"The Flipside of Feminism. . . "

[doohap]

" . . . What Conservative Women Know — and Men Can't Say"

The Flipside of Feminism . . .

Recommended.

[wendle]

Interesting opinions there. I wonder which conservative women they are talking about.
"Forty years have passed since the so-called women's movement claimed to liberate women from preconceived notions of what it means to be female".
This phrase alone shows the writer thinks little of the fact that women are now allowed to vote, to have a say in the country they call home. I wonder if the writer is one of those overdressed geek type guys who couldn't swing a hammer to save his home. Fortunately for him, there are a few handy women around who might take care of him if he's cute enough.
Besides that, boy this topic will likely open up a can of worms.

[gone-a-milkin]

nevermind

[lilmizlayla]

womens rights movement has always been aided by men.....LMAO.

this is a joke, right?

[tinknal]

Originally Posted by lilmizlayla

womens rights movement has always been aided by men.....LMAO.

this is a joke, right?

If the only ones eligible to vote to grant women the right to vote were men how do you think that occurred?

[tinknal]

Originally Posted by wendle

Interesting opinions there. I wonder which conservative women they are talking about.
"Forty years have passed since the so-called women's movement claimed to liberate women from preconceived notions of what it means to be female".
This phrase alone shows the writer thinks little of the fact that women are now allowed to vote, to have a say in the country they call home. I wonder if the writer is one of those overdressed geek type guys who couldn't swing a hammer to save his home. Fortunately for him, there are a few handy women around who might take care of him if he's cute enough.
Besides that, boy this topic will likely open up a can of worms.

The writer, whoever he or she is (interesting that you assume it is a male writer) is merely summarizing what these two women have said.

The fact that you deem to cast aspersions on the writers manhood (again, assuming) speaks volumes about your own character.

[kasilofhome]

Thomas Paine ?????
Does it seem odd that I should mention this historic person?

Well working with my son with his history we learned that before 1776 Thomas Paine a corset maker by trade was writing papers and speaking out for equality for Women's right. Just a bit of interesting new information I gained from homeschooling.

[Laura Zone 5]

Originally Posted by tinknal

If the only ones eligible to vote to grant women the right to vote were men how do you think that occurred?

IMHO?
That was the beginning of the demise of our country.

[doohap]

I sometimes wonder if people on this board just start posting replies before they EVER actually look at or read the opening post; most seem so ready to refute ANYTHING, whether they know what they're refuting or not. Beats me!

The book was written by Phyllis Schlafly and Suzanne Venker, the two women in the video. It was NOT written by a man. And if one actually watches the video, one will hear the subject of women's right to vote addressed quite clearly.

[willow_girl]

IMHO?
That was the beginning of the demise of our country.

Because it just works better to keep half the population dependent upon and subservient to the other half! Right?

I will admit that feminism hasn't been a real boon for women who had hoped to be able to trade sex for financial security. Beyond that small subset, however, it's been a godsend.

Now I expect we'll see a bunch of stay-at-home wives pop up to protest that they provide their husband with many other services besides sexual ones. Childcare, housekeeping, etc. -- which is all well and good -- but cut off the sex, hon, and see how long he sticks around and keeps paying your bills.

I dare ya. LOL!

[wendle]

Originally Posted by tinknal

The writer, whoever he or she is (interesting that you assume it is a male writer) is merely summarizing what these two women have said.

The write up is deceiving. "Forty years have passed since the so-called women's movement claimed to liberate women from preconceived notions of what it means to be female – and the results are in. The latest statistics from the National Bureau of Economic Research show that as women have gained more freedom, more education, and more power, they have become less happy". It looks like the gentleman in the video did the write up, not the books. I was not talking about the books.
"Women’s progress has been a natural evolution – due in large part to men’s contributions." Weren't the men the ones who didn't allow women to vote in the first place?

[Laura Zone 5]

Originally Posted by willow_girl

Because it just works better to keep half the population dependent upon and subservient to the other half! Right?

I will admit that feminism hasn't been a real boon for women who had hoped to be able to trade sex for financial security. Beyond that small subset, however, it's been a godsend.

Now I expect we'll see a bunch of stay-at-home wives pop up to protest that they provide their husband with many other services besides sexual ones. Childcare, housekeeping, etc. -- which is all well and good -- but cut off the sex, hon, and see how long he sticks around and keeps paying your bills.

I dare ya. LOL!

It's my opinion doll! No sense in getting hostile, or actin' like you know everything about sex and relationships!! :happy0035:
There is more to a woman that what sits on her chest and rests between her legs......

[willow_girl]

It's my opinion doll! No sense in getting hostile,

Sorry, but this is a subject I'm passionate about.

Right now, we are seeing the conservative moment attempt to roll back most of the improvements of the last century. Leading the charge are people who don't know history and thus, it seems, will be condemned to repeat it.

I'll give you labor rights, and even the environment, but women's rights are a hill I'm willing to die on.

I saw firsthand what 40 years of groveling for her daily bread did to my mother. It destroyed her soul. I would not wish that on my proverbial daughters or granddaughters.

[Laura Zone 5]

Originally Posted by willow_girl

Sorry, but this is a subject I'm passionate about.

Right now, we are seeing the conservative moment attempt to roll back most of the improvements of the last century. Leading the charge are people who don't know history and thus, it seems, will be condemned to repeat it.

I'll give you labor rights, and even the environment, but women's rights are a hill I'm willing to die on.

I saw firsthand what 40 years of groveling for her daily bread did to my mother. It destroyed her soul. I would not wish that on my proverbial daughters or granddaughters.

I am so sorry. I totally understand where you 'passion' comes from. And I agree with you......men who treat women like property, are not "loving them" like they are commanded too.

I was on the other side of the fence....watching as 'I am woman hear me roar' dominated my childhood. Forced to 'get a job' at 13. Told all my life NEVER depend on a man, make your own money. And watched as a career was infinitely more important than their own children / and grand children. Watching the 'man of the house' bow to the whims of the woman.

We were on opposite sides of the window. Me standing on the outside, looking in, wanting a mother at home. You standing on the inside, looking out, wanting the oppression to stop.

[willow_girl]

Yup, I would say that's a pretty accurate description.

The only difference was, it sounds like your mother had a choice. If she had decided she really wanted to be a subservient groveler, why, all she would have needed to do was to find some man willing to let her lick his boot.

My mother was not equipped with an education or any marketable skills. She had nowhere to go and no way to support herself once she got there, and she did not live in a time a place where resources were available to help or even encourage her.

That's the beauty of feminism -- it gives women a choice.

[wendle]

The first speaker said the only time the ERA would have made a difference in rights of women was when the wives could not make homemade wine without the husband's consent. I guess she did not consider the 19th amendment?
She also said she fought the ERA for 10 years. Wow. She seems to be an extreme to the opposite of feminism.

"Lydia Taft (February 2, 1712 – November 9, 1778) was a forerunner of women's suffrage in Colonial America. She was the first woman legally allowed to vote in colonial America. After the death of her wealthy husband and eldest son left the family without an adult heir, she was granted this right by the town meeting of Uxbridge, Massachusetts in 1756. For the great majority of American women, voting rights were not granted."

[Laura Zone 5]

Originally Posted by willow_girl

Yup, I would say that's a pretty accurate description.

The only difference was, it sounds like your mother had a choice. If she had decided she really wanted to be a subservient groveler, why, all she would have needed to do was to find some man willing to let her lick his boot.

Choice? Not really.....she was woman, and she roared, and my dad loved it. She had a steady paycheck (he was in sales / commission). So when it was bonus time, he could buy a new boat or a new car......because my mom had a steady job. When he hit about 50......he worked, a little bit.....but really mom has carried the load for 20 years.
It has embittered her. She bought into the idea of 'she was free to do what she wanted how she wanted, bla bla bla" and guess what.....not so much.
She CHOSE my dad......she CHOSE her career......she CHOSE her lifestyle.
And she's a miserable woman.
It's sad.

My mother was not equipped with an education or any marketable skills. She had nowhere to go and no way to support herself once she got there, and she did not live in a time a place where resources were available to help or even encourage her.

That's the beauty of feminism -- it gives women a choice.

I agree, if a woman wants to go to college, let her. But she should have to pay as much as the man does. No 'freebies' because she's a woman. Equal education, equal pay.
If a woman and a man do the exact same job, the exact same way, pay them the same.
I totally agree with you there......

It's just the emotional toll (both ways, what I experienced and what you experienced) and the scars it leaves on the next generation......

Uhhhh I don't know about all these subservient women you seem to know, In my 60 years, I've not run across one yet. Even my grandma, who was born in 1880 spoke up to my grandpa whenever she felt like it. It(subservience) is not endemic to this area.

[wendle]

My mother and father both worked. My grandmothers on both sides were subservient. They couldn't make household choices , it was up to the husband. I married a guy who didn't seem to be that way, but his parents were. His dad expectedhis mom to wait on him until the day he died. In my own marriage, I was expected to work and take care of the lion's share of the kid's needs. I was also expected to take care of the household. It seemed mixed up in a way, the wife still expected to be the wife, because that's how things have always been. This couldn't be done easily while working full time. I cut back my hours, so the kids would be in daycare less. Then I ended up starting a business of my own so the kids would be home with me. I am glad now that I can do for myself as my X husband cheated on different occasions and was abusive. He also had trouble budgeting himself and we were horribly deep in debt. Our family was miserable before the divorce. Both my children have since told me they have been happier since the divorce. I have found myself to be happier single and independent than I ever was.

[chamoisee]

If women don't like feminism, they don't have to practice it. Turn all your property over into your husband's name. Quit voting. Work for whatever the employer will pay you, even if you work twice as hard as the man next to you in your assembly line job (but only if hubby asked you to work it), etc.

This is just like the abortion debate. If you don't want femisnism, then don't do feminism. Some of us do like it, and are unwilling to live our lives according to your religious or moral convictions abotu a woman's place.