Protein/pig in grams vs %

[Viking]

Like everyone here, I'm trying to reduce my costs for feed. 16% is $32/100lbs, 14% around here runs about $70-$80 per 55 gallon drum, whereas straight corn is $45. I've been feeding them the straight cracked corn for about a month now, augmenting it with grass and kochia which runs anywhere from 12%-22% protein. I also have 8 tons of honey, but that's more of a treat I give them....

Their body composition is fine, and their turds seem to be fine, a lot of greens with corn mixed in. They also have access to plenty of good dirt, so I'm not concerned too much about minerals. My primary worry is that they're not getting enough protein. The forage is good, but I don't give it to them every day.

Does anyone have an idea of how many grams of protein per day a 250lb sow might need (and a 600 lb boar)? My plan is to have a free range layer flock dedicated only to producing eggs for the hogs, and want to do some rough calculations on how many eggs I'd need (@ 6 grams/egg) to produce to use that as their primary source of protein.

Thanks all and happy hoggin'

[Rogo]

=== Does anyone have an idea of how many grams of protein per day a 250lb sow might need (and a 600 lb boar)? My plan is to have a free range layer flock dedicated only to producing eggs for the hogs, and want to do some rough calculations on how many eggs I'd need (@ 6 grams/egg) to produce to use that as their primary source of protein. ===


I have no idea, but the number could change according to different sources!

My pigs get all excess eggs. My hens lay jumbo size eggs. The numbers would no doubt be different for different size eggs.

Here's egg info. I would think this is from a commercial eggery. Backyard flocks supposedly have higher numbers:

NUTRIENT Whole White Yolk


Water 37.92 g 28.90 g 8.89 g


Energy 72 kcal 17 kcal 55 kcal


Protein (N x 6.25) 6.29 g 3.60 g 2.70 g


Total Lipid (fat) 4.97 g 0.06 g 4.51 g


Ash 0.43 g 0.21 g 0.29 g


Carbohydrate, 0.39 g 0.24 g 0.61 g
by difference


Sugars, total 0.39 g 0.23 g 0.10 g


Sucrose 0.06 g 0.02 g 0.01 g


Glucose (dextrose) 0.10 g 0.11 g 0.03 g


Fructose 0.06 g 0.02 g 0.01 g


Lactose 0.06 g 0.02 g 0.01 g


Maltose 0.06 g 0.02 g 0.01 g


Galactose 0.06 g 0.02 g 0.01 g


MINERALS


Calcium, Ca 26 mg 2 mg 22 mg


Iron, Fe 0.92 mg 0.03 mg 0.46 mg


Magnesium, Mg 6 mg 4 mg 1 mg


Phosphorus, P 96 mg 5 mg 66 mg


Potassium, K 67 mg 54 mg 19 mg


Sodium, Na 70 mg 55 mg 8 mg


Zinc, Zn 0.56 mg 0.01 mg 0.39 mg


Copper, Cu 0.051 mg 0.008 mg 0.013 mg


Manganese, Mn 0.019 mg 0.004 mg 0.009 mg


Fluoride, F 0.6 mcg n/a n/a


Selenium, Se 15.8 mcg 6.6mcg 9.5 mcg


VITAMINS


Thiamin 0.035 mg 0.001 mg 0.030 mg


Riboflavin 0.239 mg 0.145 mg 0.090 mg


Niacin 0.035 mg 0.035 mg 0.004 mg


Pantothenic acid 0.719 mg 0.063 mg 0.508 mg


Vitamin B6 0.071 mg 0.063 mg 0.058 mg


Folate, total 24 mcg 1 mcg 0.013 mg


Folate, food 24 mcg 1 mcg 25 mcg


Folate, DFE 24 mcg DFE 1 mcg DFE 25 mcg DFE


Choline, total 125.5 mg n/a n/a


Betaine 0.3 mg n/a n/a


Vitamin B12 0.65 mcg 0.03 mcg 0.33 mcg


Vitamin A, IU 244 IU 0 245 IU


Vitamin A, RAE 70 mcg RAE 0 65 mcg RAE


Retinol 70 mcg 0 63 mcg


Vitamin E 0.48 mg 0 0.44 mg
(alphatocopherol)


Tocopherol, 0.01 mg 0 0.01 mg
beta


Tocopherol, 0.25 mg 0 0.23 mg
gamma


Tocopherol, 0.01 mg 0 0.01 mg
delta


Vitamin D 18 IU 0 0.01 mg


Vitamin K 0.01 mcg 0 0.1 mcg
(phylloquinone)


LIPIDS


Fatty acids, 1.550 g 0 1.624 g
total saturated


8:0 caprylic/ 0.02 g 0 0.002 g
octanoic


10:0 capric/ 0.02 g 0 0.002 g
decanoic


12:0 lauric/ 0.02 g 0 0.002 g
dodecanoic


14:0 myristic/ 0.017 g 0 0.018 g
tetradecanoic


15:0 0.002 g 0 0.002 g


16:0 palmitic/ 1.113 g 0 1.166 g
hexadecanoic


17:0 0.009 g 0 0.009 g


18:0 stearic/ 0.392 g 0 0.411 g
octadecanoic


20:0 arachidic 0.005 g 0 0.005 g


22:0 0.006 g 0 0.006 g


24:0 0.002 g 0 0.002 g


Fatty acids, 1.905 g 0 1.995 g
total
monounsaturated


14:1 0.004 g 0 0.004 g
myristoleic


16:1 0.149 g 0 0.156 g
undifferentiated


18:1 1.737 g 0 1.819 g
undifferentiated


20:1 gadoleic/ 0.014 g 0 0,015 g
eicosenoic


22:1 0.002 g 0 0.002 g
undifferentiated


Fatty acids, 0.682 g 0 0.715 g
total
polyunsaturated


18:2 0.574 g 0 0.601 g
undifferentiated


18:3 0.017 g 0 0.018 g
undifferentiated


20:4 0.071 g 0 0.074 g
undifferentiated


20:5 n-3, 0.002 g 0 0.002 g
eicosapentaeonic


22:6 n-3, 0.018 g 0 0.019 g
docohexaenoic


Cholesterol 212 mg 0 210 mg


AMINO ACIDS


Tryptophan 0.083 g 0.041 g 0.030 g


Threonine 0.278 g 0.148 g 0.117 g


Isoleucine 0.336 g 0.218 g 0.147 g


Leucine 0.544 g 0.335 g 0.238 g


Lysine 0.457 g 0.266 g 0.207 g


Methionine 0.190 g 0.132 g 0.064 g


Cystine 0.316 g 0.095 g 0.045 g


Phenylalanine 0.341 g 0.226 g 0.116 g


Tyrosine 0.250 g 0.151 g 0.115 g


Valine 0.430 g 0.267 g 0.161 g


Arginine 0.410 g 0.214 g 0.187 g


Histidine 0.154 g 0.096 g 0.071 g


Alanine 0.368 g 0.232 g 0.142 g


Aspartic acid 0.665 g 0.403 g 0.264 g


Glutamic acid 0.838 g 0.511 g 0.335 g


Glycine 0.216 g 0.136 g 0.083 g


Proline 0.257 g 0.144 g 0.110 g


Serine 0.486 g 0.263 g 0.225 g


CAROTENOIDS


Carotene, beta 5 mcg 0 15 mcg


Carotene, alpha 0 0 6 mcg


Cryptoxanthin, 4 mcg 0 6 mcg
beta

Lutein + 166 mcg 0 186 mcg
zeaxanthin

[livinzoo]

What are you planning on feeding the chickens? They need protein too. If there is a lot of bugs that will work for a little while, but then they will run out of bugs. At the local feed mill here they sell a 16% pig/ poultry food. I use it for the poultry and my pigs get dairy.

[Copperhead]

Here in WV, Southern States has a Beef Commodity Pellet at 13% for $11.50 a 100lbs. I'm using it to finish 3 hogs that are on an acre paddock. The hogs are about 200# each and I give each one about 3 lbs of the pellets daily. They would eat more, but I'm haven't finished my smokehouse, yet, so I'm not in a big hurry. They do root around in the paddock, but they don't really act hungry so I don't worry too much!

Ok, I admit it, I killed a garter snake that made the mistake of being where my wife could see it . . . and tossed it over the fence to the pigs. Now, there is absolutely no evidence that the snake ever existed, Dear!

[agmantoo]

Viking
On the cracked corn I am sure your are seeing undigested corn being passed the the animal as waste. If you will start soaking the corn in water the day prior to feeding it that waste corn passing through the pig will cease. Pigs like slop.

Here is a bit of info from a commercial feeing of pigs that may help you do your calculation.

A 50 lb pig fed free choice will reach market weight of ~240 lbs in a 115 days and will require ~600 lbs of corn and 150 lbs of soybean meal.

[wildfrogs1]

I think 23.52 grams a day without piglets

The amount would go up from there depending on the number of pigets and sizeof piglets.

[Viking]

Great input all, thanks! I'm soaking that cracked corn as we speak.

I think the formula I'll use for these eggs is "P for plenty". I'd hate to short the girls (and guy) on their protein.


Man...I'd kill for access to 13% at $11.50/100lbs!

[livinzoo]

I pay 15.8 cents a pound when I buy 1000 pounds at the mill for 16%. Is there a local mill you can buy from?

If my math is right 1 pound of 13% feed would have 0.13lbs protein per 1 pound of feed. So if you convert that to grams it is 58.97 grams of protein per pound of feed. So depending on how many pounds of feed you would normally feed.

[haypoint]

I've seen pigs die and become unable to get up when fed ground corn, ground soybeans and plenty of fresh water, living on pasture. They were overcome due to a mineral deficency. I didn't see where you were attending to those requirements. The cost of protein doesn't matter if they all die because they didn't get their required minerals.

[Lazy J]

It is not the "Protein" content that is important, it is the Amino Acid balance.

You can provide a diet that meets the daily requirement for the pig's growth, but ultimately it is linked to feed intake.

Jim

[agmantoo]

I have not seen an issue with mineral deficiency when pigs were raised on dirt. Pigs on concrete need a mineral supplement for certain. Putting iron supplement in a syringe and spraying the sow's teats is a good idea regardless.

[Viking]

My pigs are indeed on dirt and spend plenty of time with their noses in it. I'm hoping that that is giving them the minerals they need. Of course this depends on the dirt's composition.

I'll continue to monitor....I think sometimes I overthink these things, so I'll just watch closely.

[haypoint]

Originally Posted by agmantoo

I have not seen an issue with mineral deficiency when pigs were raised on dirt. Pigs on concrete need a mineral supplement for certain. Putting iron supplement in a syringe and spraying the sow's teats is a good idea regardless.

I have. Not something I want to see again. Dead 150 pounder and another unable to het her rear half up, crawling on front legs only. The fact that it was all preventable makes me angry.

But it's a free world. Believe what you want. I'll keep my pigs well supplied with minerals.
Iron shots for my babies, too.

[wildfrogs1]

Self Correction
The Sow would need 376.32 grams of 100% Protein per day.
Sorry I forgot to multiply by 16.

28+ grams = 1 oz

6 lbs of 14% feed a day

28x16x6= 2688

2688 grams of feed a day X 14% = 376.32 grams a day.

Will need more with piglets

Lysine is important.

[RW kansas hogs]

Dont forget a good mineral supplement if you have a prego sow or gilt, My father in law decided not to buy any pig supplement to mix with the cracked corn for the last 6 months and we had two small liters because of it. Our blue butt had her second liter of 8healthy pigs, But her first liter she had 16 and that was with a good feed supplement. Then our berk gilt had her liter of 3pigs and she had no supplement what so ever. So i remind him every chance i get of that, In my opinion it takes money to get money back.

[Allen W]

RW is right, there is even differences in supplements and premixes as far as animal performance.

[Lazy J]

Originally Posted by wildfrogs1

I think 23.52 grams a day without piglets

The amount would go up from there depending on the number of pigets and sizeof piglets.

Where did you get a total protein requirement in grams per day? As far as I know there are no published requirements for a total protein intake for pigs.

Jim

[wildfrogs1]

I could be wrong on the EXACT grams of protein per day.
It will vary with the size of the pig and # of little ones on her.
I corrected myself on the second post and gave the math of how I got to the grams per day.

Most land Grant schools could provide you with a published (recomended) protein requirement for max. growth. As a rule of thumb the smaller the pig the higher the protein % needs to be.

[Lazy J]

Originally Posted by wildfrogs1

I could be wrong on the EXACT grams of protein per day.
It will vary with the size of the pig and # of little ones on her.
I corrected myself on the second post and gave the math of how I got to the grams per day.

Most land Grant schools could provide you with a published (recomended) protein requirement for max. growth. As a rule of thumb the smaller the pig the higher the protein % needs to be.

The days of recommendations for merely a "protein " level are gone. The recommendatios are for specific amino concentrations and amino acid ratios. Sow amino acid requirements can be determined by the litter size.Swine nutritionists have a solid understanding of the amino acid requirements of growing pigs, the tweaks in production systems come when we know the feed intake curves and are able to adjust feed budgets to meet the needs of both the pig and the feed manufacturing system.

For backyard/hobby production we need to try and minimize over and under feeding of nutrients as best we can.

Jim