The new Chevy Volt
 

The dealership a few towns away just got a new Chevy Volt demonstrator on their lot.

Previously, the Volt was only sold in four markets, I think. Michigan, New York City, Las Angeles and ???

We stopped today and looked at it. The salesman invited me back for a test drive...I would have taken a test drive today if I would have had the time.

That car is just cool, in my opinion...I like the concept of the Chevy Volt.

My only complaint is the price tag. Base models are $37,500, and highly loaded at $42,000. This is a rich man's car priced where it is, in my opinion.

I'm sure the negative Nellies will have plenty to say about the new Volt, but I love the idea of a plug-in or gas powered car. The salesman said the car will get the about the equilivent to 100 MPG, which is nearly about what others are saying at 93 MPG +. If you drove the car on gasoline only, it still gets 37 MPG.

This is the way of the future, and I think all vehicles will resemble the power train of the Volt. Sure, the price tag is going to have to fall for the average consumer to be able to afford it, but when the price tag drops to the low $20,000 range, I don't think they will be able to build enough of them to supply demand.

They havent gotten great reviews and there are other conventional cars that get a lot better mileage in the real world but I think it would be a kick in the pants to test drive one.

Cars like this lead the way towards future development and for that I applaud GM but I dont think I would want to sink my money into a test bed. Are you going to test drive it? Be kind of interesting to get a real world assessment of how it drives and operates.

FWIW, the majority of reviews give the new Volt absolutely rave reviews. The few poor reviews I've read have been highly critical of GM as a whole, and they might as well bash the Volt while they can.

I read one review that bashed the Volt for its body styling, as if the Prius or the Leaf was winning some sort of award for their beauty. I read another review that bashed GM...it seems that th marketing department wasn't being truthful when they said that when the gas engine kicks on, that none of that power is used for the power train. In essence, GM now says that 15% of the gas engine power goes to the power train. (Who really cares where that power goes??? Not me.) And other bad reviews tend to slant with the "Let Detroit burn to the ground~GM can't ever get anything right~My import is the most perfect car in the world" mentality.

While I read tons of car reviews, I tend to read them with a grain of salt. There are idiots and people with ulterior motives who become writers. Remember car reviewer George Moore? He couldn't write enough good about imports...while his wife was the marketing director of some import car association.

Most reviews aren't worth the paper they are printed on...in my opinion.

Overall, I like the Volt. Sure, I think it could use some softer styling. There doesn't seem to be tons of rear leg room.

To me, the real shocker (pun intended) is the price tag. In that price range, I could buy a new Camaro convertible, a Cadillac CTS, or a really nice pick up truck. There are going to have to be some very dedicated buyers to pay that much for a car, even if it got 200 MPG.

But the thing I love about the Volt is its promise to the future. We started it up, and it was exciting! I wish I would have take the test drive, but I feared it would take far too long.

Yes, I am going back to test drive it, and I cannot wait.

The concept of the VOLT is pretty neat. The price is high, but the Government pays some of the cost as an incentive, but I do not know how much. Some of my mechanic friends say with any of the ELECTRIC cars, usually after ten years the batteries may have to be replaced, which cost around 10,000 dollars as of todays date. This price will probably go down as time goes on. So if any one wants to buy one of these electric cars, do your homework and check out the pros and cons of owning one. To me, the gas cars that get around 40 mpg will be cheaper in the long run. Just my 2 cents.

Currently, there is a $7500 tax credit if you buy a new Volt. The salesman says that the credit will be in place until 200,000 Volts are sold.

I think my biggest drawback, should I ever buy an electric, would be the cost of replacement batteries.

While the Volt and Leaf type battery powered cars may be fine for those who drive less than 45 miles per outing they are a poor choice for those who drive longer distances as there are many gas powered cars today that get close to 45 MPG in real life over the 37 of the volt on gasoline.
also if you live in the northern states where the winters are cold that 45 miles on electric is going to be even shorter. ever take a flash lite out in the cold and compair battery life ove the same flash lite in the summer.

I personally do not believe that electric cars are for the majorty because the majorty drive much more than 45 miles per outing. Also for the price you can drive a gas powerd car for many a miles on the difference in cost.
I also hate to see what they will charge when you plug in away from home to get a charge when that happens.

The style of the Volt is so much nicer than some thing like the Toyota hgh bred

:D Al

Yes, I agree. Most of us do drive more than 45 miles a day.

My father drives 28 miles each way, meaning that he probably wouldn't be able to make it all the way home on a single charge.

I've read and seen that GM has been conservative with their mileage claims on the battery. I wish I could have a Volt for a year, just to see how much I could milk the battery with super conservative driving.

***I also wonder about their 37 MPG when the car runs entirely on gas.

Our Chevy HHR gets better than listed. The sticker on the window at the dealership claims the car gets 30 MPG highway, but we routinely get better than that. I just got 37.2 on the interstate from Knoxville to Indy, with the cruise set at 70 MPH.

My wife loves jack rabbit starts and hitting 60 MPH between stop signs in town, and even she gets good mileage in our HHR despite her horrific driving habits.

I am guessing with conservative driving, a person could get far better than the claims on the new Volt...and I'd love to try it out.

Rich man's toy. If you buy it as company car suppose you can depreciate and write it off. Make the taxpayer pay for it like the wealthy did with the Hummers.

Well...kinda...

In the case of the Volt, most trips will be under that 45 mile limit. For those that aren't, what are we talking about? 10 miles? 15 extra miles?

Those first 45 miles are going to be at a much cheaper level, energy wise. So unless we are talking a trip of a few hundred miles, the Volt still wins on energy cost vs. a 45 mpg car.

At the end of the day, the most succesful aspect of the Volt is as a technology platform. Through daily use of thousands of drivers, GM will find out what works. And what doesn't.

The next generation of cars with fossil fuel/battery technology are going to be the real stars, methinks.

We stopped in the same dealership again today so I could show my 10 year old the new Volt, and to try to explain to her that I think that most cars in her lifetime will be electric cars with gas chargers.

Yikes!!!!! The sticker price of that demo is $46,600.

How on earth do they expect to sell any of them at that price point?

If they were able to offer this car at $23,000, I don't think they could build enough of them to satisfy demand.

I totally agree, and couldn't have said it better myself.

All in all, the thing that excites me the most is that this technology platform is the key to the future.

How soon will we see that every Suburban, Tahoe, Silverado and HHR shares the same technology?

How soon will we see mild electrics in everyday cars, where the first 10 or 20 miles is totally electric powered? How long will it be before a Suburban can drive 100 miles at highway speeds with 5 passengers and towing a boat, totally on electric power, before the gas charger kicks in?

The "coolest" thing about the 46k price tag is that it does'nt include the 30-35k taxpayer subsidy for each Volt....Buy a VW deisel and get a better car...

I think you will see light trucks and the like start having small diesel engines in them much like Eroupe has now.

:D Al

I am surprised that we haven't had them available yet.

I've often wondered if the car of the future will have a system like the Volt, but with a small diesel engine as its charging unit.

I know some of the VW's, like the TDI, are supposed to get excellent mileage, but how would a diesel do in a Colorado, Ranger, or a full size Silverado? Would there be improved mileage?

I know most of it is in the gearing...

Full sized Chevys and GMC's as well as Fords do have a diesel in them if you want one.

Detroits trucks are geared by college grads and a calulater.

My 2004 Dodge Cummins gets 18MPH empty or loaded with a 6 speed. I am for ever after all these years looking for another gear. My 91 with less HP ran a 354 rear and did just fine. It could easily handle some thing in the 3:42 range or even taller. Hauling a heavy load is a breeze but with a taller gear I could pull in 5th rather than 6th.

I have seen several small 3 cyl. Perkins in rangers and S10's.

:D Al

Bleeding edge tech is ALWAYS expensive. And for those who make 6 figures a year, and there are many of them, they would not sneeze to spend $40k on this vehicle.

Currently we live in a mid sized town, ~20k people. Driving in town is most all we do, and a car liek the volt would be terrific, because we may drive 15 miles max in a day, and stop at the [way too] many stop lights.

The Volt & its peers are for urban and suburban people, who spend 25% of their time in traffic, stopped at stop lights.

I would really like to have one to play with, but of course I will never purchase one.

It is a new and unusual design, so it's not surprising that there is a premium price.

The prices for this technology will likely come down if it is sucessful and adopted in more models.


If one was truely prudent (and drives less than 45 miles), they could determine how much less it would cost to run off electricity, verses gasoline.

If it's $15 worth of juice, verses $40 of gasoline (as an example I don't know what it really is), then there may be some price justification in "energy" savings alone.

Why do we love to poo poo, new technology?

New technology ? GM had a all electric car/truck 15 years ago

There was a little company in 1975 that built a all electric car. It was about the size of the Smart Car and shaped like a splitting wedge. It didn't weigh much at all, a lady at my work place had one and the guys loved to turn it side ways in the parking slot so she had to wait for some one next to her to move so she could.
She had a love hate thing with it. A good wind pushed it around cause it was so lite, no heater and the doors didn't lock, some times in the winter the battierys would loose juice so she needed some one give her a push for a while to charge the battiers(on board charger), remember back then the only battieres were the 6v, 12v and big 24 v commerical jobs, hers were 6v in series. The ladies car was a ugly orange color.

http://www.bjharding.com/citicar/citidon.jpg

http://plsntcov.8m.com/Citicar/RS_IMG_4708.JPG

http://plsntcov.8m.com/Citicar/RS_JimLea_005.JPG

They were called citicars at first then latter they were a Comuta-car. they were made in Florida by a small company called Seabring Vangard for a number of years.

:D Al

Yes, new technology.

The Chevy Volt is not an electric car.

It is a electric/gasoline hybrid.

The is a HUGE difference between the two.

alleyooper,

You're not from Indiana are you?

For years, one of those Citicars sat in an open sided garage in the next town over from me. It was bright orange too, IIRC.

I was always intrigued by that ugly thing, and I wish that I would have inquired about it, if nothing more than to learn about the car.

Of course, I found it to be an oddity, or a relic from days gone by. I often wondered if we would see the return of the electric car, which was hard to do when a person considered that paying $1.36 for a gallon of gas was highway robbery.

Now this is a topic that I've seen before, which generally ends up in huge disagreements on internet forums.

It seems that some say the Volt is an electric car with a gasoline powered charging engine, and others say it is only a hybrid.

It is admittedly a different platform than the Prius uses, whereas the Prius uses either gasoline or electricity to power the car. The Volt does run completely on electricity all the time, even when the gas charger kicks on. GM says that 15% of the gasoline generated power (when it is on) helps power the transmission.

At any rate, no matter what you call it, I think that electric cars will need an on-board gasoline charging unit to further mileage until batteries and battery technology get better, or until electric charging stations are plentiful and easy to find.

I see both sides of the argument. I guess it boils down to how a person defines "electric car" and "hybrid".

Nonetheless, the Volt, IMO, is an exciting step towards the future.

I was working in Pontiac Michigan when the lady had the citicar.
I don't know what type of price they bring today from collectors. Saw one that was ruff for $1000.00 in Wisconsin not long ago on a old motorized collectors forum.

Yesterday on the local news (ABC 12 Flint they announced that the dealers can now sell the Demo Volts with the proper decals in just a couple of months instead of the 6 months it has been. A local dealer said that would result in a volt with 2 to 3 thousand miles on it over one with 6 to 10 thousand miles on it.

:D Al

Good points, but I get defferent information, on the Volt drivetrain, if Wiki is correct.

My vote is hybrid.

The 2011 Chevrolet Volt has a 16 kW·h (7 A·h) (10.4 kW·h usable) lithium-ion battery pack that can be charged by plugging the car into a 120-240 VAC residential electrical outlet using the provided SAE J1772-compliant charging cord. No external charging station is required.[51] The Volt is propelled by an electric motor with a peak output of 111 kW (149 hp) delivering 273 lb-ft (368 N-m) of torque. After the Volt battery has dropped to a predetermined threshold from full charge, a small naturally aspirated 1.4-liter 4-cylinder internal combustion engine (Opel's Family 0) with approximately 80 horsepower, burns premium gasoline to power a 55 kW (74 hp) generator to extend the Volt's range. Additionally, under certain conditions, when performance needs to be improved the gasoline engine can also engage the powertrain mechanically to assist propulsion directly, resulting in a slight efficiency boost. The vehicle also has a regenerative braking system. The electrical power from the generator is sent primarily to the electric motor, with the excess going to the batteries, depending on the state of charge (SOC) of the battery pack and the power demanded at the wheels.[1][52

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Volt#Drivetrain

Plow,

Based on that information, I can see why some would say the Volt is a hybrid.

Wow a motor to up keep a electric motor to keep from shorting out a generator to keep genning and a high dollar battery to replace what more could a country boy want :bouncy:

Bet trade in in five years would be just as great too .

I thought that the 'Person who sits in the Presidents Chair when not on another vacation' has set a policy of killing the coal industry. Where are all of these new fangled cars gonna get the juice to charge up if that's the case? Nuke plants? Doubt it. Solar panels from defunct government subsidized loans? Doubt it.

Sell me a simple car with roll up windows, skip the electric butt warmer seats, forget all the engine add ons to satisfy enviro nazis. Make it standard trans and simple to work on. Basicly go back to the future. Oh yea, make in America. Sell a truck version also.

AMEN-Sawmill Jim and Farmerwilly2.....another gov't lib boondoogle for the taxpayers to bail out....

My local dealer has one for demo purposes.I stopped to look at it and the salesman offered me a test drive. So, of course I took him up on it.

A bit of a heads up first, I'm a hypermiler. I drive to squeeze every mile out of every gallon of gas. I currently have a lifetime average of 43.51 mpg on my car that is rated at 28/37 hwy/city.

So on my test drive, I drove to conserve. The gauge showed 27 miles of electric range remaining when I started. I drove for 8.7 miles and when I returned to the dealership the gauge showed 23 mile remaining.

It really felt like a normal car. It seemed to handle fine and was pretty darn comfy. Because my daily commute is 110 miles round trip and the car is so pricy I would not buy it. If I lived in a big city and spent 80% of my time in town I would rather buy a Nissan Leaf and have a gas car for road trips. Alternatively, I could buy a Prius and have $16,000 left in my pocket.

Kirk

with the replacement cost of battery packs i wouldnt buy a volt/other battery car these are the cars that NEED to be leased.four years and let the dealer deal with battery issues.

The car I use for price comparison is the Honda Civic. Reliable, inexpensive, been around forever. $16k for the base unit. Add $8k, and you can have a hybrid version with 44/44mpg. So, for $16k more, you can get a Chevy Volt. At $4/gal gas, that means you'll go 176,000 miles before you break even if you ignore the cost of electricity. You have to add in engine maintenance cost on the Civic, so its not the full 176k miles. At 50 miles a day, 7 days a week, it would take the full 10 year battery life to come out ahead. You now have to spend the purchase price of the base civic for a new pack.

Here's a nice comparison between the Volt, Prius, and Leaf. They talk about battery costs.

I don't think there is any great cutting edge technology in the Volt that would justify its cost. It uses the same battery technology thats been around for years. Maybe with some small upgrades/tweaks, but thats an incremental improvement, not a breakthrough. I also disagree that the costs will come down significantly. (the $20k mentioned) If a Prius is going for $26k, and it has a small battery, unless there make some major breakthroughs... the cost is going to stay high. Maybe it will come down closer to the Leaf's $32k price tag, but I doubt it.

I also don't see plug in electrics being widely used, unless something is done with our power generation capacity. I was listening to an NPR segment, and they were talking about the problems with the grid, and needing more capacity. The next segment was about the wonders of plug in electric cars. Makes you scratch your head and think. It reminds me of the early days of home made biodiesel. As long as there were only a few early adopters, there was enough oil to go around. As more and more people got involved, the more problems there were. It went from pay a company to dispose of your greese, to they pay you. How much are the electric prices going to change when we need and aditional 25% capacity just for cars. Hopefully it will not be that bad, since the cars will use power at night when other demand is lower.

Yes, the car is probably fun to test drive. But like the "Smart" car, unless you fit its niche or are going for "eco chic", it doesn't make sense in the long run. If you're going to be driveing less than 40 miles a day, get a cheap used gas car, and you'll be $$$ ahead, even if it doesn't give you that warm fuzzy "I'm saving the planet" feeling.

I also don't see chemical batteries as the long term solution. Hydrogen/fuel cells as a power storage method makes much more sense, but talk about expensive...

Michael

Well, buy one of those fancy elec. cars that will save the planet. The funny part to me is that it has to be plugged in to recharge the batteries. Ok, but face it folks it takes fossil or nuke fuel to create elec. Since I do and have lived totally on solar for a little over 16 years, I feel I know a few things about it. It cost me much more in cost to make 1 watt of elec. then you can buy it for. So, solar won't really work either. Not to mention that it also costs companies lots of money to make quality panels. All manuf. takes fossil fuels to work the machinery. But hey, we are saving the planet right ? We use more fossil fuels to create solar panels, batteries, inverters, charge controllers, wire and on and on then if we didn't even think about it. The only reason I live off the grid , is that to live here were we want to, very very remote, we had no choice at all, as there is no grid. Given a choice, it may be a hobby , but not likely. Don't believe all the hype about global warming. That was just a scare factor designed in part by Gore and Imeld as they needed to sell all of you solar panels that they were setting up their manuf. plant to make. Neat huh ?

The planet will waste more natural resources to manufacture one little elec. crackerbox of a car then you will save driving it the rest of your lives.

That comaprison is one of the dumbest, I haver ever read.

Compare a gasoline hybrid, (that's been in production for 17 years), to a gasoline/electric hybrid and an all-electric battery powered vehicle, both of which are new designs.

For those that believe that the volt drive train is "simple" battery/motor setup (just likt the good old days), might was to read up a little more.

.

http://www.plugincars.com/exclusive-...hicle-90758.ht

I'm not buying one, but a vehicle that the reviewer drove 1200 miles, before refilling the 9.3 gallon tank, might be worth a look to some.

If this technology workd, it will be adapted to other vehicles and the drivetrain prices, should eventually come down.

So the price would be less than 46k PLUS the 30-35k TAXPAYER subsidy on each Gov't Motors Volt??

You are probably right on the price.

The Govt. had a commitment to "green technology" and this vehicle is supposed to be more "green". It's not really fair to expect perfection right out of the gate, IMO and some will never be happy with this technology.

Before we pop "Govt Motors" too much, Uncle Sam also wrote fat checks to other auto Mfgrs., inlcuding Ford, that is planning a Focus EV, for $40k and the $7500 tax credit.

Apparently they are not above feeding at the Govt trough, either and are also, not keen to giving these vehicles away.

On the news Friday night they had a story on the batterys in the volt being investgated. Seems several have started fires even buring down a house in one case.
ABC 7 Detroit.

:D Al

Yes, and here's a link to the story.


http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_new...t-fire-gm-says

I just read an article in the Wall Street Journal about an electric car company that has started up in Israel.

Seems that the leasing companies are reluctant to write leases on those cars because the depreciation is anticipated to be 70% in the first few years, whereas the deprecation rate on a gas powered car is 40%.

With a depreciation rate like that, leases on electric cars will be very expensive.

This makes me wonder if we'll see the same problem in the US with the Volt and other cars. I do think that if gas spikes or goes to the $5 a gallon range, electrics will start getting a better foothold in the marketplace.

Of course, much of this has to do with the price of electric cars, as well as the range anxiety that so many people have.

New story last evening about a volt being broad sided in a accident and the battiery bursting into flames. again inbvestgating going on.
NBC TV 4 Detroit.

:D Al

For our budget, the electric cars are still a ways off. Our Chevy Cruz gets 35 in city driving--that's with a manual shift and it's not the fancy pants more expensive Cruz Eco.

How do you like your HHR. That will be our next car when the one I'm driving with over 225,000 miles drops dead. I'd never have looked at either the Cruz or the HHR, but a friend gave me a ride and was getting 35-37 in city driving in her HHR with a manual. Liked the ride. The Cruz has great safety reviews. The HHR has almost as much room as my van and can easily be used to haul my farm stuff/animals.