - again, disinfect the pick after each time you use it. Now paint the foot with koppertox. In a week, do the same thing all over again and keep it up on a weekly basis until strong healthy hoof has grown out.

    I check my wether's feet weekly and pare away soft spots. If I don't he will start to have problems like your guy is having. It's just one of my guys that has problems like this, and when things dry up in the spring his hooves firm up and there are no more problems. I think some goats just have more sensitive feet than others.
     
  9. Vicey

    Vicey Member

    Messages:
    13
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2004
    Iowa weather had been so up and down all year--extreme wet and then very dry. I'm pretty sandy but solid enough that he canget the crud wedged in. And it's been wet lately.

    I did think I noticed one spot that the hoof wall did not look tight--this sounds worth a try! WHERE CAN I GET KOPPERTOX? Do farm stores commonly carry it or does it need to ordered from a catalog?

    Since he is not acting himself, do you think he needs anything else--antibiotic, probios? With the bleach usage you're recommending, is this actually hoof rot? If so, is it contagious?

    His feet are pretty short right now because I've been trimming and looking. But there are a couple "raggedy" areas and a small spot that I thought was discolored.
     
  10. Jen H

    Jen H Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,832
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Location:
    Washington
    I get koppertox at my local feed store. It'll turn his feet green and stain your skin and any clothes that it gets on, but it does work.

    It doesn't sound like hoof rot to me, but he may have a low-grade infection going on. The bleach is just to make sure nothing gets passed on in case there is a bit of infection. The koppertox will knock out any hoof rot that is around, and will keep any other infections at bay while you cut away the raggedy separated spots.

    Disinfecting the shears between cuts is also a habit I've gotten into.

    As to the other stuff. Probios won't hurt him at all, and might help alot. A vitamin B shot also won't do any harm and might kick his system back into gear. My guys really like gatorade (lemon-lime flavor), and it seems to really perk them up. Are there any treats he just loves that you can stimulate his apetite with? (mine will do just about anything for cashews and sunflower seeds)

    I personally don't break out the antibiotics unless my guys are actually running a fever and showing other definite signs of bacterial infection.