Disbudding

homebirtha · #1 07/12/05, 11:44 AM

Oh geez, how can we do this? This little baby goat is soooo cute and sweet. I'm absolutely dreading disbudding her in the next few days. :-( It's got to be done though. Right???

obscurant · #2 07/12/05, 01:12 PM

No, it doesn't have to be done. We don't.

GoldenWood Farm · #3 07/12/05, 01:22 PM

No you don't but it is in my opinion MUCH safer to have them disbudded. I have a kid who I didn't dissbud in time.. Boy did I wish I had. He is a sweetheart but he doesn't know how to be carefull with them horns. And he is a mini goat. So I can't imagine a full size one having horns.

I won't ever keep a goat with horns if I can help it. They can get you with those horns without even meaning to. So a few seconds pain isn't horrid when you think about it. I hated disbudding mine at first. But the pain is only for a few seconds and then after its done they forget about it.

It really is up to you wether you want to deal with horns or not. Having them get caught in fences or ruining the fences. Having to watch your self around their horns. Also depending on what breed of goat you have think about how big she will get and how big her horns will be?

I just am against having horns on mine. But again it is your decision.

MotherClucker

JoyKelley · #4 07/12/05, 01:53 PM

and on the opposite side of that fence is where I sit , but explainaing that I have no small children and I feel like the goats need the horns in case any one of the 7 pit bulls and chow mix dogs belonging to our neighbors gets over the fence and past the donkey, I hope it would help them defend themselves.

I also only have mine as pets, don't milk them and don't intend to sell them. Also when I bought the original 2 does they had horns so I left them on their children just to keep the playing field fair. I also believe that they disperse heat ( big controversy) , we live in florida and it is miseralbly hot in the summer .

none of mine have ever messed with me or anyone visiting with their horns but I have never encouraged butting or let them get away with it when they were little

Antoinette · #5 07/12/05, 03:32 PM

Mine have horns and so far I have never had a problem, knock on wood. I do however, understand why you would need to disbud dairy goats, due to udder issues ect. But on the other side of the coin, I knew someone who bought a doe at an auction who didn't have horns. First, he put the doe in with his other 8 horned does, who proceeded to whip her butt. Although, I told him to move her, he didn't listen and left her in this situation for about a week, until finally he moved her to a worse situation. He tied that goat to a tree, at the mercy of any stray dog that she had no way to defend herself. Finally I begged him to sale her, and he did find a good home for her. Anyway, sometimes I am glad I have left horns on my goats, because I do sell them. And although, not always at an auction, even if I sell them to someone down the road, I don't know that they will live there forever. So I'm glad, in a way, to know they will have the horns if they need them. Especially since I have meat goats, and most meat goat people don't disbud( at least the ones I know). So likely my goats will be in with other horned goats.

Key · #6 07/12/05, 04:43 PM

My husband and I agreed to keep the horns on our Boers since it seemed easiest and safest for them, and we didn't want to risk an infection problem. Well, the problems was ultimately with the horns. Over the time we've had goats, two different times goats locked thier horns into small area (between a wooden fence once and between larger net fencing another time) that could have ultimately cost them their lives if I hadn't found them immediately. I now disbud...it is ugly but so is finding a goat stcuk like that. I almost had a heartattack finding them like that, and they are STRONG so they weren't easy to get out!
I can see both sides of this issue. Good luck with this-

okgoatgal2 · #7 07/12/05, 05:17 PM

i almost always disbudded. one year, i didn't b/c i had 10 boys out of 10 babies, all destined for the freezer anyway...when they were about 6 mo old, one swung his head, got my son about an inch below his eye-left a hole that stayed about a month. the horns aren't that good as protection against stray, maurauding dogs-an lgd is much better. they get stuck in fences, hurt like blazes when they accidentally stick you with one, and can cause damage to each other. the actual disbudding doesn't take but a few seconds and once it is over, the baby quickly forgets....have some furall spray on hand to spray on the burn IMMEDIATELY. i've never had an infection from disbudding, neither has my mom, in 20 yrs.

Meg Z · #8 07/12/05, 06:14 PM

I'm in favor of disbudding. I hate doing it, though. I get through it by visualizing what a goat who has died by being hung up in a fence looks like. I've seen two. One didn't actually die from the fence/heat/lack of water on a 100 degree day, but the dogs that found it before my dad did.

20 seconds per horn is worth it to me, and I've yet to have a kid hold it against me for longer than another 20 seconds.

Meg

computerchick · #9 07/12/05, 06:59 PM

An option to hanging on fence posts is the pvc between the horns...

Have you ever tried to handle a polled goatie? Guess my goats are too 'non butting' to even worry about it.

Andrea

GoldenWood Farm · #10 07/12/05, 07:18 PM

Yep I have almost all my goats (25 of them) are disbudded..so that is like the same as polled as they have no horns..they just arn't born without horns.

It is perfectly easy to handle them in my opinion.

MotherClucker

AnnaS · #11 07/12/05, 09:19 PM

Think of it like giving a baby a shot. It hurts and can't be explained but it's for their own good. My kids pout for about 5 seconds and then run over for petting & reassurance.

Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians · #12 07/12/05, 09:36 PM

The idea that a goat will defend themself with horns against dog or dogs is pretty weak, or you don't have dogs like we have on our road...tied to old Ford bumpers, pit bulls and rotties. Horns or not your goats are dead. We keep bigger and badder dogs and bigger guns

Yep disbud if your herd is disbudded, keep her horned if your herd is horned. Pretty simple. Goats without horns live pretty miserable lives in herds with horns. And if you want milk for your family or for sale, you can't milk a miserable milker, for long

Vicki

Misty · #13 07/12/05, 11:04 PM

Have you ever felt of a goats horn in the winter? They work as temp regulators. Yes, they can be dangerous, but they can also be helpful when holding. As far as I'm concerned, they are there for a reason. I won't buy a dehorned goat unless it is a show wether.
My husband got a horn in his ear Saturday. 16 sutures later, he has not mentioned dehorning....
We keep them.
www.geocities.com/buckshotboers2003
www.geocities.com/gonzalesshowpigs

Laura Workman · #14 07/14/05, 02:03 AM

Lots of pros and cons. Personally, I disbud. Tried it the other way and didn't like it. But hey, you didn't ask for an opinion on whether or not you should. You asked how you could, right? Have you seen it done? It's really much, much better to see it done before trying it yourself. Any goat breeder with hornless goats will either be able to do it or can put you in contact with someone who does it. The woman who does most of them around here charges $3 per kid to disbud, and wethering is free.

Do it as soon as you can. Three days is old enough. The longer you wait, the harder it is (for you and for the kid) to do a thorough job. The cute and sweet baby will look kind of funky for a few weeks, which is a darn shame, so take pictures now. After a while, she'll look fine again, as though it had never happened.

Have or borrow a good iron, one that gets hot and stays hot. Believe it or not, hotter really is better. Red hot is great. You're looking for a really quick sear so the job is done completely without too much chance for heat to get into the brain.

Most folks say to hold the iron on for 15 seconds or something like that (never done it that way). I do it in two sessions per horn. Burn for 8 seconds. Cool 30 seconds. Do the other side 8 seconds. Cool 30 seconds. Repeat on each side. This way seems less risky to me. I still worry, though. Always wondering whether I've fried their little brain, and in a few days it will swell and the whole scenario will get ugly. It's always turned out fine, though, despite my worrying.

And forget about the copper ring business, or you will surely get scurs on your kids as they grow older. Go for that glistening white cartilage that looks for all the world like bone. At the end of the second burn, pop the button off the middle of the burned part and cauterize any bleeding spots. And be sure you shave the area first or you will have flames and smoke. Not only are these intimidating, but it's darn hard to see what you're doing.

Make really sure the kid can't move. (Let me know if you need help with that.) And have the person holding the kid wear heavy gloves in case they get touched by the iron.

havenberryfarm · #15 07/14/05, 07:21 AM

I hated to do it, but disbudding wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. It was over in only a few seconds and those little bucks were butting each other again the same day. My goats put their heads down and butt eachother all the time. I am very glad that I do not have to worry about them putting an eye out in the process. Personally, I think they have a lot more fun that way. Kind of like baby-proofing. Kids are going to butt eachother. It is one of their favorite games. Why not disbud so they can do it all they want?

I have one goat with horns and one day she got her horns stuck in another doe's collar. She didn't mean to, but she almost strangled the other doe. (If you don't disbud, then you need break-away collars).

Don't get me wrong. I HATED disbudding. But I am still very glad I did it.

dragonfly65 · #16 07/14/05, 07:54 AM

When we got our 2 bred Pygora does they had horns and had not been handled except to worm, etc. The first doe had a little buck and we had him budded by the vet when we had him castrated because his mother had some pretty wicked looking horns and was ornery (she was definitely the queen of the 2). The second doe had a little doeling and we left her horns on since her mother had nice horns that curled back and out of the way. Our wether has had no problems fitting in by the others. I think it's mainly because he's the boss goat's baby. He'll butt heads with the young doe and then step back and shake his head a little and do it again. I wouldn't have had him disbudded as he was destined for the table. But he had such a beautiful coat I just had to keep him.

We can't keep collars on ours because of their long coats and catching the 3 with horns is definitely easier than catching that ornery boy. The biggest problem we've had with the horned goats is tearing up the bird netting over my chicken and duck pens and breaking through fences (although the wether seems to be just as guilty of that). Oh, yea, once the queen rammed open the door to the goat house and ripped the trim off the middle that held the latch so they could go into my garden and eat my cannas.

If you want to get your baby disbudded and don't want to do it yourself, find a good vet to do it. Ours only charged us a few dollars and I KNOW I couldn't have done it. But then I only have the 4 goats and we do have a really good livestock vet here.