Just for fun and practice

The cheap water bottles (case of 24 at the store) can freeze and thaw repeatedly without bursting. That's what I keep in our cars. Put the bottles in freezer bags if you want to be safe, and rotate them every year.

We regularly and purposely freeze a few of these bottles before going hiking, so that we have access to ice-water or cold-water in hot summer days. Perfectly safe.

A monster pack, with winter gear, food for one week, for me, can weigh 75lbs. Throw in an extra three pounds for radio/extra batteries (or exchange his for a firearm and some shells), and you're looking at a miserable trudge. I've done this crossing mountains and rivers, without trails. Tain't no fun. There is absolutely no way a person can carry what they think they can, and still have all of the basic camping gear. Freeze dried or whatnot, it's still heavy... with freeze dried, you pretty much need hot water, which means a stove and extra fuel.

Of course, I'm thinking living out of my pack, after civilization is over. For a three day emergency, most pack situations will work. I still prefer winter gear which is heavier/more durable... as it's cheaper (right now anyway) to have one set of quality gear that'll cover all seasons... back in the day, I had featherweight gear that get me by for a week in the summer deserts, for under 30lbs.

blu3duk... my beard has been frozen solid on more than a few occasions.

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Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. Seneca
Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

In general, you make some very good and valid points. The purpose (for us) having all the gear is about options. If we get stranded miles from a town/city which can easily happen (and has happened) due to where we live / hike / camp, having a wide selection of gear does not imply we take it all if push comes to shove. Rather it gives us many more options if needed depending on the reason, severity, distance, weather, terrain etc. If forced to walk home in the event that the OP suggested, we will be way ahead of most in terms of having and deciding which resources to take with us. Also if we had to walk home and were in a town/city I would be first scouting for a child wagon or child stroller etc that would enable us to carry a lot more gear.

As for the weight and walking any distance. We spend a lot of time outdoors hiking in many different types of terrain and ecosystems. We are also young enough and in good enough physical condition that I can comfortably carry a 40LB + pack all day in almost any terrain within 500 miles of us. My GF's pack is usually not much lighter and she has no trouble keeping up. This past spring / summer and now fall, we have hiked more then 300 miles of single and multi-day from anywhere at sea level to 7000 feet+ with the longest day hike being 21 miles from 1200' up to 6700' and back down on mountain trails that for us, would make the walk around the "school/college track" a walk in the park....so to speak.


With all that being said, this does not mean that every person has to be to hump 35lb + packs all day, however having the right base of gear to choose from (and how to use it) and being in good physical condition could make a huge difference in the outcome....

Wow, puts all the average folk with Mcdonalds wrappers, a case of music cd's and an old newspaper floating in the back seat to shame. Way to be!!

A bit off topic, lol. Had a small water bottle in my car over a -5 degree night. Took a drive in the a.m. Before the car was warmed up I got thirsty. (I know, odd time to be thirsty) The water was mysteriously not frozen. When I cracked the seal on the bottle and the vacuum escaped from it being sealed I watched it freeze solid before my eyes within a few seconds. Just sort of a fun experiment if you ever feel like trying it. Pointless but very cool.

Are you kidding, my fluff is like a camel hump. It would just take me longer to starve.


I finally thought of cheap and easy to find transport for those emergency situations. Kicking myself for not thinking of it before. Shopping carts. Hate to mug a kid and take their stroller or wagon. lol

With the economy so bad, this past year I haven't really had much travel outside of my 15 hour driving zone. I drive to DC sometimes and I've gone as far south as Alabama. However when I have had to fly, I only take with me a map. The other things I may have to acquire in a hurry if things start looking bad while I'm out in the world.

I still believe that knowing what I need and that I need it in those situations would put me at least a few steps ahead of the ravening hordes who don't know what they need nor how to use it.

Hey, the 'hump' is, imho, a valid survival accessory. I, like many others my age, carry about ten pounds extra 'survival fat'...

I figure I could get at least two weeks off my spare...

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Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. Seneca
Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

I spent the first half of this month traveling and thought a lot about this subject.

In my car, I keep a backpack similar to Ernie's. When I fly though, I feel particularly vulnerable. Usually in my suitcase, I keep an atlas, a leatherman, sewing kit, bullion cubes, salt, pepper, and sugar packets, plus clothing of course. In the case of SHTF, my plan would be to bug out for home immediately by whatever means available. Fortunately I don't travel all that often.

In my car, I have everything needed to keep my family alive for a week or so, and myself for longer

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"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why they are poor, they call me a communist"- Archbishop Camara

The Mad Luddite

The problem with the leatherman in that pack is they'll make you check that luggage. If your plane goes down and you do somehow manage to survive, good luck pulling that pack out of the crumpled wreckage. Or if it's already been checked and something happens, or if something really wacky happens such as the airline lost it (never happens, I know).

I'd ditch the leatherman and anything else those fools at TSA might consider a weapon (assault with a bouillon cube) and keep that pack under the seat in front of you on the plane ride. If things fall apart you'll be able to lay hands on some tools and a good knife pretty quickly and easily on the way back to your homestead.

All the best survival equipment in the world won't help you if it's not in your possession when you need it.

I don't worry much about crashing. Statistically speaking, I'll have other problems - like death - to worry about. I pack the leatehrman in my checked bag. On my key chain though, I have a slight modified P-52 can opener (slightly bigger version of the the standard issue military can opener) that will open more than cans and so far has had no problem getting past TSA.

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"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why they are poor, they call me a communist"- Archbishop Camara

The Mad Luddite