Rats???

Willowynd · #1 01/21/10, 04:05 PM

I had an issue with rats about 6-8 weeks ago- they ate an entire litter of 10 days old baby rabbits leaving only the skin and a few bone fragments. I trapped 2 rats and have not seen any signs of them since...but last week I had a EE roo that looked like it was attacked and died in the other coop (this coop is closed up- the birds in this coop are bantams and young salmon favs and a couple young EE's). I thought it was possible since there was 2 roos in there coming to maturity they fought. Now hubby has been caring for the birds the last few days...a few days ago he told me the crippled rescue duck (who always stays outside- hates being in the coop so never goes in there) was attacked- again I thought since there is a roo in that pen he may have gotten into with him. Now today I go out and find the last roo in the other coop (my only salmon fav roo) is dead and bloody. Go to the other coop and find the duck looks like his head and body has chunks missing and one eye gone. Now I am wondering if it could be rats doing this. I put the duck in a cage for his protection and doctored his wounds- he is eating well and drinking well. I can't afford to lose anymore birds- I keep small breeding flocks. As it is now I will not be able to hatch any salmon favs out this spring as I was hoping for. The snow is hard and it is icy...so no tracks of any sort. The closed coop it would have to be something small to get in- there is one gap in the siding as that piece keeps popping its nails....no signs of large animal entry. The other coop...it is fenced off with chainlink 6 ft high. I did hear the dogs barking early this morning and the last few late nights....wishing I had gone out and checked the coops then.

||Downhome|| · #2 01/21/10, 07:42 PM

sure your only dealing with rats? maybe one of the weasel family too.

see if you can find one of those old style rat traps (like the ones they use to use in england or you could maybe fins plans for one.) they are like a wire basket and multi catch. if its any of the weasels need to get some connibears and maybe make some boxs for them (connibears kill uasually by snapping necks) though I have seen weasels in rat traps for larger weasels probably wont work .

roolover · #3 01/21/10, 09:42 PM

Rats... They say if you see one, you probably have 100, and I believe it. I read somewhere that rats are capable of metathought (thinking about thinking). Very smart, and very quick to catch on to your means of trapping them. They learn to avoid traps when their buddies get snapped.

I knew I had a problem when I discovered holes in the floor; they had chewed numerous access holes into each pen. I assume that they were living under the coop, and I have seen cats hanging out (probably looking for dinner). I did lose 3 pullets several months ago, but that attack looked more like Weasel or Mink (bite marks on the back of the head). Although I've seen them run up and down the walls with ease, I read somewhere that rats tend to attack the legs first. Who knows what they will do if they're hungry enough?

I asked everyone I knew what to do about rats. The universal response was "poison." Have you been to TSC and seen the 5 gallon buckets of rat poison? UGH, I run an organic operation here; I can't kill rats with poison!

Took a lot of research to find the NOP accepted products, and discovered that the ingredients of one product are essentially Plaster of Paris and some tasty rat treat. Apparently, POP causes extreme calcium uptake in the rat's renal system and said rat dies of natural causes (heart failure or renal failure). So, for $5.99 I bought a container of Plaster of Paris, and mixed it with peanut butter (organic, of course LOL), and coated the peanut butter balls with chicken feed. They were were gone in short order, and I have not seen any rats since! If you try this, make sure you put the rat balls in a place where the chickens will not eat them!

Helena · #4 01/21/10, 09:55 PM

Now it being winter I don't know what to tell you about the poison for rats. In the wrmer weather we will chase the chickens out into their outside pen at nights for a few nights and put the loose rat poison covered with peanut butter. The rats ..literally eat it up and find them dead in a few days. how many birds do you have ?? and can you cage them and put the poison out for the rats. I hate rats !! they will eat the eggs and eat the baby pigeons we have in the coop too. Maybe call cooperative extension and see if they have any winter ideas on rats...Or sit up there at night with a flash light and a 22 and....good hunting. ( when we first move to the homestead many years ago we would actually do this with the 22..would find the rats sleeping with the goats during the night..ugh !!)

LFRJ · #5 01/21/10, 10:38 PM

We had a bad rat problem one spring. I spent a lot of $ on expensive means to rid them. Zappers, pellet guns, snaps, traps, live traps, bucket traps...on and on. In the end, the poison was the only successful solution. I had to bait very, very carefully - but thankfully, I didn't lose any birds.

Willowynd · #6 01/22/10, 12:02 AM

My issue with poisoning is if a dead rat is laying around, one of the dogs could eat the rat and be poisoned. That is why I was live trapping them. I may have to go get me a .22 and spend some time in the coops. I am up most of the night anyhow.

Willowynd · #7 01/22/10, 12:13 AM

Will a rat that has eaten plaster of paris be poisonous to a dog if it eats it?

seagullplayer · #8 01/22/10, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willowynd

Will a rat that has eaten plaster of paris be poisonous to a dog if it eats it?

No, most dogs will chew around on a rat without eating it.

You can put wire over the top of a five gallon bucket, leaving about a 1/12" space at one side, big enought for a rodent, too small for your chickens to get in. Put a handfull of rat poison in the bucket and lay it on it's side next to a wall, I put a block beside it so it can not roll. The rodents will get into the bucket and eat the poison, a tablespoon of peanut butter will help them find it faster. Refill the bait everyday until you have bait remaining in the bucket, no more rats...
Put all your chicken feed up of a night, but leave a big pan of water out, you will find most dead rats at the water the next morning, if the water is not ice.

If you only caught two in a trap you only have about a 100 to go...

Good luck.

jil101ca · #9 01/22/10, 01:12 PM

I have rats in my barn, well actually they live under the old coop and come in the barn to feed. They will steal the eggs right from under the hens and feast on the grain they can get at but have never bothered the hens themselves. Now the weasel is another problem, he tried to eat my ducks....

Painted Pony · #10 01/24/10, 12:13 PM

I spoke to several vets about this before I decided to use poison because I knew my dog and chickens would eat the carcass of any they found. Every vet said it isn't a danger at all. One said the animals would have to literally watch the rat die & eat it right away to even get sick fom the poison. Vets said the poision is not able to affect a second animal once it has been metabloized by the first one. If you are really worried I was told to buy the stuff that is slow acting. Different rat poisions work at different speeds. The slower acting stuff may take several bites to kill the varmit but it also means it takes much more exposure to kill your pets.

I used the fast acting stuff because I didn't want the varmits to learn to avoid the bait before they all died. I also flooded their holes with water everytime I found one. Some actually took 15+ gallons of water to flood but I did it in the winter so even if the adults weren't in there I figured I could kill the babies. I think the combo worked because I haven't seem any signs of rodents in my barn or coops since I did all of that.

Willowynd · #11 01/26/10, 05:44 PM

Well, I beleive this is rats. We caught a young adult rat in one of the 2 traps we set- the one in the coop caught the rat....the one outside is empty. I am not discounting weasels though- how would you determine if it is rat or weasel? Will a live trap catch a weasel? If so, what would I use for bait to catch a weasel?

seagullplayer · #12 01/27/10, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willowynd

Well, I beleive this is rats. We caught a young adult rat in one of the 2 traps we set- the one in the coop caught the rat....the one outside is empty. I am not discounting weasels though- how would you determine if it is rat or weasel? Will a live trap catch a weasel? If so, what would I use for bait to catch a weasel?

I have been able to catch anything and everything with minnows, a guy at the bait shop gave me the dead ones from his tank.
Short of that I use tuna, the worse it smells the better.
A live trap should work fine, put a small amount of bait at the doorway, the rest where you normally would.

Put your rat traps under a box with one side open, they love to eat in the dark. The box also allows you to make sure they come at the trap from the correct direction. Even a cardboard box will work.

NOTE: I have never caught a weasel, just because we have never had one around...

Jennifer L. · #13 01/27/10, 11:07 AM

Weasels go on sprees and kill everything they can get their paws on. I don't think you are seeing a weasel problem. Rats kill every day or two and eat at the neck, especially, on any of the chickens I've seen eaten (and unfortunately, I've seen a lot). If you leave the body in the coop you'll see the neck taken down to the bone very delicately over another day or so, and that can only be done by very fine teeth.

I leave the body there to keep them happy until I get the poison set out, because if you remove the body that just sets another chicken up to be killed if you aren't ready to wage war on the rats. The dead chicken buys you some time.

About dogs and dead rats. I use the blue wax Havoc blocks, and got in a tizzy one time when I found two blocks missing and the dogs seemed likely to have eaten them. I called the number on the container and they assured me that my German Shepherd would have to eat something like 20 or 30 blocks to kill him, and the Lab a few less. Got down to the smaller 35-40 pound dogs and you were still talking at least a dozen or 15, although I can't remember exact numbers now. All I know is it takes a lot to kill a decent sized dog. If you were talking a toy dog, then you'd really want to be careful, but with a dead rat, they are killed by eating maybe one block, and they defecate some of it before they are dead, so a dog would not get much out of a dead rat even if they ate one all up.

I worry about the chickens with poison in the coop more than a dead rat and the dogs, and make little cages to put the wax blocks in the coop so the birds can't get at them. From what I've seen, though, the blocks hold almost no interest for the chickens. Too non-food looking to them.

Anyway, good luck with them. I hate rats and battle them constantly due to the poultry feed around the place. Just too much access to the feed for them. One thing I'd really like is a rat proof grain room.

Jennifer

Willowynd · #14 01/27/10, 06:58 PM

Thanks guys and gals...I will assume it is rats since it has only been one at a time. I am wondering why they would go for the birds though when they have access to a feeder full of chicken feed and the rabbit feeders without tops....that would be easier pickings than a young roo or a crippled duck...

mullberry · #15 01/27/10, 07:07 PM

I had trouble with rats in my hen house & they were killing my quail dead!!! I tried traps of all kind, I caught some but there was always another rat and sometimes a opossum.. I finnaly went to tractor supply co & bought a bucket full of rat poison bars with the green lable on the bucket .... no more rats!!