Is this right?

[sisterpine]

Was reading something for class and came across an article that stated America has not lost production jobs to other countries, they have been lost to robotics. Said that car company a used to make x amount of cars using 30000 employees and now makes the same x number of cars using o nnly 5000 employees and some robot workers. The article was in reply to another that complained about American not "making" anything any more and how we have lost so many manufacturing jobs the past couple of decades. The author felt this was because companies are working smarter and more economically not in other countries. Opinions?

[Bearfootfarm]

they have been lost to robotics.

There is a LOT of truth to that

[arabian knight]

Originally Posted by Bearfootfarm

There is a LOT of truth to that

You bet it is.
Take the company I worked for. When I started it took 16 workers to make 25K parts in a 12 hour period.
Over time robotics were put in place, and now TWO units are run by for the most part by 5 People~!! And they are now making over 35K parts in a 12 hour period PER UNIT.
SO what took 32 Workers now takes at most FIVE, and putting gout more parts in any given day.~!
Between Robotics, and cameras to "look" for defects that many workers are gone.
Now take that number and UP it to most of thew time 25 units are working 24/7 and see how many were laid off~!
When I started over 2500 were there at the high mark, now it is less then 1100.
Making More parts and better quality parts then before.

[Bearfootfarm]

The body shop boasts hundreds of German-made (KUKA) welding robots that join components together. (The plant has approximately 800 robots overall, 600-some of which are in the body shop

http://www.automotivetraveler.com/in...mer&Itemid=315

[plowjockey]

The author is half wrong (or half right).

We have lost plenty of production jobs, when completed products, product lines (or complete factories) are moved overseas.

The author is correct, that for industries that are still here, automation plays a huge part, in production.

Also, automation is one of the main reasons, that even though, as our economy os recovering and factory output has been increasing nicely, the jobs have been very slow to come back. this is bacuase as soon as things started picking up 3 years ago, companies started (capital) investing in automated equipment, to replace employees no longer on their payroll, something they may wave wanted to do years earlier.

Automation really shows in the machining world. One CNC tech, might run 3 automated multiple function screw machines, that would have likely employed several skilled machinists and unskilled workers, back when each machining step was done individaully on individual machines.

[Old Vet]

Once it took 6 people to make a Lamp (light bulb) for a total out put of 5,000 per 8 hours. Then the machines came along that took 5 persons to make 1,000,000 per every 8 hours. Then Government regulations came along and the factory moved to Mexico and China. Using the same equipment. So yes and no robotics have replace some workers but regulations have move entire factories over seas.

[Jim Bunton]

Originally Posted by sisterpine

Was reading something for class and came across an article that stated America has not lost production jobs to other countries, they have been lost to robotics. Said that car company a used to make x amount of cars using 30000 employees and now makes the same x number of cars using o nnly 5000 employees and some robot workers. The article was in reply to another that complained about American not "making" anything any more and how we have lost so many manufacturing jobs the past couple of decades. The author felt this was because companies are working smarter and more economically not in other countries. Opinions?

This link was posted by Ken Scharabok In a thread titled Very Interesting Article on U.S. Financial Obligations I found it pretty interesting. It touches on this point.

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/02/...6pLid%3D135454

Jim

[bignugly]

Originally Posted by Jim Bunton

This link was posted by Ken Scharabok In a thread titled Very Interesting Article on U.S. Financial Obligations I found it pretty interesting. It touches on this point.

http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/02/...6pLid%3D135454

Jim

I read this report and I have some questions about it. First, anything provided by the Federal Reserve(not a government entity) is questionable at best. Second, The percentages quoted were Chinese goods compared to American goods and services. Services include restaurants, hospitals, schools, government jobs and etc. I would like to see a comparison of Chinese produced goods to American produced goods. Third, what about the countries that are directly controlled or influenced by China like Nepal, Tibet, Viet Nam and etc.
There is no doubt that automation has had a major impact on the manufacturing sector jobs but out sourcing has had a major impact also

[Danaus29]

What about the clothing industry? It still requires human labor and yet those humans do not live in the US.

[TheMartianChick]

My husband programs manufacturing robots for a local company. Nearly 20years ago, they sent him to school to ABB in Colorado to learn to do it. Since that time, he has learned to program/repair other brands. Way back then, the training was extremely expensive and cost about the same amount as one year's salary for two managers. In other words, the company knew that the payoff would be huge!

There has long been a push for lean manufacturing and it does require fewer folks to make products today than it used to. There is an article that I saw awhile back about a wire basket company in Baltimore that has become automated. Let me see if I can find it because it has a lot of good figures.

Edited to add: It took awhile, but I found it! The article is in pdf format but it was originally on msnbc.

http://www.marlinwire.com/docs/facto...-msnbc.com.pdf

[plowjockey]

How about robot surgeons? Bound to take a few high dollar doctor salaries.

Cutting and sewing humans, from 1000 miles away. Hope the Internnet connection stays up.

[beowoulf90]

Originally Posted by sisterpine

Was reading something for class and came across an article that stated America has not lost production jobs to other countries, they have been lost to robotics. Said that car company a used to make x amount of cars using 30000 employees and now makes the same x number of cars using o nnly 5000 employees and some robot workers. The article was in reply to another that complained about American not "making" anything any more and how we have lost so many manufacturing jobs the past couple of decades. The author felt this was because companies are working smarter and more economically not in other countries. Opinions?

I would say it is partially correct, but not totally.
For example the shoe industry has sent it's shoe factories overseas or south, along with the clothing industry.. Most of those jobs aren't done by robotics..

Some of the reasons for these moves are lower labor costs and taxes.

Now in some plants automation has taken over and it requires fewer people to work the plants..

AS time goes on you will more than likely see more "assembly line" jobs being replace with robotics/automation.. It seems the machines don't ask for raises and benefits every year.... Go figure...

[arabian knight]

Originally Posted by beowoulf90

I would say it is partially correct, but not totally.
For example the shoe industry has sent it's shoe factories overseas or south, along with the clothing industry.. Most of those jobs aren't done by robotics..

Some of the reasons for these moves are lower labor costs and taxes.

Now in some plants automation has taken over and it requires fewer people to work the plants..

AS time goes on you will more than likely see more "assembly line" jobs being replace with robotics/automation.. It seems the machines don't ask for raises and benefits every year.... Go figure...

Just like what I posted about the company I had worked for, laying off over 1K workers over the past few years, ALL due to robotics, and nothing else.

[Yvonne's hubby]

Originally Posted by sisterpine

Was reading something for class and came across an article that stated America has not lost production jobs to other countries, they have been lost to robotics. Said that car company a used to make x amount of cars using 30000 employees and now makes the same x number of cars using o nnly 5000 employees and some robot workers. The article was in reply to another that complained about American not "making" anything any more and how we have lost so many manufacturing jobs the past couple of decades. The author felt this was because companies are working smarter and more economically not in other countries. Opinions?

I would say the author is right... sorta. In some industries robotics has replaced workers here in this country, but in other industries the jobs have gone to foreign markets. Both situations are for the same reason... high labor costs. Many jobs in our local area went south across the mexican border a few years back. Those were mostly being done by real people, operating sewing machines putting the stitches in jeans, shirts and underwear. Not far up the road from me Union Underware closed down their largest factory.... and built a new one in Mexico.... much cheaper labor, and robots were not as efficient as cheap labor. The automotive industry on the other hand has eliminated a lot of jobs using robots. The advantage of robots is pretty simple.... they dont ever go on strike, and they do not require time off coz they are pregnant or have little kids that need attention. They can work 24/7/365 with minimal maintenance. This concept was introduced early on during the industrial revolution. Folk legend John Henry is a prime example.... folks songs and story tellers made him a legend.... but steam operated machines replaced the men swingin big hammers just the same. They were cheaper, never complained, never went on strike, and cut expense for the companies that converted. Companies that didnt, soon went broke because of the natural competition factor. Anytime I hear folks complaining about how their employers have no heart, and treat their hire help less than favorably I just tell them.... start yer own company, Become one of those "fat cats" and find out what its like to compete with the dogs and you will soon find out that it is indeed a dog eat dog world.

[Ozarks Tom]

Automation is one of the reasons we have any industry left in this country. It's the only way to compete with low labor costs overseas. The labor intensive industries have left this country in droves. Try to find a major furniture plant in NC.

Might make the environmentalist happy though. No reason to cut down the trees anymore.

[Capt Quirk]

Originally Posted by Danaus29

What about the clothing industry? It still requires human labor and yet those humans do not live in the US.

And most of those haven't hit puberty yet.

[willow_girl]

Good article on the subject: http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...-america/8844/

[Jim Bunton]

Originally Posted by bignugly

I read this report and I have some questions about it. First, anything provided by the Federal Reserve(not a government entity) is questionable at best. Second, The percentages quoted were Chinese goods compared to American goods and services. Services include restaurants, hospitals, schools, government jobs and etc. I would like to see a comparison of Chinese produced goods to American produced goods. Third, what about the countries that are directly controlled or influenced by China like Nepal, Tibet, Viet Nam and etc.
There is no doubt that automation has had a major impact on the manufacturing sector jobs but out sourcing has had a major impact also

Here is a comparison of China's GDP compared to the U S GDP
China GDP 2010 5,878,257 U S D
U S GDP 2010 14,526,550 U S D

Jim

[sidepasser]

Much of the manufacturing is done by robotics or automated machinery. it is faster, less likely to impact business financials (no robot is going to sue a company nor is it going to cost a self insured company thousands of dollars in medical bills, or file workman's comp, etc.).

On another note, Google has sponsored the development of robotic cars that are being tested in Nevada where they passed legislation to give the cars a driver's license. The robotic cars are driven by themselves requiring no human intervention. Really a cool car but it will be a few years before the public can buy one. sorry forgot the link to the info:
http://singularityhub.com/2011/03/06...eat-new-video/

[sisterpine]

Well, my naive perspective had been radically changed. I will now quit whining so much about jobs lost/taken by migrant workers and such. My apologies for any previous whining too! Kathleen