Campfie talk with my SIL about bugging out

[janetn]

Some of you may have read the thread I posted about my Daughter SIL and grandson being able to get to my place from their home 300 miles away if things go south really quickly. I shared some of the ideas that you all graciously posted. We kicked some of them around and he decided that trail bikes would be the best way to go. He also decided that keeping the RV up here would be a good idea.

Now this is where it gets a little weird [for me anyway] He wants to buy some land up here too. Specificially the 10 acres behind us. A little background is in order here. My SIL is a president of a large international company, he is not someone whom you would expect to be a prepper. I did not realise how seriously he takes prepping till this week it took me a little aback. For instance he just bought kevlar vests for the family last month, and he has accumulated over 6000 rounds of ammo [ I knew he had several guns and practices shooting], but I never thought he had stashed so much ammo he has also aquired a stash of gold and silver. The fact that he sees that things are not good economicially is not a good sign folks. Financially he is a genius - he rose to the top of his field at a young age, and has been courted by many companies in his industry because of his financial accumne. This man is the most calm level headed logical person I have ever known. In 12 years Ive never seen him so much as raise his voice, or become upset. He is not the type to over react to anything - just the opposite. He is also a very Godly man, he does nothing without lots of prayer.

He has thoughly research prepping, I was unaware of how much he actually knew. He made us feel that our knowledge base in gardening food preservation livestock ect. was vital to his families survivial I always thought his inquiries about my garden canning soapmaking ect were just polite conversation. Nice to not be thought of as the family nutcase He has a very well thought out defense plan too, that includes knowing you neighbor and banding together with likminded neighbors. He plans on putting a underground bunker on the land too. Something I have wanted but couldnt afford right now. He also has JW Rawles books - that shocked me too! This week was certainly eye opening for me. I am thankful that God has given my daughter and grandson this man!!!!!!!!!

In short the fact that he and some of his friends are seeing the writing on the wall is not a good sign. All the pundits in the world can predict a collapse but when those who are running large fortune 500 companies are scared its going to unravel its unerving to say the least.

I do want to thank everyone who gave advice on how they could make it up here if things fell apart fast, it was much appreciated.

[AngieM2]

That sounds very interesting, and a good outlook for the future for you and the family when/if the collapse of "as we know it" happens.

[Mom_of_Four]

It gives me the warm fuzzies when I find out that someone I know is taking prepping seriously. It must be a comfort to you knowing your daughter and grandson are going to be ok if anything happens.

[scooter]

It just may be that there are more taking this seriously than we think. I sure hope that some of these people are.

[Common Tator]

If my kids wanted to buy acreage near us as their bug out location, I would be doing a happy dance!

And I would do everything in my power to help them get set up, and I would keep an eye on the place for them while they are gone.

[janetn]

Originally Posted by Common Tator

If my kids wanted to buy acreage near us as their bug out location, I would be doing a happy dance!

And I would do everything in my power to help them get set up, and I would keep an eye on the place for them while they are gone.

Thats the plan What took me aback is that he doesnt see a good ending for the economy at all. He has always held the belief that the economy would be fine a firm believer in capitalism so to speak. In the past he talked of cycles/downturns being a normal part of the economy . He as well as some of his friends do not hold that view any longer. He travels extensively, and he is not liking what he is seeing. He sees no quick fix, things never really recovered after the crash. Its not just the US this time. He also does not throw money around the fact that he is and has spent large sums shows me he takes the likelyhood of things going south very seriously. He talked of the unrest in Europe, sees us not far behind.

[groundhogII]

This thread reminded me of this article I read recently.
http://www.shtfplan.com/headline-new...g-big_08172012

[texican]

I've been reading about uber-rich urgently snatching up retreat properties... because they know the tide is coming in one the sand castles everyone depends upon...

[backwoods]

Sounds like a good reason for all of us to "step it up" a bit in our preps.

[Apocalypse Boy]

Sounds like you raised a smart daughter if she snatched that ole' boy up lol.
Quick question though, by kevlar vests do you mean the soft armor (simple kevlar weave and such) or the heavier plate carriers (that use a ceramic plate)???

most Kevlar vests will stop up to a 9mm handgun and MAYBE a little bigger. Problem is that 9mm while it is common, shares the stage with .45ACP and then there's all the
a-hole criminals that like .357 magnum revolvers and etc.

You get hit with one of those wearing a regular kevlar vest it very well could go through and kill you. A plate carrier however (rated at an NIJ Level IV) will stop 30-06 armor piercing rounds. It will hurt A LOT and very well could crack your ribs but it will save your life. If you're on a budget, regular kevlar "soft armor" will do. But when you're thinking about survival in a SHTF scenario that involves numerous mutant-zombie-bikers-from-hell shooting at you, "It'll do." becomes "Oh crap I'm dead..."
(just my opinion)

Also, you mentioned your SIL has several guns. What types are they and does he have any training in their use?

thanks,
AB

[Marshloft]

Why is the hair on my neck standing up?

[secretcreek]

He's taking Rawles book "Patriots" to heart and following suit. I just finished reading the first book about an hour ago. A LOT to think about...and I do not feel ready at all.
-scrt crk

[AngieM2]

AB - why don't you tell us about YOU and your area and what you'd do. We don't know you, so why don't you tell us.

[triple divide]

Originally Posted by Apocalypse Boy

Sounds like you raised a smart daughter if she snatched that ole' boy up lol.
Quick question though, by kevlar vests do you mean the soft armor (simple kevlar weave and such) or the heavier plate carriers (that use a ceramic plate)???

most Kevlar vests will stop up to a 9mm handgun and MAYBE a little bigger. Problem is that 9mm while it is common, shares the stage with .45ACP and then there's all the
a-hole criminals that like .357 magnum revolvers and etc.

You get hit with one of those wearing a regular kevlar vest it very well could go through and kill you. A plate carrier however (rated at an NIJ Level IV) will stop 30-06 armor piercing rounds. It will hurt A LOT and very well could crack your ribs but it will save your life. If you're on a budget, regular kevlar "soft armor" will do. But when you're thinking about survival in a SHTF scenario that involves numerous mutant-zombie-bikers-from-hell shooting at you, "It'll do." becomes "Oh crap I'm dead..."
(just my opinion)

Also, you mentioned your SIL has several guns. What types are they and does he have any training in their use?

thanks,
AB

Wow. First post.

[Apocalypse Boy]

Originally Posted by triple divide

Wow. First post.

yep lol. I like to make impressive entrances on awesome forums.

[westend]

Janetn... It's good of you to share this on the forum. I've been hearing very similar things of late from similar people and it's made me move aggressively to downsize my day to day and secure property...much sooner than I had planned.

[westend]

Bumping this thread for very good reason. I'm new here, but really, it's important for us to be able to identify the signals of import in the noise. This is not noise....

[Ann-NWIowa]

If I were uber rich in the USA, I'd be looking for a bunker too. Obama is cheerleader for class warfare like its the fault of the rich when you're poor. Obama keeps harping on the rich paying their share (what about the poor who take and pay nothing ... heard any mention of that?) which will eventually lead to class warfare. Rioting of the poor against the rich leads me to think a bunker is a very good idea. Of course, I'm barely middle which puts me in the middle between the two clashing factions so maybe I need a bunker too.

[janetn]

Originally Posted by Marshloft

Why is the hair on my neck standing up?

Welcome to the club - I have just finally been able to digest what I learned from my SIL. It really left me a little shocked. I knew he believed in prepping but to the level he has and is taking it -no way.

Im very thankful dont get me wrong God has blessed us with this man!

AP boy I have no idea - All I do know is that he has gotten plenty of training with the guns and continues to practice. I trust he has thoughly investigated all the purchases he has made - he does nothing willy nilly.

An unexpected benefit to these events in our family is that it has lit a fire under my hubbys behind. He was as taken aback as I was. He said if our SIL is spooked enough to ramp the prepping up to the level he has we better get a movin too!

I hope this information gives us all food for thought. Like I said all the TV and internet pundits combined I can take with a grain of salt to a certain extent - most have an adgenda to promote. But when those who are running companies are spooked its time to listen.

[Wintersong Farm]

Originally Posted by Ann-NWIowa

If I were uber rich in the USA, I'd be looking for a bunker too. Obama is cheerleader for class warfare like its the fault of the rich when you're poor. Obama keeps harping on the rich paying their share (what about the poor who take and pay nothing ... heard any mention of that?) which will eventually lead to class warfare. Rioting of the poor against the rich leads me to think a bunker is a very good idea. Of course, I'm barely middle which puts me in the middle between the two clashing factions so maybe I need a bunker too.

When the crash comes, the FSA will define "rich" as anyone that has something they want. Prepare accordingly.

[Marshloft]

Originally Posted by janetn

Welcome to the club - I have just finally been able to digest what I learned from my SIL. It really left me a little shocked. I knew he believed in prepping but to the level he has and is taking it -no way.

Im very thankful dont get me wrong God has blessed us with this man!

AP boy I have no idea - All I do know is that he has gotten plenty of training with the guns and continues to practice. I trust he has thoughly investigated all the purchases he has made - he does nothing willy nilly.

An unexpected benefit to these events in our family is that it has lit a fire under my hubbys behind. He was as taken aback as I was. He said if our SIL is spooked enough to ramp the prepping up to the level he has we better get a movin too!

I hope this information gives us all food for thought. Like I said all the TV and internet pundits combined I can take with a grain of salt to a certain extent - most have an adgenda to promote. But when those who are running companies are spooked its time to listen.

Sorry Janetn, altho I was interested in your story, it was very good and informative.
My post was about the post above mine.
I was waving a red flag so to speak.
Read his post again. You'll get it.
I'm pretty sure Angie caught on as well.
Something just wasn't kosher with AB's post.
As you will notice, AB hasn't posted before,,, nor sense on HT.
GH

[Apocalypse Boy]

Originally Posted by Marshloft

Sorry Janetn, altho I was interested in your story, it was very good and informative.
My post was about the post above mine.
I was waving a red flag so to speak.
Read his post again. You'll get it.
I'm pretty sure Angie caught on as well.
Something just wasn't kosher with AB's post.
As you will notice, AB hasn't posted before,,, nor sense on HT.
GH

Oops, sorry, didn't mean to raise any red flags.
I'm new here and have been rather busy recently so I haven't been on HS.

Janetn, glad to hear it. Too many people have guns but don't know how to use them effectively. Personally I would recommend that in addition to whatever training he already has, he try one or two of Suarez International's classes. They're very squared away, straightforward and down to earth guys in person and tactics-wise. My brother is actually one of their staff-instructors.

Suarez International USA, Inc.

their website ^
I've taken two of their classes (Dynamics of the Shotgun and Dynamics of the Kalashnikov) and they're pretty educational honestly. They use simple, effective tactics that are fairly easy for everyone to learn.

I would personally recommend he purchase (if he can do so legally and hasn't done so already) a semi-automatic "assault rifle" of some kind. Bolt-action rifles, pump action shotguns and etcetera all LOOK nice and Prepper-y but if he's serious and committed enough to buy body armor then he should probably get an effective means of returning fire as well.
There's plenty of guns out there that'll work just fine for the job and I would recommend one but honestly, different people are more effective with different guns that THEY decide they like and are comfortable with.

[Apocalypse Boy]

Originally Posted by AngieM2

AB - why don't you tell us about YOU and your area and what you'd do. We don't know you, so why don't you tell us.

oops, sorry bout that Angie I didn't see your post.

Well umm, I live in rural TN and I'm a Prepper (obviously)
I live in a quiet little minnonite community (although only about half the population is actually minnonite) and I personally would like to purchase body armor in the future but I simply don't have the cash.
I would do...pretty much what I've suggested thus far. I already own an assault rifle, I keep ammunition handy (although I need to stock up right now)
and I've been properly educated in its effective use. I've been shooting since I was like, 7, but I only started to learn about gunfighting/combat shooting (essentially how to NOT die while being shot at and how to shoot back) this past year right after I got my AK-74 (best birthday gift ever)

It's a nice gun and I'm very pleased with it but if I had all the cash in the world I'd probably get like a SIG-556 or HK-91 due to how available their ammo is (likely I'd go with the SIG as it can take AR15 mags)

uuum, any other questions?

[goatlady]

Yeah - what are you doing about prepping besides weapon training?? Or do y ou subscribe to Suarez's privately held outlook that with weapons, propert training and planning, and select numbers of people you can take and hold what you need when you need it? I was given that tidbit directly from a former instructor - former because he just could not accept that outlook so he left voluntarily. How's your gardening skills? Food storage skills? Animal management skills/stock on hand?

[AR Transplant]

I am so glad that your sil gets it, it has to give you peace in this time. But I do want to bring up what I have noticed lately. People I hear about are buying new cars, new toys, still heading to the beach, or taking cruises. I don't say much but I am amazed at the people that are spending more today than they were 2 -3 years ago.
Is it that I am now more sensitive to this? Or is it some people will never get it?

Maybe I just don't know enough big wigs to really notice what they are really doing. I am sure that your sil is pretty quiet about his new "passion".

We are still in the camp that we will have a false peace before it all gets crazy. Meaning, when everyone else is trying to ditch their survival preps, offer to take it off their hands for them.

[janetn]

Originally Posted by AR Transplant

I am so glad that your sil gets it, it has to give you peace in this time. But I do want to bring up what I have noticed lately. People I hear about are buying new cars, new toys, still heading to the beach, or taking cruises. I don't say much but I am amazed at the people that are spending more today than they were 2 -3 years ago.
Is it that I am now more sensitive to this? Or is it some people will never get it?

Maybe I just don't know enough big wigs to really notice what they are really doing. I am sure that your sil is pretty quiet about his new "passion".

We are still in the camp that we will have a false peace before it all gets crazy. Meaning, when everyone else is trying to ditch their survival preps, offer to take it off their hands for them.

I dont know many either, but Ive been down to visit them and have met some of the neighbors and yes they are still spending. I think part of the difference is that inflation does not hit them like us regular folk. To a certain extent they live in a totally different world than us. Which creates a different mindset and behaviours. For instance the rise in the price of gas or groceries is barely noticed by them. IE they are not out buying fuel effiecinent cars, nor have they stopped shopping at Whole Paychecks So yes they dont get it because they dont feel it like we do. The vast majority of the well off are in a fantasyland we can never understand. My own daughter is often in that land - Ive watched her spend money like water without even giving it a thought - it drives me crazy. She was not raised in the lap of luxury and we did not hand her anything but she sure adapted to having money and changed her outlook quickly! Thankfully her hubby is far more frugal, and realistic!

They [my DD and SIL] have a neighbor across the street that preps very heavily. They are in a particular industry that has had to deal with a couple of government agencies and they are accutely aware how incapable they are when it comes to dealing with a crisis. The wife actually changed jobs because of the stress of dealing with as she called the government agencies - morons. This woman has lots of letters behind her name and I can say with assurance is a genius. Before she knew I prepped she felt the need to warn me several times that if SHTF we were on our own and I better be ready not only with supplies but knowledge. This was a few years ago. They have taken their prepping to a higher level recently also.

[Texasdirtdigger]

Well, as for me....I ain't ditchin nothin!!

Janetn- I am glad your SIL gets it! That is wonderful.

[Cabin Fever]

Originally Posted by Apocalypse Boy

....Personally I would recommend that in addition to whatever training he already has, he try one or two of Suarez International's classes. They're very squared away, straightforward and down to earth guys in person and tactics-wise. My brother is actually one of their staff-instructors.

Suarez International USA, Inc.

their website ^

Gabe Suarez writes a column for the US Concealed Carry Association's magazine. I would also recommend attending any of his courses.

[westend]

Janetn, ARtransplant...

There are still a lot of people asleep (or not paying attention to the right thing...) but no, it's not the same.

I'd say anyone reading this thread should not be distracted by the idea of it's just a new person coming to prepping or the whole guns bit of thread drift here...

Don't miss the core nugget of very important insight provided by janetn... I've recently had a very similar experience...well placed people moving all of their money out of the market into cash and real estate and spending a lot of time and money establishing remote locations. Those that really know and are smart are repositioning now. And these folks aren't tinfoil hat types.

Get healthy, get your house in order, do whatever you can to get out of debt, if you were on the fence about getting out of the stock market this might be the exact right time to get out, and get as much of a cash cushion as you can. If you were putting off building a community and being self sufficient, now's the time I think.

[Apocalypse Boy]

Originally Posted by goatlady

Yeah - what are you doing about prepping besides weapon training?? Or do y ou subscribe to Suarez's privately held outlook that with weapons, propert training and planning, and select numbers of people you can take and hold what you need when you need it? I was given that tidbit directly from a former instructor - former because he just could not accept that outlook so he left voluntarily. How's your gardening skills? Food storage skills? Animal management skills/stock on hand?

I've been into prepping for a while actually (picked it up from my parents, found it to be enjoyable) Gardening skills I'm learning from my father who's been gardening for about 40 years or so now. Canning I'm learning from my mother AND father (who've been doing it for many years) and while we don't have any livestock on hand at the moment we are planning on purchasing a cow sometime soon. We also used to keep goats and chickens for a while but we eventually ate/got rid of those. We're not exactly spending a lot of cash right now lol so sometime in the future we might get some rabbits too. Our neighbor owns several horses and several of our other friends and neighbors own large numbers of cattle and/or goats (minnonites ftw) and we've already stockpiled quite a bit of food and it's become my pet project as of late to try to get a nice faraday cage of sorts suitable for our gasoline generator (going to replace with propane at soonest possible opportunity) and freezer (where we've stored a large amount of our food for now) A good portion of our food is canned or non-perishable but I'm not quite satisfied with it just yet.

No by the way, I do not in any way adhere to the foolish belief that as long as you have guns and ammo you'll survive. My older brother detests the wannabe Omega Men and such like that, that call themselves "preppers"
He himself is not really into prepping but he has acknowledged before the possibilities of it becoming necessary and seems to be gravitating towards it. Besides, he lives literally right down the driveway from us so he has us to rely on and we have him to rely on. Really our biggest prepping advantage is that we (my family and I) live in a rural area on the Cumberland Plateu, AKA the Redoubt of the East in a small and loyal community full of farmers (both minnonite and non) and friends we can trust.

Also, I have never heard of Suarez International even discussing Prepping before.

EDIT: also we have a garden and a few deer and hogs that hang around our neck of the woods. My other older brother (not the Staff Instructor/LEO) is a Licensed Practical Nurse (and a good one at that) as well as Prepper and he also uses Suarez training techniques.


@Cabin Fever

Really? Cool. I didn't expect to meet a fellow Suarez customer on here.
Wait a sec...you don't carry an M1911 in a SERPA holster do you?