blood in poop

Discussion in 'Cattle' started by 3sunz, Sep 23, 2006.

  1. 3sunz

    3sunz Well-Known Member

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    My ds got his first calf on Thursday. He had noticed that his poop has been kind of runny. Looser than it should be. He went out today to feed it (bottle) and told me that there is some blood in the poop now. The calf is about 2 weeks old and was getting fed whole fresh milk on the farm that he came from. We are feeding Purina Milk Replacer. Do you know what this may be coming from or what I should do? Thanks.
     
  2. topside1

    topside1 Retired Coastie Supporter

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    Don't know what's causing it, however I have seen small amounts of blood in some of the calf's that I have raised. Let's say five percent of them, each one grew up big and as strong as the others. If it was me, I would continue to monitor the symptom/sign and make sure it doesn't worsen. Also the blood should disappear in a few days...Good luck with your families new calf. Tennessee John
     

  3. DJ

    DJ Well-Known Member

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    coccidiosis, get with your vet now or lose the calf.
    Here is a google link that will tell you more.
    Can't stress enough treat this now or lose your calf!
    [ame]http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=coccidiosis&btnG=Google+Search[/ame]
     
  4. ozark_jewels

    ozark_jewels Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Solid poops with a little blood in a new calf doesn't bother me, but if its runny with blood its probably coccidiosis......it needs treated now if that is what it is.
     
  5. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    You did not say what the overall condition of the calf looks like.
    Does it look dehydrated; weak. What is the calf’s temperature.

    A small amount of blood could be normal from the stress of moving and a quick change in food but if it is showing signs of getting weak the stress could have allowed a bug to take hold and since we are talking over the internet we need to assume the worse. Coccidiosis and Salmonellosis both come to mind when blood is mentioned. Either of these diseases is a death trap if a vet is not called and called right away.

    If the calf is off milk or will not take his bottle this is a good sign that things are headed down hill.
    You would need to start a electrolyte solution to keep up body fluids. It may not be a bad idea even if the calf is taking the bottle to replace the milk with the electrolyte solution for 48 hrs to try and clear up the diarrhea. Much like using petolite on a child.

    You can make a home made electrolyte solution.............
    10 teaspoons dextrose (white corn syrup; do not use table sugar)
    2 teaspoons table salt
    1 1/2 teaspoons baking soda
    1/2 gallon of warm water

    Feed this instead off the milk replacer twice a day for 48 hrs (4 feedings)
     
  6. topside1

    topside1 Retired Coastie Supporter

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    I think the key here is how much blood is in the manure and what is the manure’s overall consistency. I have never lost a calf due to blood in stool, but keep in mind I'm talking very small amounts, the blood was even kind of jelly like in fact. If your new calf is discharging large amounts of blood then contact a professional cattleman in your area or a Vet for an immediate diagnoses. Just need more information in order to continue supporting you and your animal. John in LA is by far the king of calf raising, so pay particular attention to his responses. Keep us in the loop....Tennessee John
     
  7. 3sunz

    3sunz Well-Known Member

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    The overall condition of the calf is great. He is still very active and vocal, he looks as strong as I think he should, he is not acting strange or lethargic. I went out to check the stool that my son saw the blood in so that I can monitor it myself and also report my findings back here. The stool is slightly runny, nothing that concerns me there. I think that is probably from the changes. The blood is a very small amount and it is jellylike consistency instead of bright red, runny, fresh blood. And he has pooped again since and there was no sign of blood. I then proceeded to check out other "pattys". I could not find any trace of blood in those, either. Maybe this will give you more information to advise me on whether I should be concerned or just the need to be alert and watching for other signs. I was quite surprised that my son noticed the small amount of blood. I am not sure that I would have noticed it. It was that minimal. Thanks for all of the replies and advice.
     
  8. suburbanite

    suburbanite Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what it does in cows, but in humans that E. coli strain that has been in the news latelky causes bloody diarrhea.

    Since one of the suspected sources was cow manure, and since the cattle trade goes all over the place, does anyone know if cattle get sick from it and what the symptoms would be?

    I'd think the worry would be twofold--protecting your stock so they gain weight and thrive, and making sure if you were treating a cow that might have it, that you took extra care to stay clean, since we know that it's bad news for humans.
     
  9. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    That is the info we were looking for. Very easy for us and you to go overboard with our predictions over the internet.

    It could have been just moving it; or a bug tried to get started but the immune system seems to be working and taking care of the problem on its own.

    Just monitor for the next day or two; and feed the milk replacer at a rate of 8 to 10 % of body weight per day. Do not.... I said DO NOT feed it all the milk it wants. You will make it sick and give it digestive scours.
    Offer it free choice water and calf starter.
    Keep it tied up or in a stall by itself so you can monitor feed intake and prevent it from getting sick from other animals you may have.
    Once it starts to nibble at the grain you can add some hay free choice.
    After it is eating about 1.5 to 2 lbs of grain a day you can wean the replacer.
     
  10. topside1

    topside1 Retired Coastie Supporter

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    Good to hear and keep up the good work...Lastly don't overfeed the calf and everything should be fine...
     
  11. 3sunz

    3sunz Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the advice. I did not see any more blood when we went out to feed him this morning. And thanks for the confirmation that I am not supposed to feed him all he wants. I was beginning to think that I was not feeding him enough. He doesn't ever seem full. I do have calf starter available to him, but he has only eaten a little bit of it.
     
  12. topside1

    topside1 Retired Coastie Supporter

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    Only feed him the REQUIRED amount as per bag and his body weight. Yes he will always act hungry, but if you over-feed the milk you will have big troubles on your hands. Due a search and read about calf scours (yellow, white versions) it something you and animal must avoid. Being hungry will only quicken his appetite for grain, hay, and grass thus developing his rumen. Continue to ask questions, we enjoy helping!!! Tennessee John
     
  13. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    QUOTE=3sunz]I was beginning to think that I was not feeding him enough. He doesn't ever seem full.
    I do have calf starter available to him, but he has only eaten a little bit of it.[/QUOTE]

    This sounds like your first baby calf so let me spend some time making sure we understand one another.

    What breed of calf do you have or can you estimate its weight????????

    A bottle holds 4 pints or 1/2 gallon and weighs about 4.1 lbs and a calf needs 8 to 10% of its birth weight in milk per day.

    A Holstein weighs 90+ lbs at birth so it will need 7.2 to 9 lbs of milk per day. This means you would feed 1 whole bottle twice a day.

    On the other hand a Jersey weighs 50+ lbs at birth so it will need 4 to 5 lbs of milk a day. This is a little over 1/2 a bottle twice a day.

    You can see how a first time owner of a Jersey can easily over feed the calf.

    What happens is a cow has a 4 part stomach but a calf only uses the 4th part. When a calf sees it is about to nurse and from the posture of the nose up in the air a flap closes off part 1, 2 and 3 so the milk goes straight to part 4. When you over feed a calf; feed milk that is to hot or cold; or feed it when you feel like it and not using a set schedule of the same time every day the milk spills over into part 1 of the stomach. When milk gets into this part; in a non rumen calf it just sits there and spoils causing problems.

    Through modern research we have found that a calf will live on 2 full feedings a day. We have pushed it as far as we can and fill the calf with as much milk as it can hold twice a day. We would feed once a day if we could but the calf would starve or get sick. So you can see that we are walking a thin line feeding the way we do. If you wanted to get closer to nature and feed the calf more like mom you can not increase the amount per feeding. You have to increase the feedings per day. Say 3 or 4 feedings per day. This would also allow you to feed a little less per feeding; reducing the chances of over feeding at one time. The problem lies in the fact that we do not want to feed a calf 4 times a day because of our life style and schedules.
    And this is why a calf always seems hungry. He is hungry. This is not really a bad thing because it promotes fast learning of eating solid food and gets them off expensive milk.

    You also mention that you have calf starter available to him.
    You do have fresh water available to him also?????????????????
    I can not stress this enough. A calf does not get enough liquid from its milk.
    Remember milk goes straight to part 4 of the stomach.
    When a calf eats solid food this goes to part 1 of the stomach and starts the rumen action. If you do not give it water the calf is dying of thirst because of this food and no water in part 1 of the stomach.
    Please Please give this calf free choice water everyday.
     
  14. 3sunz

    3sunz Well-Known Member

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    The farm that I got him from on Thursday estimated that he weighs around 80 lbs right now. We feed him a full bottle twice daily (same times every day). I keep out the starter for him at all times and always make sure that he has fresh water. Our calf is an angus/Holstein cross. He is not as big as the pure holstein babies that I saw on the farm and was told that they were around the same age. And yes, this is our first baby calf. Thank you for being patient and explaining things so thoroughly to me. The guy from the farm did take some time to explain things to me, I thought I was prepared until I only had myself to rely on. Thanks for being here and being supportive.
     
  15. john in la

    john in la Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like you have things under control.

    Only one problem I can for see now.
    You better not get attached or let the kids get attached to him.
    The kids will want to bring him inside if you are not carefull.
    It is hard to eat the biggest dog you ever owned.


    Now would also be a good time to consider if he needs to be cut and if horns are going to need to be taken care of.
    Since he is 1/2 angus he should be naturally polled (no horns) but you should consider making a steer out of him. A bull is not nothing to mess with.
     
  16. 3sunz

    3sunz Well-Known Member

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    Ok. Your response led to my next question. At what age is he supposed to be "cut"? I DO NOT wish to keep him as a bull. Also, I think it is too late for the attachment part. lol. My son (12yo) asked me if he could sleep out in the barn with the calf so he wouldn't get scared in a new place by himself!!!!!! For me, I like him, but every time I look at him, I keep reminding myself of all of the hamburger, steaks, and roasts that he is going to provide us. I hope it works! lol.
     
  17. topside1

    topside1 Retired Coastie Supporter

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    My preference is rubber banding. I would band between four and eight weeks old depending on the size and drop of his scrotum. If you are in a farming area call and ask an experienced teenager to perform and teach you the technique. Give him/her some gas money and everyone will be happier....This will save you time, money, and aggravation...My thoughts,,,,Tennessee John
     
  18. DJ

    DJ Well-Known Member

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    3sunz you can band him with cheerio bands when your ready or cut him if you feel you want to try that route. The sooner the better as he gets bigger he will be harder to handle.
    Sorry for the abruptness of my first post but I wasn't there to see, so felt like a "worse case" answer was best. And in the worse case you can lose an animal quick. It sounds like everything is going well. Good Luck with the discussions about what animals are for. You going to have some time before he's ready maybe a couple of fryers(chickens) would help as examples?
     
  19. 3sunz

    3sunz Well-Known Member

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    DJ- The abruptness is ok. I realized I hadn't really given enough information, but didn't know what else to provide. I just appreciate all of the help and advice that I have received here. I really thought I was prepared with enough information to get started with the calf until it really came down to it. I couldn't remember anything that I had been told! I felt so stupid and useless. lol. Glad to know that I have somewhere to come when I need help. You guys saved me alot of worry, stress and $ (I may have eventually panicked enough to call a vet)!
     
  20. brian mcf

    brian mcf Well-Known Member

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    hello guys,keep up the good work.i read all your replys.i learned a few things.thanks.im new to this also. brian