4WD won't disengage right away

Discussion in 'Homesteading Questions' started by canfossi, Dec 6, 2005.

  1. canfossi

    canfossi Well-Known Member

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    I have a 1997 Jeep TJ, last year when I took it out of 4wd it came out almost right away, now when I take it out of 4wd it doesn't disengage right away, I have to stop sometimes before it goes back to 2wd, what could be the problem? The 4wd works fine when it in 4wd. There are 147,000 kms on it. Thanks Chris
     
  2. crashy

    crashy chickaholic goddess

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    We have to backup on our 4x4 sometimes.
     

  3. Mama C

    Mama C Well-Known Member

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    some of our trucks are slow in and out, some need to back-up a bit, and one was always slow at the begining of the season as it just stayed in 2wd so long.
    It always got better after a while. One of our trucks needed to get lubed a bit, but it was an old one.
     
  4. fordy

    fordy Well-Known Member

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    ................when driving in 4WD , Normally , the wheels will slip some because you're in mud\snow\slick road conditions which allows all 4 wheels to relieve the mechanical tension that can buildup . You really , should never use 4wd on hard surfaced roads , UNless it is equipped with Full Time 4wd .
    And , after you disengae the 4wd , you should Also UNlock your front wheel locks as well . ...fordy... :happy:
     
  5. texican

    texican Well-Known Member

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    Lots of tiny little parts in the front ends of 4wd's. Be glad it's still going into 4wd and working. If it goes out a little slow, or if you have to actually stop, again, be glad. I had to replace most of the parts in both of my 4wd's front ends, and one needs work now.
     
  6. foxtrapper

    foxtrapper Well-Known Member Supporter

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    It's bind in the gears of the transfer case. Doing things like turning on pavement make it a very tight bind. The best conditions to disengage 4wd is straight ahead on a lose surface like grass or dirt.

    If it's bound up and doesn't want to disengage, going into reverse and moving 10-20 feet will generally unwind the binding of the gears in the transfer case, making disengagement easy.
     
  7. skruzich

    skruzich Well-Known Member

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    Well your in luck. I know what the problem is!

    Inside the transfer case, there is one set of gears that slips from 2 -4wd and back. The gear rides along another shaft spline and has three brass pieces that are spring loaded and keep the gear from just wandering back and forth from 2wd - 4wd and back. One or two of these what i call dogears has come out and most likely is sitting in the bottom of the transfer case. The cause of this is there is a large snap ring that holds these in place as they are inset in the gear. This is a common problem. The snap ring is either broken or it was stretched and popped out letting the dogear slip out.
    The two solutions to this are, do not use 4wd, or take transfer case off, and order the dogears, plus the plastic retainers that hold them into place, plus there are two plastic sleeves most of the time that the gear rides over.
    You will need to check the chain that goes from one planetary gear set to the other to see if it is stretched, if so replace chain. There should be no gasket for the case itself, just use permatex to seal. As always if you do it yourself, take it apart and lay the parts out in the order you take them out. Then start with the last part you took out and work backwards to reassemble

    Before you take to a shop, your looking at probably 500 -1000 dollars for them to do this just for labor.
     
  8. skruzich

    skruzich Well-Known Member

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    ummm fordy, they don't use front wheel locks anymore. :p
     
  9. skruzich

    skruzich Well-Known Member

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    IF you have a bind in a transfer case you have a major problem. There is absolutely no reason the transfer case should bind when you turn. The gears in it are in a straight parallel line and are not directly connected to the wheels. The bind is absorbed by the ujoint on the drive shaft going to the steering wheel. that shaft is then input into a straight fixed spline and it is never in a bind. the spline is then connected to the planetary gears which are parallel to the spline and are supported by sealed bearings and case mounts.
    Like i said, if your transfer case binds, theres something major wrong with the case itself!
     
  10. skruzich

    skruzich Well-Known Member

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    The way to stop anything like this from occuring is to never engage while driving. Stop, put in neutral engage then put in drive then proceed, and stop, neutral disengage and then drive. If you engage while driving you create pressure on the snap ring that holds the parts in place and after time they just give out.
     
  11. texican

    texican Well-Known Member

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    Ummm...yes they do...

    I had the auto hubs on my f350...and after getting stuck a few times when the dad blasted things didn't engage...had them replaced when they finally needed repairing. Was still under Ford warranty, and it cost nothing more to put manual hubs in. Manual hubs engage when you want them, no worry about vacuum lines, or other computer related poofery failing.
     
  12. fordy

    fordy Well-Known Member

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    ................A little MO' 'splainan'....when IN 4wd...and the vehicle is moving in a Strait line , i.e. , NO sharp turns , ALL 4 wheels are traveling\turning the Same distance.......(same number of revolutions) . NOW , when you turn in wet , slippery conditions the extra distance traveled by the OUTSIDE wheels will equal OUT with the same distance as in the INside wheels because of Slippage . BUT , when turning on HARD surfaced roads , etc. there is very little slippage and then you can BREAK drive shafts , etc. IF you don't understand what the HELL is happening !!!!! fordy... :goodjob: :)
     
  13. seedspreader

    seedspreader AFKA ZealYouthGuy

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    I think he may be talking about those cj's. You can definitely put locking hubs on any of them. I wouldn't own a four wheel drive without locking hubs personally. It eliminates a lot of wear and tear when you manually unlock your hubs.
     
  14. skruzich

    skruzich Well-Known Member

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    97 and up most of them quit making vehicles with those hubs, they opted for 4wd on the fly.
    I personally wouldn't go out of my way to get a 4wd vehicle. They are too hard on gas, tires and other components in the vehicle and totally not worth the repair cost.
    Theres not too many places i can't go in my 2wd pickup that you can go in a 4wd.
     
  15. HermitJohn

    HermitJohn Well-Known Member

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    Try my steep slick long driveway in wintertime. Seriously neighbor had visitor in 2wd Chevy 1/2 ton. Got front down in rut and axle hung. Came to me wanting me to use my tractor. Instead I walked down carrrying handyman jack and got them out of the rut with it. I resisted owning 4wd for reasons you mention. But talk about repair, how many times would you want to re-weld the muffler back on your 2wd or fix holes in gas tank? But finally decided the frustration of 4wd maintenence and repair was outweighed by convenience. I'll still use 2wd when things are dry but otherwise...

    I do have real problem with modern 4wd. To justify their sky is limit original factory prices, they seem to all went to auto hubs and every luxury you can think of. The manufacturers forgot about us that want a small utilitarian 4wd with solid front axle and axles strong enough to hold up to rough use, and simple long stroke cast iron engine. A modernized original style 4cyl IHC Scout or modernized original Ford Bronco with 6 cyl or Kaiser Jeepster is what I want but instead get choices of bunch of light duty, complicated, expensive to repair crap or big huge monstosities that require a loan to buy gasoline. By modernized, I mean disc brakes and heavy duty 5spd overdrive, less rust prone bodies, and maybe even a factory roll cage, not heated computerized vanity mirrors, shag carpeting, power windows, cadillac ride, automatic tranny, body sitting 5 foot off ground, or other such non-sense. Most people who buy 4wds really should look hard at AWDs. Thats more practical for commuter vehicle on snowy hiways.
     
  16. Pony

    Pony STILL not Alice Supporter

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    I love my SuperWinch manual hubs. Much easier on the fingers than Warn's, where you have to use their "hubber" to keep from breaking your fingers when engaging the hubs.

    Blew out my stock hubs one of my first wheeling excursions. Got those SuperWinches and I am one happy camper. Even when I had to crawl out from a snow bank I'd slid into a few winters ago, I love it. It's just so... dependable.

    Personally, I don't care for the automatic anything. Just more stuff to break. Like Hermit John, give me manual hubs and a solid front axle. I'll keep my little CJ7 running for the rest of my life if I can!

    Pony!
     
  17. Andy Nonymous

    Andy Nonymous Registered, here...

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    Skruzich probably has the bulk of the problem nailed for you Chris

    I also agree with HermiJohn. and lament the lack of simple strudy utilitarian vehicles. Also, for every mile I've put on my 4wd truck (an old and simple antique), I've put hundreds on something usually front wheel drive that gets twice (or three times) the fuel economy. 4wd, like any tool, has it's place. Not every homesteader needs a buldozer either, but for the few who can use it well and wisely, who can put up with the high maintenance required, it can be a practical investment. Too many are sold on the idea of 'needing it' than the actual need for one. My farmer brother-in-law has driven his standard Jimmy pickup (with a posi rear) through countless muddy fields and snow choked roads, and by simply knowing the capibilities of vehicle and driver, gets it through every time. even passing stuck 4wd's

    Just a side note, that having a bit of machanical background (having had A 4wd (as in the same one) since '76 and there being little my hands haven't had apart on it and working on others as well); the "wind up" is not in the transfer case exactly, but because nearly every 4wd made has slightly different ratios between the front and rear axles, the front being usually 'a hundredth' faster than the rear that in slippery conditions it 'pulls', but on less than slippery surfaces, there is insufficient 'give' between tires and road and the tension between the ratios tends to bind the gears of the transfer case. The 'load' on the axle and transfer case gears can easily be in the range of tons of force (depending on how much weight you have on the beast), making backing up necessary for the XC gears to slide out of 4, especially as the gears get even a little bit worn. Even a tenth of a thou of wear with several hundred footpounds of torque pushing things together can keep what used to slide from moving so easily. Cornering can also add to the torque equation.

    In my truck, the front ratio is 4.09/1, and the rear is 4.10/, meaning that for every hundred revolutions of the drive shafts, the front wheels make one full revolution more than the rears. Why? think about it: if you 'lost it' and the rear started catching up with the front, how would you 'pull out of it' if both axles were going the same speed? Nigh on impossible.

    And yes!! simplicity is the way to go with hubs - manual hubs rarely fail, and really, how often is getting into schlop really that unexpected to require getting out of the vehicle right in the middle of "it" to lock in your hubs? If in any doubt, they were locked in before I ever left the firm stuff. Just common sense.
     
  18. foxtrapper

    foxtrapper Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Uh, no. Bind is not absorbed by the steering wheel. :rolleyes: