A little worried

Discussion in 'Goats' started by cjb, Jul 16, 2006.

  1. cjb

    cjb Well-Known Member Supporter

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    We have two does that each have 8 week old twin doelings. We also have one doe from last year. The two Mama does are looking a bit rough - their fur is dry, they have dandruff and they are very skinny. They've been wormed but boy, they look rough!

    Also, one of the babies seems just slightly listless. She is not playing with the other babies - just watching.

    Does any of this sounds familiar to anyone? I wormed the moms. The one doe with no babies is fat and shiney and looking great. Could it just be wear and tear from nursing twins? I mean, the mom's butt bones stick out :(
     
  2. goatkid

    goatkid Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Need more information. What breed? How old? What are you feeding? What did you worm with? To keep my goats looking good after kidding, I make sure they get alfalfa, grain and sunflower seeds daily. They also get a good goat mineral and besides being wormed, get dusted for lice. As for the baby who isn't as active as the others, is her momma making enough milk for both kids? Perhaps she needs to be supplemented with a bottle. I've also noriced that some of my babies are just more playful than others.
     

  3. 6e

    6e Farm lovin wife Supporter

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    That's sounds JUST LIKE the problems I'm having with my LaMancha does!!! I mean EXACTLY! How strange. My two girls are rough coated, the fur is very dry and brittle and they have dry skin and they are soooo skinny. I've wormed them twice and took a fecal sample to the vet. He tested it and said that they do have a few worms, but nothing major. He told me that I wasn't going to totally get rid of the worms this time of year because of the heat. We wormed first with Panacur and then with Ivomec. We're going to worm again the first of August, probably with Cydectin this time. We've given extra feed and still they won't put on weight. My Boer goats are just fine and they look healthy, just the LaMancha's. To tell you the truth I'm completely and totally ashamed of the way they look, I just can't figure out what the problem is and the vet didn't seem to know either. If animal control saw them they would probably take them away on the grounds of animal cruelty, but we take good care of them, we just haven't pin pointed the problem yet. :shrug:
     
  4. TexCountryWoman

    TexCountryWoman Gig'em

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    If they were my goats, I would worm them with Cydectin now and not wait til August. Then I would worm them again in 19 days again with Cydectin. And then again. Then do another fecal. I would make sure they had plenty of alfafa pellets, loose goat mineral and fresh clean water that is changed or frehened up several times a day in this heat (if there buckets are small). Large trough, run the water and cool it. Make sure they have good shade.

    You can expect a milk goat to be skinny. They are putting all they eat into milk and not putting on weight. They won't put on weight now. Don't worry about the skinny and work on the other things as long as they are eating well.

    I had a goat like that, with the rough coat and I just stayed on her with the advice I just gave (and I brushed her regularly to get rid of loose hairs) and now she is just beautiful...slick and shiney and glossy with a new shorter coat...the long shabby hairs are completely gone. I did not use that brush on any other goats in case she had lice, although I did not suspect lice, but just in case. I think she just has a worm load and the frequent use of Cydectin really knocked them out and she began to thrive.

    For her grain on the milkstand, she gets oats, beet pulp and black oil sunflower seeds (BOSS)..it also seemed that after she had been on the beet pulp for awhile, she did better...may have been a coincidence. My goats get all the alfafa pellets they want in their pen during the day (and night).
     
  5. cjb

    cjb Well-Known Member Supporter

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    ok - thank you for the advice. The baby seems ok now and she was limping a bit so I think she just got hurt but both mama's still look very rough. I will worm again (I did a month ago with Ivermectin), and will just increase the food. Ok to worm with Cydectin even though she's nursing?

    In answer to the first reply: they are 1/2 ober 1/2 nubian - eating purina goat chow, alfalfa pellets and alfalfa hay, babies are about 8 weeks old - twins on each doe. The Mom's look pretty dang skinny to me - not just a little thin. Their hips jut out etc.
     
  6. gryndlgoat

    gryndlgoat Well-Known Member

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    I don't see any goat minerals in your list of feeds. I had two yearlings who looked really scruffy until I made sure they had LOOSE minerals with ENOUGH copper. One doe who is black turned a rusty color with loose rough looking hair, and was thinner than she should be. She is now gleaming black again and nicely filled out. You might be dealing with a mineral deficiency- all the minerals are going into milk for the babies and not leaving enough for the mamas.
     
  7. Freeholder

    Freeholder Well-Known Member

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    Make sure their mineral mix includes enough copper. And remember that molasses contains iron which binds copper. Sunflower seeds are a really good thing to feed, also, though not too much. And, yes, you might need to wait a while after worming for their coats to straighten out.

    Kathleen
     
  8. cjb

    cjb Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I provide a mineral block made for goats. Not enough? and could this really be the problem? that would make it easy!
     
  9. KSALguy

    KSALguy Lost in the Wiregrass Supporter

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    mineral blocks are better than nothing but Goats are not able to lick enough on a block to get what they need, their little mout just wont keep up with the demand, loose mineral is what you need so that they can get all they need with out standing at the block for hours,

    also they have said that getting the Copper powder used to kill tree stumps from HomeDepot helps raise the Copper leval needed in their diet
     
  10. ozark_jewels

    ozark_jewels Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yes, Cydectin is fine when they are nursing kids. Don't UNDERdose with it, be sure to give enough. And as was mentioned, they need a good *loose* mineral. :)
     
  11. cjb

    cjb Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Ok, I bought the Purina loose minerals and it has both Copper and Selenium. MAN, its expensive! We're increasing the grain and giving them the alfalfa pellets free choice. I'll changer wormer too.

    cliff
     
  12. ozark_jewels

    ozark_jewels Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Is it the Purina goat mineral? I hate to say this after you bought it, but......Purina is not a very good mineral in my opinion. Way to high a salt content and my girls did badly on it. :shrug: Though its probably better than a block.....
     
  13. Patty0315

    Patty0315 Well-Known Member

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    All the grain and minerals is not going to help if they have worms. I would worm NOW
     
  14. TexCountryWoman

    TexCountryWoman Gig'em

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    Cydectin is great..........there is no milk-withholding time for humans to drink the milk so it would certainly be fine for the kids to drink it. I like to be extra cautious though and do feed the milk to the dogs for several days to a week just to be extra safe after I worm with it. But there is no real need to do this.

    Cydectin is expensive but WELL WORTH IT! Here it costs $67.60 for 500ml.....but that is enough for a long time..plus we use it on our cattle.

    This is what you buy:

    CYDECTIN (moxidectin) Pour-On for Cattle

    To be given BY MOUTH to goats

    (do not pour on goats.)

    NOT for pregnant goats or real young babies. Use ivermectin for pregnant goats, valbezan for small babies.

    Cydectin dose is 1cc/25 lbs draw it up in a syringe and squirt it in the mouth (no needle)

    cydectin is purple and smells like kerosene....the first time I gave it, i thought there was some kind of horrible mistake, like surely I had the wrong stuff! But it is supposed to look and smell like that :)

    I give it every 19 days, three times in a row and hopefully kill all the worms before they complete their lifecycles. Just my thing. Cydectin also works on external paracites.

    Good stuff.
     
  15. ozark_jewels

    ozark_jewels Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Diane, why do you say not for pregnant does? It doesn't say that on the bottle and I use it on my pregnant does all the time. No problems. I have also used it on kids young as 1 month old with no problems. It has been well-tested on pregnant cows and newborn calves for problems and there were none. It seems to be extremely safe. I use Cydectin on all my goats and cattle.
     
  16. TexCountryWoman

    TexCountryWoman Gig'em

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    Emily, that's just the way I was "taught" by others and i have stuck with it. I have no first hand knowlegde of problems associated with use in pregnant goats or young kids, but I prefer using ivermectin and valbezan on those. I am open to change......how many pregnant goats and kids have you used it on? How far along in pregnancy were the goats? On the kids, i habor a few concerns about their livers with this wormer....just things i have heard in passing.
     
  17. ozark_jewels

    ozark_jewels Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Well, I prefer not to worm my pregnant does at all, but sometimes it can't be helped. I used it on my entire herd(50 does at the time)of pregnant does two years ago and on about 20 of them this year. They ranged from being three months along to 4-1/2 months along when they were wormed. No problems in the unborn kids or does. I have used it on my dam-raised kids as young as 4 weeks old, because they tend to be wormier than my bottle-raised kids. Have seen no ill-effects at all and used it on all my dam-raised kids last year...around 100 of them. Just my personal experience. :) I know other breeders(especially Boer breeders) who use it on pregnant does with no ill affects. The one to *never* use on pregnant does is Valbazen, but I'm sure you know that. :)
     
  18. ozark_jewels

    ozark_jewels Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Oh, and I can't use Ivermectin on the kids because it doesn't do anything anymore in this area. And Valbazen only gets tapes. So Cydectin it is.
     
  19. cjb

    cjb Well-Known Member Supporter

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    When you say that it helps with external parasites - you mean giving cydectin orally will take care of lice too? I haven't treated for lice since last summer and am betting that's part of the problem. I have a pour on for that - shouldn't use it or should in conjuction with the cydectin?
    cjb
     
  20. Patty0315

    Patty0315 Well-Known Member

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    If your animals are outside I doubt they have lice. Lice is usually a problem in the winter months . Lice do not survive well in the sunlight . That is for at least my area.

    Patty