Questions about potbelly & farm pig butchering and size

[MissyMoo]

I just had a crossbreed hog butchered recently and he was part hampshire and part duroc. He was a 5 month old Boar.
I just found out he is 110 pounds hanging weight.
I thought he would be bigger hanging weight
He was skinned by the butcher - NOT scalded, as it was going to be $30. more to scald and dehair him. I paid $100. for the hog and kept him about a month before having him processed. I then paid $70. kill fee (skinned), and now am waiting the call when he is ready to be picked up at the meat locker and I think that is about .60 cents a pound.

I also just called the meat locker/processor and they told me that my hog was brought in there with NO HEAD!
I am beyond MAD at the butcherer
He was told to skin the hog instead of scalding it, NOT to behead my hog! now there will be no jaw meat for us and pig ears, etc for the dogs from that, AND that 110 lb hanging weight was NOT including the huge heavy head and skin, so clearly he was much heavier than we think.

Does anyone have any idea how much he might have weighed when alive (based on his hanging weight)?

Here are some photos of him just prior to butchering:





ALSO, I have a potbelly barrow that I want to have butchered. he is currently 5 months old and looks like he weighs 80 lbs?? I am not sure. anyway, I can tell he will be a full size PB. I was wondering if anyone could tell me what you think is the best age/size to butcher him.

[bruceki]

Live weight to hanging weight is usually around 75% for a lean hog like the one in the picture. He's lean because i can see his spine and there's a dimple at his tail.

I prefer my hogs a little fatter than that, but that's just me.

So multiplying 110 * 1.25 gets you a live weight of approximately 137.5 lbs

[KIT.S]

I, too, am interested in butchering pbp. We have been given 2 pbp's and a Juliani. We really want to roast one whole for Thanksgiving, and the more I stare at them, the more I wonder about how much meat there will be. So far, we have 21 people coming... Surely a 40-50 pound pig will come up with enough meat for 20 people... The other problem is estimating how much they actually weigh. I think I've read the taping measurement calculation for weight doesn't work as well on PBPs.

The local butchers won't deal with PBPs. One says they're pets, the other says no one is happy with them when butchered, so he won't handle them. So, we have friends coming this weekend to help us do all three. I don't have any trouble with the prep and cutting, what I've never done is the scraping. I am not necessarily looking forward to this!

Uhh, sorry, did I take over this thread?
Kit

[MissyMoo]

Thank you BRUCEKI.
I completely agree with you. I also much prefer a fatter hog, so does my family, but this pig was my first ever having butchered, and the people that raised him up almost to that size fed him a special meatmaker feed from the feed store, plus lots of grass and weeds as he was let out of his pen to free range everyday (and grass was one of his favorite foods). The people also gave him foods when they cleaned out their freezer, etc.
He ate sweet feed grain here plus the meatmaker and some grass for about a month prior to being processed.
The ONLY reason he was processed so early on age-wise and lack of fat-wise, (I wanted to get some fat on him), was because he was so aggressive. He was constantly breaking out of his pen and getting in with my goats and chickens and other pigs and fighting with the pigs, and biting (trying to eat) my goats. then when I would go in the pen to put him back in HIS own pen, he would run up to me and bite my feet and the back of my ankles - hard - as if he was trying to either attack me or eat me, so he HAD to go much sooner than I wanted. unfortunately he was too lean and small in my opinion. though he sure seemed large in person. I weigh over twice what he must've weighed and he dragged me all over the property like I was a rag doll.

[postroad]

Originally Posted by bruceki

Live weight to hanging weight is usually around 75% for a lean hog like the one in the picture. He's lean because i can see his spine and there's a dimple at his tail.

I prefer my hogs a little fatter than that, but that's just me.

So multiplying 110 * 1.25 gets you a live weight of approximately 137.5 lbs

Are my Berkshires fat enough for you?

[MissyMoo]

Hey Postroad, send some of those FINE berkshire hogs my way!
I want to buy one and cant find any near me.

Rose,
he was only here with me for about a month - maybe a bit less. I couldve swore his previous owner said he was 4 months? when I got him. in person, he was a big boy, he had some large hams on him - I'll tell ya that....kinda like those show pigs have. I dont know how much he was fed where he was before (however they REALLY spoiled him with food - so I am sure it was LOTS of food and he grazed there as they let him out to run on their farm loose everyday and he would come when they called him back to his pen).
Here he was fed ...morning a large coffee can full of meatmaker feed (medicated - supposedly with a dewormer) that was mixed with sweet feed grain - in the coffee can, plus he always had alfalfa (which he only ate between meals), plus I hand-picked him huge piles of grass everyday towards the end - as he really loved to eat it. then at night he was fed another large coffee can full of the feed/grain, plus more grass and I always made sure he had a chunk of alfalfa in his pen (plus I did sneak him a few cookies and granola bars during his time here - cause every time I took them out to my super tame potbelly sow, he begged for them). I dont know if I fed him right or not the short time he was here, as I am so new to this hog stuff, but trying to ask questions and learn from feed stores, people on here, people I buy pigs from, etc.

7 months - lean - 160lbs dressed? hmmm....sounds like maybe those figures are right?? however I am still mad about the head being missing, hahaha. well.....I guess I learned something new.

[Lazy J]

Originally Posted by MissyMoo

I also just called the meat locker/processor and they told me that my hog was brought in there with NO HEAD!
I am beyond MAD at the butcherer
He was told to skin the hog instead of scalding it, NOT to behead my hog! now there will be no jaw meat for us and pig ears, etc for the dogs from that, AND that 110 lb hanging weight was NOT including the huge heavy head and skin, so clearly he was much heavier than we think.

Removal of the head is SOP in hog butchering in most meat processing facilities. However this does not equate to no Jowl Bacon as the head is excised from the body in such a manner that keeps the jowl with the carcass. The head is not simply lopped off the body at the base of the neck.

The weight of the pig appears to be normal for boar that has been fed a feeding program that did not meet his nutrient requirements.

Jim

[Lazy J]

Originally Posted by postroad

Are my Berkshires fat enough for you?

Those photos bring back some fine memories for me Postroad! Thank you for posting them.

[postroad]

Originally Posted by MissyMoo

Hey Postroad, send some of those FINE berkshire hogs my way!
I want to buy one and cant find any near me.

I will be keeping two of the four gilts plus the boar. Weaners will be available come spring, but California is a ways off from Manitoba

[postroad]

Originally Posted by Lazy J

Those photos bring back some fine memories for me Postroad! Thank you for posting them.

They are kinda cute in their own way plus they seem easy going and friendly.

Good thing they do not know whats going to happen to two of them in a week or so.

[Gailann Schrader]

1. Perhaps the weight was about right.
2. Learn to butcher your own then you never have to deal with those kinds of costs. It's not that hard, a little gruesome, but the payoff is that you:
Learn to do your own
Know how clean it is (or not)
Learn how the guts and muscles and bones work together so you become better at animal husbandry
Get to use everything you want and deal with everything as you want.
3. I butcher PBPigs all the time (I call them Asian Heirloom Hogs). I find that no matter whether they are fatty or not, the musclature maturity is basically the same UNDER THE FAT. The meat tends to be a little paler, but not by much.
4. I butchered a 130# barrow PBP/AAH (FREE) and have a LOT of fat to render. But I make soap, feed dogs, etc. So it's perfect for me. I had two 8# hams (bone in), 16# of grind for home made sausage, houlders, shanks, ribs, offal to sort, etc.
5. If you don't castrate the PBP/AHH boars at an early age (like 2 months or less) you aren't gonna get it done without killing them. They're built a little differently. Their testicles are flush/inside the butt muscles as opposed to commercial hogs with their protruding testicles.

Good luck, good eating, good health.

Oh, and BBQ PBP/AHH ribs are divine. Simply. Divine.

Butcher your own. Invest in a firearm or have someone that has one come to dispatch the hog. Plunge a knife below the head into the heart (needs to be a long and strong knife - I don't have it quite down yet) to add to the bleed-out. OR you can simply slit the throat like you would with goats and such after the shot to the head.

Trust me. When I see animals limping or whatever now? I can "visualize" the muscle structure and know what I'm looking at. Enjoy your pigs!

[mullberry]

sorry you "LOST" your hog head. We use wiod hogs here & they are good eating but you must get a hog that is WAY,WAY bigger looking to get a lot of meat
POT BELLIES: I had 3 given to me a few years ago. They were so fat that they could hardly walk. I fed the corn for a month & butchered the three.
What a waste of corn.; those 3 hogs did not have enought meat to bother with.. they were 99% feet, head & hide!! no kidding

[Gailann Schrader]

Oh, I didn't answer your question!

I have at least three different "types" of PBP/AHH.

Long Nose (smiles to Walter in Vermont!) whom I call LN (Ellen) is a long-nosed, long-legged, LOOOOOONG-loined PBP/AHH - I'd guess 110#. I also bought her tri-colored son for my new herd boar. He looks to have the same long legs as his momma. My hog panels? If she wanted to she could jump out. My older boar? JuanPiggie? He looks like a massive concrete block on little stumpy legs with a half-snout. Petunia the only-fed-rice-to-keep-her-small gilt? Has been bred to LN's son the tricolor. Petunia is a stunted-small gilt full-sized at about 75#+ but I don't know what her true size/shape is except she's a half-snout as well. The black gilt from JuanPiggie and now-deceased Lilly is a larger half-snout.

My point is: It depends on the size you want and what their body-style is.

I will butcher my boars at about 5-6 months - 30lbs dressed out or so. BUT. They are perfect for the grill. Great size to handle for one person to kill, process, and freeze by themselves. No booms or anything needed. A comealong on a swingset? Yes. A tractor? No. However, I'm planning on following WindRidge's model and treating them as "pantries on the hoof." They'll full-grow at about a year or so. BUT each piggie only eats 1-2 cups of food A DAY. And if you want something tilled to a depth of ~6-10 inches? They are it.

YOU get to pick when you butcher. As Walter has pointed out, you could get a weaner and butcher early as well. Butcher at 2 1/2 months instead of 6 for the commercial hogs to make them easier to handle. Think suckling pig size.

[Gailann Schrader]

Mulberry: I'm sorry to hear that! Corn is a fattening agent. Next time, try hay and/or pasture for several months...

You have to remember that these PBP/AHH were down-sized (one of the things us USA Americans down-sized instead of up-sized) primarily for the pet trade. They were down-size bred to be that smaller pig. Have you researched the backstock from Asia? The Asians love fat for it's flavor and mouth-feel. We recoil from fat but think of the umami (delicious/savory - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umami) flavor of hog fat. Yum. Think bacon without fat. bleh.


Anyway. I continue to be pleased with my experiment. My friend and I figured I'm getting pork, dog food, lard, cracklins, etc. for 34¢ a lb.

They breed voraciously at an early age (pig on pig on pig with the boars from about 1 1/2 months old - well, ok, darn near from the womb...). We guesstimate that from two sows and one boar I'll have somewhere in the neighborhood of 300-400# of MEAT (bone-in) per year with all the extras for whatever I want. Not bad for the small amount I feed them.

[MissyMoo]

Gailann, I think what you are doing with the AHH/PBP is a GREAT idea and thank you for your wisdom.
I am going to take some photos of my current potbelly boar/barrow? also some pics of my 2 baby pigs and my PB sow to show you all. My problem is that I do not know if the potbelly male that I have is a boar or a barrow. He has nothing sticking out the back and I also didnt feel anything there, and you say his testicles are inside - then how will I ever know if he's able to be used for breeding or not? I wanted him for breeding and he has been breeding my sow, however I figured he was castrated so I was going to have him butchered. If he is not castrated, I would love to know. How can you tell if a PB has been castrated prior to you purchasing it? the people I bought him from for $20. said he wasnt but they bought him for a pet in the city and I dont think the girl knew as it was her friends pig anyway. I am dying to show you the male potbellies photo cause he is a solid young guy. His name is Maken. my sow's name is Bacon. I also have 2 new piglets I bought recently that are named Petunia and Porky (a gilt and a boar). they are not related, but came from the same farm. they are crossbreed pigs. Porky is what they called a poland/china/Spot pig (whatever the heck that is, hahaha) and Petunia is spot/hampshire/and either tamworth or duroc (I have to ask them again). They raise those old types of hogs. not the show types.

LazyJ, the hog was butchered on my property by a man that has a special truck for it and travels around to farms to do it on site. He has done a sheep and 2 goats for me before and when he skinned them he cut off the head at the neck, so I was just assuming since he did that before and the processor said he didnt bring it in with a head....well you see what I am saying.
and LazyJ thank you soooo much for your input as well.

Mullberry, I agree on the way way bigger part. far as the wild pigs, I have never eaten one, but wouldnt hesitate to try one if given the opportunity

Oh, and thank you ALL for your information/advice/comments. I highly respect those that know more than I and very much appreciate their input, which I why I post asking questions of you all

[MissyMoo]

postroad, I know that sucks.

[Gailann Schrader]

IF he's a barrow, the testicle area will look more "smooth" than not.

If he's breeding your sow? Does he have a corkscrew body part he's using? If so, he's a BOAR. Barrow may ride the sow, but cannot breed.

You still should see some testicle area depending on the boar. Some of my PBP/AHH have EXTREMELY visible testicles near the surface. Others? Not so much. JuanPiggie's testicle area just looks wrinkly with no exterior testicles showing...

Are you sure he didn't throw the head to the dogs? After I take off what I want, it goes to the dogs...

[MissyMoo]

Gailann, I witnessed him breeding her (corkscrew and all - YES - it looked like a really long drill bit, HAHA). He even stood on her with his corkscrew in her for several minutes before letting out and then he got tired and was really mellow after that for awhile. AND he has the SAME testicle area as your JuanPiggie has.
He has a wrinkly area with nothing extending out.

Here are some pics of Maken (my 5 month old PB boar?):





and here is a photo of Bacon (my 2 year old PB sow):



and here are my 2 new piglets I bought (spotted boar = Porky & red/white gilt = Petunia):





oh and no, he didnt throw the head to the dogs - heck, I wouldve been ok with that cause at least it didnt go to waste.

p.s. I LOVE the name of your piggies

- Theresa

[lasergrl]

he looks like a boar, just judging from the shape of his body.

[springvalley]

First of all, Postroad those are some fine lookin hogs. I tell you good butchers are hard to find and good butchers are very , very busy. I have had the same problem, that they don`t do what you tell them. And then you find a new butcher. I like my hogs around 225 to 250 for buthchering, and also like the old breed hogs.Thanks Marc