Boer Buck Question....

Discussion in 'Goats' started by Wingdo, Oct 6, 2004.

  1. Wingdo

    Wingdo Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have a two year old pure bred buck boer that is just a little too aggresive for his own good. As a matter of fact he killed my best boer doe just a couple of days ago! When she went down and couldn't get up he then went after another doe and crippled her up (temporarily)!

    Will he eventually realize the err of his ways, and more importantly, will he smarten up before he kills my other four does?

    Wingdo
     
  2. Tracy in Idaho

    Tracy in Idaho Well-Known Member Supporter

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    He KILLED your best doe and you still have him out with the others?!

    If you have to use this guy, I would hand breed him, and not even let him anywhere near the girls loose again.

    Then I'd sell him and buy a better behaved boy!

    JMO...

    Tracy
     

  3. Freeholder

    Freeholder Well-Known Member

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    Tracy is right! You shouldn't even be using this animal for breeding, because likely his sons will be like him. And what if he decides to go after you, or perhaps a child next time? Temperament tends to be neglected in favor of other considerations in breeding programs, but it is really very important.

    Kathleen in Oregon
     
  4. Wingdo

    Wingdo Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Interesting...

    I never said he was "mean"... He is just young, healthy, and made a mistake is all. All in all, he is a very handsom young man that got a little over zealous in his first "supervised" (albeit not very well) breeding attempt. His sons are fine, as are his daughters, although they all seem to have a lot of extra energy (at least a lot more than I do)!

    He's a good buck, just a little "confused" in his breeding technique! I've had a few bulls to do the same thing and later on get a humbling lesson from an old cow that isn't in any mood for his "bull"... so to speak. I was just wondering if bucks were along the same lines as bulls. I couldn't possibly hold a grudge against youth and it's initial ignorance, especially since I raised this young man from a pup!

    Wingdo
     
  5. Tracy in Idaho

    Tracy in Idaho Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If he already has kids on the ground then how can he possibly be inexperienced and this be his first attempt at breeding???? If he KILLED a doe -- I can't even imagine how a buck could be so overly agressive that he could accomplish this?

    Perhaps you need to provide us some more details?

    I do know however, that there is no way on God's green earth that I would allow him to be loose with any more does to kill, mistake or not!

    Tracy
     
  6. Patty0315

    Patty0315 Well-Known Member

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    Kinda seems like we might be being baited into something here. But I will bite. He is two and a nasty buck, end of story. You cannot say his offspring are not aggresive like him. He is 2 they are what about 1 year? Male animals tend to get mean at 2 or above. By all means don't hold a grudge with this poor little guy , tell him over and over how good he is. tell him thats a good boy when you cook him as steak, stew, hamburger or jerky. In my option anyone who keeps an aggresive animal like this gets what they deserve. They can mature at 300 plus pounds. If you keep him make sure your insurance is paid. It is not unheard of for a buck or ram to seriouslly injure or kill a person.
     
  7. Wingdo

    Wingdo Well-Known Member Supporter

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    He bred his first doe at 5 months old!

    I'm sorry... I must be on the wrong board. Thanks for your time.

    and BTW... I have never "baited" anyone in my life!

    Wingdo
     
  8. Tracy in Idaho

    Tracy in Idaho Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Windgo, you asked if he will change his ways -- in my opinon, NO he won't.

    His size at 2 yrs is likely somewhere between 2-300 lbs. There is no doe big enough to defend herself against him. A buck should not be acting so aggressively towards a doe as to cause death!

    I like to leave my young bucklings in with the mature does after they are all bred. He learns his manners right quick because they are bigger than him and don't take his crap. I would never expect them to try to train a full grown buck-- something that large, and acting agressively, would just terrorize them.

    As I said, I would hand breed him (although I do also believe that temperment breeds through and I'm not sure I'd like his much) and I would certainly never give him the opportunity to kill off another doe.
    Considering how much nice Boer does can cost, I wouldn't think you would want to chance him to injuring/killing any more of them.

    I hope that helps answer what you were looking for.

    Tracy
     
  9. Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

    Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians Well-Known Member

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    If you are going to keep him: I would have his horns surgically removed. This would get rid of his weapon of choice. I would also only hand breed him, on a leash. This is not normal, boys feeling their oats type of behavior here, and I would bet by next breeding season you will have even better horror stories than this to tell, if you even have does left to breed. Talk about full disclosure needed when some folks sell stock! And I thought only women got all gushy over the babies they bred!

    Well honestly I would have shot him, called my BIL and had him butchered for the homeless in our town.

    A 2 year old doesn't have old enough progeny for you to see any motherablility or them being aggressive also at 2. A young buckling used for the first time, is going to be pushed around by the does, so you wouldn't have seen this behavior last season in him, nor in his young bucks, obviously this buck has not been taught any manners, it is likely too late for him. In a meat goat situation, keeping a young growing buck in with the does, bred or not is always the best way to teach them manners.

    Were there other bucks in the pen with the does when this happened? I have seen full grown older bucks fight, it is never to the death, I am also skeptical, but also if this is true, what kind of shape was this doe in that she was killed by the buck in the first place? I have seen a doe gored to death during a fight, it was a lucky hit, not intentional, but still the other doe was butchered. I have also seen animals hit each other so hard they aborted other does, or killed a younger does kids...same thing, they where butchered.

    I agree with the others, I would not want a herdfull of this guys kids. Vicki
     
  10. geminigoats

    geminigoats Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure there were many other variables in this situation that created this situation. In all my years of raising goats, both meat and dairy, I have never experienced a buck being that aggressive with does. We did have a boer buck once who went after me and he went bye-bye. He was aggresive because his forme rowner liked to play with him and he learned some techniques that later became aggressive when he aged. Although the day he chased me and attacked it was breeding season and he sure hadn't indicated he wanted to, "play!" In fact, this buck never played before, so I discounted the story the former owner told.

    Oh boy!!!! *sigh*

    Bernice
     
  11. TexCountryWoman

    TexCountryWoman Gig'em

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    I breed for temperment in my cattle as well as my goats. When choosing my LaMancha buck, I had a choice between him and his twin brother. Structurally, they were the same but his brother was more aggressive at the teat (CAE neg. mom) and bossier to the buck I picked. Mine was slightly more submissive. He was a tad bit, just a tad bit smaller, but I thought his temperment outweighed that. So I took the milder, smaller buck which surprised the breeder. He has turned out beautifully. He is about five months old now and I keep him with my five month old Boer buck who is his good buddy. The Boer is sweet as pie too and I will never keep a mean doe either. The same goes for my cattle, no "wild things" on my place that can hurt someone or another animal.
     
  12. Wingdo

    Wingdo Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You know... how about we just forget I ever showed up on this board. You folks have taken a relatively simple question and turned ME into a poor farm manger, if not a total moron when it comes to my goat herd. I turned 59 just four days ago and have been raising horses, cattle, beagles, bird dogs, and a family sawmill since the day I could sit on a horse/tractor without falling off and having tears! I have not in the past, nor will I in the future, ever raise "killer" anythings, which is one implication I don't take with a grain of salt.

    You folks have a pleasent day and I'm sorry if I came in and ruined your little piece of heaven.

    Kindest regards
    Wingdo
     
  13. Tracy in Idaho

    Tracy in Idaho Well-Known Member Supporter

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    No, actually we haven't. If you choose to take it that way, then that is your problem. You asked a question and wanted opinions .... you just didn't like the answers you got.

    So did this buck kill your best doe or not? Those were your exact words.

    I'm very sorry if you didn't like the advice you were given. YOU asked -- and I quote:
    "Will he eventually realize the err of his ways, and more importantly, will he smarten up before he kills my other four does?"

    I think you see the unanimous answer is no, he will not. It certainly is up to you if this is an animal you wish to keep or not. I wish you and your surviving goats well.

    Well, you have a pleasant day too, Wingdo. I think if you look back over the posts, not one person has implied you were either a bad manager or a "moron" -- Sure hope you can see that, and decide to stick around.

    Tracy
     
  14. pointer_hunter

    pointer_hunter Well-Known Member

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    Wingdo,
    I do not see where you have the right to get upset over this post. You gave a generic statement that your buck killed your best doe and wounded another. Then you asked if he will change his ways. After reading all the replies, I can not see where anyone called you a poor farm manager. They never said that you were the cause of it all. They asked you for more details...perhaps the doe fell down in the middle of breeding and the buck landed on her....who knows, you never gave the details. As for your question....most people answered as honest as they could. They can't tell you if he'll get better because they never wanted to give them the chance. Their management choice was to get rid of the aggressiveness and go with a milder buck. They also gave you advice on how to handle breeding this buck if you decide to keep it.

    I shouldn't really post on here because I don't have goats...but it kind of steams me a bit when people get so defensive when they ask a question and don't get the answer they want.
     
  15. Patty0315

    Patty0315 Well-Known Member

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    My point basically is you are not real smart to keep an agressive animal of any kind. We have had some here and they promptly go in the freezer.I am 37 and physically in good shape and have a descent amount of muscle. At my age or even 10 years younger I would not deal with a nasty animal non the less when I am 59. If you dont worry about him killing your other animals or you , you should at least be concerned for others in the house , visitors, or if he gets loose. You are asking for trouble. Aperson I know who has been on a farm all her life was almost killed by a ram she raised during breeding season. If it was not for her stock dog and a big tree she would have been dead. My son learned the hard way one day you do not go into the pens without Roo{the cattle dog} when a ram we raised from a baby butted him in the butt clear across the room.We had a buck we bottle raised and he started getting pushy after his first breeding season, he also went in a freezer.There are enough well mannered animals out there that you do not need to deal with an ill mannered one.