Gloucestershire Old Spot Pigs

[quailkeeper]

I had finally settled on getting Guinea Hogs for a small manageable breed of pig and even found a breeder who placed me on the waiting list, when I found an article on the GOS pigs. I loved the way they looked and was even more excited when I saw that they were approximately the same size as the Guinea Hog. A breed conservancy website stated that they are 275-300 lbs when mature. A breeder just informed me that his GOS are around 600 lbs. Anyone here raise them? What is your experience? Who is right?

[Ronney]

They are now a rare breed over here but I can assure you that 600lbs would not be out of the way for a mature GOS sow.

I have a boar that is GOS/Lge White cross and he is the biggest boar I have ever owned.

Cheers,
Ronnie

[thatcompchick]

275 when they are 'mature' is when they are ready to breed, and go to market ;-) I've seen 600lbers...

they are really cute, but the ones I've eaten have been a bit too fatty for my taste - great marbling on pasture, but they can get TOO fat.

Andrea
www.arare-breed.net

[quailkeeper]

Thanks guys! I had assumed that mature weight was "full grown won't get much bigger". I guess I will stick with the Guinea Hog.

[HiddenHollows]

We have one GOS pig that is probably around 200 and he is about a year and a few months old. He is significantly smaller than our Tamworth boar that we kept back from a litter last year.

We are selling him and our other GOS and Tams temporarily to free up time and energy to spend on getting re-organized.

If you need a small registerd GOS boar then he would be great for crosses. I was thinking he would be useful to an ossabwa breeder wanting to do crosses.

Holly

[RedHogs]

let me just say on the issue of GOS hogs, I've now owned three registered boars from high dollar breeders, these where the best of the best, One boar I had almost $800 dollars in...

These where the 3 worst boars I have ever owned.... Yes they where very well marked and novelty to own, but just junk.....

In my opinion the breed is dead, It's too far gone to really come back atleast here in the US, the UK may still have enough bloodlines to maintain herd integrity...

My intention was to sell purebreds for breeding purposes, but the quality was so bad I didn't want to be associated with those boars.

Conservation must be tempered with reality, the GOS hogs are a novelty... not a true farm animal anymore.

[bullsie]

Redhogs, can you explain a little more why you found the GOS to be so poor? What were they lacking?

Appreciate!

[JHinCA]

We have GOS and are happy with them, but we are not a big-time high-production operation. Ours have very easy-going temperaments and do well on pasture, which for us is a huge plus. They are also very tasty. They do tend to be fattier than modern pigs, but for us that is also a bonus--we like the marbling. We tell people when we sell them that they are going to be FAT pigs and so far no one has had any complaints. Our older sows are probably around 600 pounds. A guy who bought a crossbred sow from us awhile ago butchered her in January. I don't remember what the hanging weight was, but it was LARGE.

GOS boars are not at all aggressive. We borrowed one last year that seemed to sleep all the time. I would go out occasionally and make sure he was still alive! Quite a contrast to the mixed breed red pig we borrowed a couple years before. Different styles, but each of them got all the sows bred and the GOS was less stressful to have around. The owner of the red boar had him made into sausage because "It was a little like trying to keep a rhino in a pen."

HTH
Jean

[RedHogs]

Redhogs, can you explain a little more why you found the GOS to be so poor? What were they lacking?

Appreciate

first let me say, the problem with the first boar is that he was positive for PRRS... this is a real problem with the breeders of many of the heritage breed pigs.... so many don't maintain any testing or paperwork so you take the chance of getting a infected pig...

this breeder just straight up lied to me about their health status, and stole my money....while giving me a lecture on my spraying my fields.

PRRS was not a problem in his herd, all his hogs had it so he didn't see any sick pigs, Keep in mind a very large number of farms have PRRS.. a prrs infected herd looks identical to a clean herd...

The last two boars where healthy, just very, very soft.... personality wise...

If I tried to breed them to a commercial sow in a stall they would stand in the corner and pout or hide, when you moved them from one field into a barn they would scream bloody murder, the other hogs would run you over trying get in, they would just sit there and scream.....

So I tried to get them to collect using a dummy, they would just look at me funny....

I later was at a seminar and the speaker was talking about the result of long term closing of a herd and limiting the use of new blood, he was talking about large farms, but I asked about heritage breeds and specifically my problem with the retards( my name for the GOS boars ) he said that was exactly what will happen to commerical genetics if we aren't careful... he said the entire GOS breed has less genetic material available than some of the people in this room have in one barn back home.

and finally I don't have much time or patience... so problem pigs have to be culled.

Let me put it this way, I drive a new dually pickup truck, with AC, power everything, no road noise and a smooth ride....so now I'm spoiled.

If a friend comes over with a old junker, I always offer to drive...

Maybe it's just that way with the GOS.... when you have used the modern highly efficent and managment intensive style animals, the old junkers just make you want to pull your hair out... they are the classic car in the garage you pull out to show off to the neighbors and friends... they are a novelty....

and don't buy the bunk that they pasture well, of course they do... but so do durocs, the most extreme hogs the other direction and they produce twice as much meat.

[HomegrownAcres]

GOS pigs are certainly not for everyone. They appeal to those of us who like the "old junkers" and try to keep them working. There is a special feeling when you spend a lot of time with them; it is a joy if you are the right type of person and becomes work if you aren't.

You must remember that the reason to keep GOS pigs is not to produce a lot of feeder pigs, or pork, or show pigs. If you want that then you really should go with a more modern breed. Keeping GOS pigs is all about keeping the breed alive and getting enjoyment from working with an "old junker".

It is true that the breed is in trouble mainly because it is hard to find parts; hard to find pigs with the rare genetics. THAT IS WHAT IT IS ABOUT! We raise them because it is hard; because we are dedicated to the long process of bringing this breed back to the healthy status it once had. There is a relatively small group of dedicated breeders who share ideas and sources with the collective goal of getting them off the rare breeds list. We search for rare genetic strains, import new sperm, share boars. We believe that it is worth the effort and cost because our efforts will be felt long after we are gone. The extra payoff comes from the fact that GOS pigs are just plain fun, interesting, and nice to be around. Anyone can buy a York and put it in a barn where it grows fat quickly on corn and lives in its own feces. Only the dedicated can take an endangered breed and give it the clean environment and care that it needs to live a natural life. We sacrifice profits for the satisfaction of raising pigs the right way and being part of something very important, something much larger than our own needs and budget. If that appeals to you, then GOS pigs are right for you. If not, then stick with the newer breeds. To each his own. :1pig:

Homegrown Acres

[Up North]

Good post Homegrown. (Welcome to HT!) I get a bit tired of the heritage breeds getting slammed for not being as great as the factory pigs. It's so much more than just getting pork on the table when you have a heritage breed. Heather

[Lazy J]

Originally Posted by Up North

Good post Homegrown. (Welcome to HT!) I get a bit tired of the heritage breeds getting slammed for not being as great as the factory pigs. It's so much more than just getting pork on the table when you have a heritage breed. Heather

The problem comes when someone posts a "Which breed is best...." and it is answered by "Get a Tamworth/Hereford/GOS/" when they are not the best for pork production.

I love the fact that people want to raise the heritage breeds to keep them around and offer unique genetics to pork producers. However, imposing them as the "best" when someone wants to produce pork for the table efficiently is in appropriate. Of course, if the OP doesn't care how much feed they use or want a Heritage breed then by all means recommend the Heritage breeds.

As to the assertion that Durocs, Hampshire, Berkshires, et al. are Factory Breeds is quite misleadding and inappropriate. Virtually all of the hogs raised in modern confinement operations are a synthetic breed of some sort from one of the major genetic supply companies such as PIC, Danbred, Newsham, etc. The Purebred Industry continues to struggle to offer genetics to the large swine operations and is stifled by the lack of large consistent supply of gilts and boars. As a result the Purebred producers appeal to smaller commercial operations and the show pig industry. This is a shame since the purbreds have many positive aspects to offer pork producers.

Jim

[piglady]

AMEN, Homegrown. We have two old spot gilts and bred them to a large black due to the lack of a OS boar. They had large litters, great mothers, not a one of the young died and they showed the hybrid vigor. We raise outside in simple shelters and those pigs were outside in the rain and mud the next day without problems. They will get too fat if you feed them like the commercial pig but on pasture, the heritage make great pork. And, even heritage breeders drive very nice king cab dually's!

[RedHogs]

homegrown, I understand and champion the efforts to maintain this breed,

my point was that to classify the GOS as a true farm animal is not accurate, they are something you raise, because you want to... a hobby

a farm hog is something you raise for production of meat or profit with a level of economics brought into the discussion...

another later poster mentioned cross-breeding, yes that will be necessay to maintain any viabilty in the breed...

the crazy behavior, is in fact the lack of genetics,

It is not normal for hogs to be sensitive to feeding pressure, or ultra sensitive to a outside stress, it is not normal to have boars not rant heavily when they see a sow in season..... I can assure you that GOS hogs didn't do that 100 years ago.

I think the arguement could be made the GOS of today is not the GOS of past generations, the bloodlines are now too tight and they of just like the royal family, a little funny in the head...

I would argue the farm hog GOS is already extinct, it's gone and not coming back...

What's left is a shadow of it's former self...

There is no fault her to any breeders, except the one who cheats the customers ( in virginia)....

The hogs are all cousins, and kissing cousins at that...

you can't keep doing it and expect it not to have a negative effect.

[RedHogs]

The study found that endangered species had fewer motile sperm, and more abnormal sperm than non-endangered species.

More than 90% of the endangered Florida panther sperm was deemed abnormal, compared to only 25% of the sperm from a domestic cat.

The researchers also found that across all species the more genetic variation, or heterozygosity, in the animal the less abnormal and more motile their sperm.

For example, in coyotes - a non-endangered species with high heterozygosity - 90% of their sperm was deemed motile.

While making sperm is vital for life, it is a complex process prone to error.

"We often take making sperm for granted. We think that because it is an essential form of life it is easy to do," says Fitzpatrick.

"But it is an enormously complex [process] that requires genes to turn on and off at the right time."

The researchers proposed that sperm may be particularly susceptible to inbreeding because the creation of sperm relies on highly regulated developmental genes.

"The developmental processes that underlie sperm production are probably disrupted in inbred species," says Fitzpatrick.

When species with low genetic variability mate they lose the advantage of being able to acquire different, and more beneficial, genes.

I googled ............ "lack of genetic variation endagered"

[HomegrownAcres]

Redhogs said, "a farm hog is something you raise for production of meat or profit with a level of economics brought into the discussion..."

Registered GOS weaners sell for $300- $350 each. Even unregistered ones go for $150. Does that qualify? However, you are right that many GOS breeders don't do it for the money. We have other reasons.

GOS are rare but their genetics are fine, especially in the UK where they are more common, it's just hard over here to find all of the different strains, something we are working on. I can't say if they are the same as they were 100 years ago, but what breeds are? They breed quite readily, although I will admit that the boars are more docile than some other breeds. That's one of their good points.

They don't don't put on weight like traditional commercial breeds under intensive conditions, but we don't raise pigs like that. We want our pigs to grow naturally in a pasture, to put on weight at a natural pace, and provide meat with the ratio of fat and meat that we like.

Redhogs, you clearly prefer a different kind of pig raised in a different way for different reasons. But that doesn't mean that other breeds don't qualify as "farm hogs". GOS are very fine farm hogs for those farmers that understand them. I've had Duroc and Chester White and don't consider them to be appropriate "farm hogs" for my farm; although they do well for other farmers. Once again, to each his own.

[RedHogs]

now homegrown, lets get real

yes they are selling for some real dollars as breeders gilts and boars.... but not as barrows ( for meat )....

The GOS breeders are in the business of getting other people in the GOS business... it's like amway....

and I am saying the US side of the genetics is very poor, and also aggree that the UK side may be the only hope....


Now how do you know so much about my old farm???

and since you already know the type of hogs i raised,(Duroc and chester crosses)

and how I used to raise them in only one week....and considering I didn't tell you...and the barns have been gone for 6 months.


Did I buy the two little boars from you??? from one of your friends?????

Do you offer money back????

[gsteele]

We have a boar and a sow of GOS and our sow just had piglets (8). Our sow is 400lbs and the boar is just a little smaller. I really enjoy these pigs, they are more easy going than the others. They don't try and run you over when you try to feed them. They wait until you fill the bowl then mosey up to it. We've had others Lancer crosses, York crosses, Tamworth and I'll take the GOS any day.

[HomegrownAcres]

to RedHogs: "The GOS breeders are in the business of getting other people in the GOS business...". Yes, we are, but not for the reasons you seem to think. What we are trying to do is to save this fine pig from being rare and provide small farmers with a pig that will do well on small acreage with little maintenance. We are also trying to get more restaurants to sell GOS pork and get more people to eat GOS pork. The more people we can get to raise these pigs, the better it will survive as a distinct breed.

Unfortunately, many chefs don't choose to cook GOS pork because it doesn't look like the traditional meat they get from large distributors. They are used to the light colored, very lean and, IMO, cardboard tasting meat that comes from modern breed pigs. When they see the red colored, marbled meat from GOS, with the variability in cuts, they often don't know what to do with it and don't know how to creatively market it to their customers. We are working to change that, but first we have to make GOS pork much more common and desirable. Once you taste it, you realize just how marvelous it tastes. We need to get more people willing to raise it, cook it and eat it. The result of doing that will be a wider variability in genetics.

There are basically two types of pig farmers. The most common is the farmer who wants to maximize profits by raising the most marketable type of pig in the most numbers. They turn to modern breeds that do well inside large buildings in large numbers. The other type of farmer is the small farmer. Often, first time small farmers look for cheap pigs to start with. They end up with a York or Landrace cross and try to raise it in a barn, just like they see other farmers do. When they get tired of the smell, cost of feed and unpredictable temperament of their pigs, they either stop raising pigs or they start researching to find a pig that requires less feed and doesn't scare them.

That's when they become a heritage pig farmer. They learn that most of the old breeds can do well if raised outside on pasture. These pigs require less feed because they can get a majority of their dietary requirements from free grass, browse and critters living naturally on the land. The farmers also learn that their pigs are cleaner and smell better raised on pasture. Their pigs seem happier because they get to behave naturally; there is less stress for the pig and therefore less stress for the farmer. There is a tradeoff for the farmer as pastured pigs gain weight slower, but the tradeoff is worth it when the resulting pig is healthier, requires less money for feed and is much easier to manage. It is harder to sell their weaned piglets because so many people only know about white pigs selling for $40 each, but a small farmer doesn't need a large number of customers and there are increasing numbers of people, like our small farmer, who become aware of the benefits of pastured pork and are willing to pay more and travel farther to get some. This is the type of farmer who buys GOS pigs, or Large Black pigs, or Mulefoot pigs...

The OP was asking about a pig that didn't get too large. GOS pigs would work well for that but won't work well for everyone. As I said, each to his own.

As for the rest of your last posting, I'm a bit lost. Contact me directly. Let's not let this become just a discussion between you and me.

to everyone else: If you want more info about how to raise healthy pigs, go to my website: http://homegrownacres.com/pigs.html

Brian
Homegrown Acres
HomegrownAcres.com