To feed or not to feed; pellets w/animal fat

MariaAZ · #1 06/13/08, 07:39 PM

I have a 50 lb bag of rabbit pellets. They smell great, look nice and green... but contain animal fat. With the cost of feed going up, it sure seems a waste to not use it (it represents a good week's worth of meals for the herd), but I'm torn about feeding it to the rabbits. What would you do if you had the stuff?

therealshari · #2 06/13/08, 07:53 PM

It's common for rabbit pellets to contain some animal fat. Fat is a necessary ingredient for rabbits. Feed it to your rabbits.

MaggieJ · #3 06/13/08, 08:33 PM

I fed my rabbits pellets with animal fat for two years until I finally woke up and asked the company for the ingredients list. I doubt one bag will do them any harm, Maria, but I quite understand your mixed feelings. If you have rabbits headed for freezer camp, perhaps you could use it up on them, since they won't be around for the long haul anyway.

As a general rule, I am opposed to animal fat in rabbit feed. It may be common, but it isn't natural for an obligate herbivore to be chowing down tallow from who knows what source.

RiverPines · #4 06/13/08, 09:00 PM

I would be tossing it into the chicken feed then go buy myself some good rabbit food.

therealshari · #5 06/14/08, 09:04 AM

Perhaps I should explain that most "commercial" rabbit rations contain fat as that is a necessary ingredient to help the animal digestion. I come from a commercial background, having had a commercial doe operation in excess of 200 does and I also owned a USDA processing plant.

You may want to look up some of the studies from either Oregon State University. They conducted numerous studies on what made the best rabbit feed. Look for studies from as late as 1995. Also if you can find work done by Steve Lukefar, he's a PhD in Animal Nutrition and has published his work.

Hope that gives a better perspective.

MaggieJ · #6 06/14/08, 09:39 AM

Shari, I'm sure you are well-grounded in rabbit care and nutrition, in accordance with what has become accepted practices. However, not everyone agrees that animal source foods are appropriate for rabbits. Fats do not have to come from animal sources and, IMO, they should not for herbivores.

Look at all the problems that have resulted from feeding cattle with animal products. When you have an animal that naturally eats only plants, why would you want to feed it anything else?

Animal fat is cheap - and I believe that is why it is preferred by the feed companies over vegetable fat.

I have raised rabbits both ways, and yes, you can get big plump rabbits with superior growth rates from feeding commercial feeds. Personally I prefer my rabbits lean and I love the flavour of naturally-fed rabbit. I don't mind that they take longer to mature; pound for pound of table-ready meat, they still cost me much less to raise and I end up with a quality product that is virtually impossible to duplicate in a commercial setting. There is just no comparison.

RiverPines · #7 06/14/08, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieJ

Shari, I'm sure you are well-grounded in rabbit care and nutrition, in accordance with what has become accepted practices. However, not everyone agrees that animal source foods are appropriate for rabbits. Fats do not have to come from animal sources and, IMO, they should not for herbivores.

Look at all the problems that have resulted from feeding cattle with animal products. When you have an animal that naturally eats only plants, why would you want to feed it anything else?

Animal fat is cheap - and I believe that is why it is preferred by the feed companies over vegetable fat.

I have raised rabbits both ways, and yes, you can get big plump rabbits with superior growth rates from feeding commercial feeds. Personally I prefer my rabbits lean and I love the flavour of naturally-fed rabbit. I don't mind that they take longer to mature; pound for pound of table-ready meat, they still cost me much less to raise and I end up with a quality product that is virtually impossible to duplicate in a commercial setting. There is just no comparison.

I just have to agree with this post!

therealshari · #8 06/14/08, 11:49 AM

That is precisely why I recommend you check out the Oregon State trials and Steve Lukefar's work. He has continued to work even after leaving Oregon State.

I've been retired since 1996 and it's entirely possible there is some new research and you can find feed with the proper ratios for what you want.

Jcran · #9 06/14/08, 01:37 PM

MaggieJ, Can you elaborate on your feeding practices? I am curious to see how you do it-thanks!

MaggieJ · #10 06/14/08, 05:21 PM

JCran, I have written a great deal about natural feeding for rabbits on this forum... much of it is in the "sticky" threads at the top. Tons of information there, both from me and from other forum members.

Basically, I feed my rabbits the way they were fed until rabbit pellets became commonplace. They eat pretty much as their wild ancestors, the European rabbit, still eats. Because many of our weeds have been accidentally or intentionally brought to North America from Europe over the past few centuries, this is very easy to do.

If you think of your rabbits' diet as a pyramid, hay is the broad base. Rabbits can live on good quality hay alone, although I do not recommend it. But it is their "daily bread", so to speak, especially when fresh foods are scarce. I feed hay free choice and since the rabbits are not getting alfalfa in pellets, I feed some grass hay and some alfalfa/timothy hay.

The middle layer of the pyramid is made up of fresh foods, mainly weeds, tree branches with leaves and pasture plants like clover, alfalfa and timothy and some garden produce, if desired. In summer this layer is thicker; in winter, thinner... just as in the wild. Please see the DRAFT SAFE PLANTS sticky for details on what plants to feed. A typical feeding this time of year would be about a pound of greens per rabbit, divided into two meals and would typically contain several of the following: dandelions, sow thistle, prickly lettuce, mallow, chicory, willow, sunflower leaves, clover, alfalfa and lamb's quarters. All these - and more - are readily available within a stone's throw of our house.

The top layer - the point of the pyramid - is made up of concentrates: grain and seeds. These supply calories, fats and essential vitamins such as Vitamin E. In summer, I feed these in very small quantities because they are "hot" foods and because, in nature, they would not be ripening until later in the season. In winter, I am a little more generous with these foods, but they never make up the bulk of the diet. Nursing does and growing kits get more grain and seeds than bucks or dry does. These are foods that, if mishandled, can lead to obesity.

I didn't arrive at this feeding pattern overnight. It has evolved over the past couple of years and my rabbits do well on it. It takes longer to gather greens than to measure pellets out of a bag and it takes thought as the seasons change. It's not for everybody, but it has been working very well for me.

MariaAZ · #11 06/14/08, 05:32 PM

Shari, thank you for the information; I'll look it up. Thanks to a few of Dr. Lukefahr's papers, I feed my rabbits mostly a forage-type diet. Once they are weaned, they are put on a diet of hay/weeds & greens supplemented with grain and grain products like COB (in the summer), sweet feed (when it's cooler), chicken scratch, pigeon food & dried bread, along with any veggie or grain-based kitchen scraps I have.

Just in case anyone is interested in Dr. Lukefahr's work; here is the one that prompted me to try a forage-type diet:
Feeding of alfalfa hay with molasses blocks or crumbles to growing rabbit fryers

And this one is just plain interesting to me, not of of Dr. Lukefahr's (although he's credited as a reference). The intake and digestibility of stale bread by the domestic rabbit

Michael Leferink · #12 06/19/08, 09:40 AM

Before someone gets the wrong idea about commercial rabbit pellets, I'd like to point out that not all pellets contain animal fats. The brand we use contains no animal by-products, all the fat is derived from vegetation. I personally would not feed pellets containing animal fats to rabbits, no matter how cheap it might be. Quality feed equals healthy livestock and it's worth the extra expense.

MikeL

dlwelch · #13 06/19/08, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Leferink

Before someone gets the wrong idea about commercial rabbit pellets, I'd like to point out that not all pellets contain animal fats. The brand we use contains no animal by-products, all the fat is derived from vegetation. I personally would not feed pellets containing animal fats to rabbits, no matter how cheap it might be. Quality feed equals healthy livestock and it's worth the extra expense.

MikeL

Good point, Mike!

There are many rabbit feeds available that do not include animal
products.

I sell to a very large processor of rabbits for meat. Before they
will purchase rabbits from a producer, they must have a statement
on file from our feed company stating that no animal products are in
the formula. Fat was not the only item in question. The calcium
source *could* have been from animals as well.

Linda Welch
>buys the same feed as MikeL<

MariaAZ · #14 06/19/08, 02:29 PM

Since I had already fed some to my herd, I decided to feed off the rest of the bag. Until recently it never crossed my mind to check ingredient panels; usually, I'll open the bag, take a big whiff and taste a few pellets to see if they smell/taste "green". I'm taking this as lesson learned and will stick with the other feed I purchase (which has no animal fat) when this is gone. I DIDN'T feed it to all my rabbits; my colony prospects haven't had any since they get forage/kitchen scraps, and I'll just keep them that way.

Thanks for everyone's input!