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80x100 ag Roof over home/garage two separate structures?

3K views 23 replies 10 participants last post by  Bearfootfarm 
#1 · (Edited)
Good morning people..

I'm trying to come up with a plan on my retirement property close to millersburg iowa with no building codes, and Ive been going round and round about this for almost a year.
The main reason for buying was the low taxes, and keeping taxes low, and different personal needs now that I'm divorced. I'll retire in 5 years and don't need to be close to work here in town paying 10x the taxes. Utilities are approaching 200 a month on the 16x80 though. That's double than my town house and adds up quickly.

I finally found someone to take my worn out barn away, as even though the property is 1.25 acres only 1/2 an acre is level, or actually a hill top where rain will flow away making me question if I can get away with a pole barn/house garage.. Ive been thinking stick built on a poured foundation, but I cant ignore the fact, not many people want a small house with huge garage in the middle of nowhere. lol.. My kids who have for the most part disappeared, probably wont want to own it after I croak, so why build it to last 100 years?

So what I'm wondering, is since I need allot of space to store toys and projects like my RV, motorcycles and cars etc, and who knows when ALL my and my GF kids come running back, why not build a open (no side walls for now, but versatile) pole barn on perma columns on my level hill top for the sole purpose of a 80x140 roof? I hate additions.. I may even consider a steel structure since the space isn't conditioned. Then build a simple cheap but energy efficient slab on grade 1200 sq' house without a roof under it at least 12' from the roof edge creating a nice porch for the view? Also, a 1000 sq' heated garage with two post car lift.. Those structures could be left unsided if kept back from the roof edge 12', or generally unfinished looking from the outside for the tax man. Or I could just put the mobile home back under it and dump money into it, but then not get passive slab cooling but no tax man snooping around..

Then after my GF and I finally pass, someone can actually use the pole barn for a useful purpose hopefully adding some value after they clear away what the previous crazy old guy was up to. lol

Does this sound like a reasonable plan? The only problem I can foresee are birds wanting to live under the roof or on top of the living space and condition garage since there are no sidewalls. But the solar gain for the conditioned spaces or mobile home would be practically zero, and I'm OK with 80 degrees in the shade with a breeze on a cool slab, and there's plenty of wind out there..

Has anyone done this and how did they keep the birds out? I bunch of cats and cat ladders? lol

Thanks!

 
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#2 ·
Well, I think you are wrong about not wanting a small house and a large garage/barn. Look a these "tiny" houses that are the rage today.
At one time I had an acre + and was going to put up a nice barn and a guest house, with the intent of living in the guest house. When I was ready to build, the county building codes had changed, so I wasn't able to do that.

I've seen barns with nice living quarters built inside. Barns with people living in motor homes parked inside the barn.

I like some of those park model trailers. You can get them custom with added insulation for cold weather. That can be sold if not permanently attached to the land if circumstances change for you in the future.

Your options are endless!
 
#9 · (Edited)
Thanks everyone.. I'm in a crappy mood because my basement flooded and I was up half the night, and its still seeping up out of the cracks due to a jackleg contractor..

Well, I think you are wrong about not wanting a small house and a large garage/barn. Look a these "tiny" houses that are the rage today.
At one time I had an acre + and was going to put up a nice barn and a guest house, with the intent of living in the guest house. When I was ready to build, the county building codes had changed, so I wasn't able to do that.

I like some of those park model trailers. You can get them custom with added insulation for cold weather. That can be sold if not permanently attached to the land if circumstances change for you in the future.
I can afford to build a nice house and huge garage, but I really have a problem with the tax man.

Ive owned three mobile homes in my life, and that's four to many.. Maybe one of these though.

Your options are endless!
Yeah, which is great but stressful wondering if I will make a good decision, on a gravel road. Its not a low maintenance road, but some days it looks like that with the mud and snow drifts..

All I can think about is a 80x140 sail. With no walls, I have to think you get some nasty winds from time to time, and 11,200 sqft roof high up the air makes a big sail. You'll get a cross breeze alright.
I like the barn idea mentioned...like a carriage house, live up top, and have your toys below. Call it an outbuilding for taxes, and park your mobile/RV on lot for disguise..
A roof only structure receives increased wind loads, so its no cheaper to build. Its just more versatile imo. When I look at the stuff I store, allot of it only needs to be out of the rain. Not stored in a conditioned space. But if I cant save on taxes, and the county assessor was little help estimating, Its not worth building a huge "carport".

Building a pole barn with the intent of insulating, finishing and living in it doesn't make sense to me, since you still need to come back and add 2x4's every 24". You might as well stick build off a foundation instead of building a house inside of a polebarn imo..

I think open sides is a real poor idea. Enclose the sides and install overhead doors to keep things secure against weather, theft, bird and varmint infiltration, etc. and just install a gravel floor. Then pour a slab and build yourself an insulated, heated and air conditioned little apartment at one end. Who cares about resale value down the road, if this is your last move you'll be dead anyway.

I've got a 35' x 55' pole barn cabin approx. 2/3 cabin and 1/3 garage / shop and love it.
Yeah, Im hearing you Fishindude. For for whatever reason I figured the taxes would be lower without walls, but since the assessor couldn't even estimate or tell me which building technique was cheaper, I might as well move forward on a stick built structure but unfinished. Then after the assessor has assessed, I will try to finish it under the radar.

One might want to chat the idea over with their homeowners insurance outfit - even a small separation, connected by breezeway or something, between vehicles and living area could mean reduced insurance premium... Then there is the real estate (improvements) tax, all under one roof could mean a larger tax bill - or having two roofed buildings could be more, it all depends on the whims of location, location, location.
Not a bad idea.. Maybe my insurance agent will have more info or be more competent than the assessor. lol

I don't like the idea of running through the snow to go from house to the shop.. But you are correct about close proximity. I think it was anything within 4', insurance goes up..

What do you think of a tent /tarp roof and tarp side curtains instead of walls ?
Ive also wondered about a tent, but dismissed it because I figured the fabric would need replaced to often. .. I need to visit the assessor and ask about how it effects taxes. I guess the only way to get a straight answer is to go there..

Quite popular, especially the steel ones.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=barndo&FORM=HDRSC2

Build a room/house inside and call it good.....



I have plans for a nice one on 40 acres...…….
I love that, but here comes the tax man..

Just thought of something I've seen - a friend of the family outside KC put together two Morton buildings, the back with three 12x12 vehicle doors into a commercial space they used for their home business w/ 14' ceilings... However... in front the only higher ceilings (9') were in the kitchen-family area so the bedrooms & lavatories were like caves, really claustrophobic.

I don't know if it was a budgetary thing or just and oversight, that missing height of a single or double row of block sure soured the livability. When the property was offered to me I declined and didn't give it a second thought.
Ive lived in a berm house, and will agree that half the house feels claustrophobic without windows, let alone low ceilings.

Its one of the disadvantages of building a home in a shop. But the advantages are lower utilities and not needing to walk outside to get to the shop. I'm still undecided if the perks outweigh the cons..
 
#3 ·
I think open sides is a real poor idea. Enclose the sides and install overhead doors to keep things secure against weather, theft, bird and varmint infiltration, etc. and just install a gravel floor. Then pour a slab and build yourself an insulated, heated and air conditioned little apartment at one end. Who cares about resale value down the road, if this is your last move you'll be dead anyway.

I've got a 35' x 55' pole barn cabin approx. 2/3 cabin and 1/3 garage / shop and love it.
 
#4 ·
One might want to chat the idea over with their homeowners insurance outfit - even a small separation, connected by breezeway or something, between vehicles and living area could mean reduced insurance premium... Then there is the real estate (improvements) tax, all under one roof could mean a larger tax bill - or having two roofed buildings could be more, it all depends on the whims of location, location, location.
 
#5 ·
All I can think about is a 80x140 sail. With no walls, I have to think you get some nasty winds from time to time, and 11,200 sqft roof high up the air makes a big sail. You'll get a cross breeze alright.
I like the barn idea mentioned...like a carriage house, live up top, and have your toys below. Call it an outbuilding for taxes, and park your mobile/RV on lot for disguise..
 
#10 ·
I like the barn idea mentioned...like a carriage house, live up top, and have your toys below. Call it an outbuilding for taxes, and park your mobile/RV on lot for disguise..
I would strongly advise against living up top. As we get older, we don't want to have to climb stairs just to get in the house. My 61 year old buddy did this and is regretting it already. Should be plenty of room on the ground floor of a building that big to create a little living space.
 
#8 ·
Just thought of something I've seen - a friend of the family outside KC put together two Morton buildings, the back with three 12x12 vehicle doors into a commercial space they used for their home business w/ 14' ceilings... However... in front the only higher ceilings (9') were in the kitchen-family area so the bedrooms & lavatories were like caves, really claustrophobic.

I don't know if it was a budgetary thing or just and oversight, that missing height of a single or double row of block sure soured the livability. When the property was offered to me I declined and didn't give it a second thought.
 
#15 ·
The video I posted is a metal AG building or you could do a wooden pole barn style..... with 20 foot ceilings and the living part made in the corner with 8 foot tall windows.....no need for low ceilings or lack of windows...…..
You always end up with less windows combining a house with a shop. One way to combat that is making the hallway wall the dividing wall between shop and house.

I like that. If the assessor considers it a tent, how much less are the taxes? I need to get down there to engage them..
 
#20 ·
Only 49 now, but after spending the last two weeks in Montana at Paul Wheaton’s place, my dream retirement home for low taxes and energy efficiency is a wofati. I got to spend some time in both he has built (and is currently upgrading/refining). Google ‘wofati’ and the left image that comes up is one on his 200 acre property. They are earth integrated homes, living roofs, put a rocket mass heater in and you’ll only need less than a cord of wood a year, maybe half a cord to be comfy... pretty darn cheap!
 
#21 ·
I keep revisiting this idea about a ginormous roof over a mobile home because Iv learned low property taxes = axles under it..

A agricultural canopy roof large enough to have a enclosed 1500 sq' shop under a corner of it. And full hookup parking for a RV or two..

Its just so beautiful out here, I don't want walls.. And when it gets cold I'll winterize the place and hit the road..

My place

Canopy example
 
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