Even more Newbie Questions

Terre d'Esprit · #1 07/04/05, 12:29 PM

It seems like there are a few of us who are new to goats! I really appreciated the others' questions and answers, and I have a few more. You all are very welcoming. : )

I just bought two little boer crosses, one is a saanen/boer and the other is a nubian/boer. One was born in March, the other April. They are both wethers, banded last weekend. I got them a week ago. (I read your answer to the question on banding, and I am so thankful that we decided to do that!)

I have three horses, so I have a good 3-acre pasture, and I bought them for weed control and for pets. I have been looking closely at raising meat goats, and have decided to spend about a year doing research and seeing how easy (or not!) these guys are to handle and maintain, and I will go from there. But Ernie and Bert are just pets. : )

When I got them, the breeder said they were a little lean, and she had been giving them feed/grain to get some weight on them. Because of that, because of the trauma from being moved and banded, and because we didn't yet have the horse pasture fence "goat-proofed" they have been in a 8 x 12 pen in the barn. We hope to be able to let them out soon, though we tried yesterday with a lead rope and collar, and that was a fiasco. They are now a little wary of us...

Here are my questions:

1) i am using pine bedding in the pen. I give them grass hay on the ground. I know this can't be good with the worm issue (they seem pretty suceptible). How do you clean the pens? You can't sift out the poops like you do with horses. But the bedding is relatively clean, so it also seems senseless to do a complete clean out. Should I burn it? I am hesitant to add all of that pine to my horse manure pile. How/how often do you clean the pens?

2) Given that I haven't cleaned out the pen in a week, I have increased flies. I used my natural fly spray on them this morning (vinegar, oil, dishsoap) but it's not going to get rid of them in the pen, just on them. i checked my other fly spray label (the chemical kind) and it said it was for use only on horses. It has pyrethrins in it. What do you do for flies?

3) they call to me often, as if they actually like me, and I think they do! They seem sad when I leave. : ) Horses that stay stalled for any length of time like balls and other things to play with. Is there something similar for goats?

Forgive my ignorant questions, I'm just a newbie.

I really like them, and I hope this can be the start of something good.

T

P.S. Is there a book you recommend for the really, really basics??

natybear · #2 07/04/05, 12:51 PM

1) Depending on the weather, you don't have to clean every week because of worms. Coccidiosis is the biggest threat to goats in small areas though. If you can give them feed off the ground that will help but if you can get them out as soon as possible that would be best. I don't really know about the pine in you poo pile though.

2) I use those sticky tapes, they hang from the ceiling and really cut down on the flies for us. Sometimes they catch wasps and mosquitos too.

3) Your nubian/boer cross will be the loudest and yes they do like you. for many reasons too. 1 - you feed them. 2 - you are the person they are learning to trust and see the most often. and 3 - you feed them. If you always respond to their cries they will learn that all they have to do is cry all day for you. I have a buck who likes to play with a ball but all of my goats like to play on those wooden spools from construction sites.

hope this helps! God Bless.

JoyKelley · #3 07/04/05, 01:00 PM

you can also make them sleeping platforms( they love them) , that will keep them off the ground and cleaner if you don't clean frequently. I share your pain with the bedding. After much experementing I have finally settled on wood chip bedding on a hard packed dirt floor put down thinly and then scraped out as needed, let the floor dry and rebed. Part of your fly problem could be lost food as well, have you found a waste free way to feed ? ( I asked about this myself in a thread last week) I also highly recommend the old fashion fly strips, they work the best of anything. I have also wondered about Avons skin so soft for the goats, Does anyone use it?

PS Mine won't eat anything they have stepped on and it is easy to build a hay rack for them , you can even use fencing or just improvise a wood slatted thingy. I have built 3 and it cuts way down on waste.

Terre d'Esprit · #4 07/04/05, 02:29 PM

Thank you!! I have loved your answers so far!

I have the same bedding setup as you, JoyKelley, I have pine on the hard packed dirt floor. Mine is thick, so next time I will make it thinner. I will just wait, then, until it actually seems dirty, maybe 2 weeks (especially if I can get them outside), and I'll start over.

I will try the fly strips! I love them on my back porch, so I even have some handy. I was thinking of trying those fly predator bugs, but the sticky papers seem good, too. And I have one of those stinky liquid traps. Yeah, it stinks, but it works GREAT!

I also leave both big sliding barn doors open all day, so they have a nice breeze, and all stalls and pens have fans on them. So there is some movement of the air, and fresh air.

I will definitely get them something to sleep on. I was worried that it would be a way for them to get out of the pen, but maybe if I put it in the middle, it would be too far from the sides. I noticed that they can jump quite high!! Bert starts jumping when he gets scared. Ernie never gets scared. : )

I feed them in rubber bowls, the size of large dog bowls, and i am thinking that Ernie doesn't let too much food get away!

But the hay should be off the ground, and I will see what I can fashion. I have some of those net hay bag things for horses (a total waste of money) but I would be afraid of the goats eating the netting when the hay was gone-- or even when the hay was there, but becuase they are bored!

Thank you all for your suggestions! I will come back here often. : )

T

mamajohnson · #5 07/04/05, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoyKelley

you can also make them sleeping platforms( they love them) , that will keep them off the ground and cleaner if you don't clean frequently. I share your pain with the bedding. After much experementing I have finally settled on wood chip bedding on a hard packed dirt floor put down thinly and then scraped out as needed, let the floor dry and rebed. Part of your fly problem could be lost food as well, have you found a waste free way to feed ? ( I asked about this myself in a thread last week) I also highly recommend the old fashion fly strips, they work the best of anything. I have also wondered about Avons skin so soft for the goats, Does anyone use it?

PS Mine won't eat anything they have stepped on and it is easy to build a hay rack for them , you can even use fencing or just improvise a wood slatted thingy. I have built 3 and it cuts way down on waste.

I am curious, what did you make your sleeping platforms out of? Would a skid with plywood on top work?? Never thought about doing this, and soon we will have our own little doelings added to the homestead!!! yeeehaw!!
So, I am interested in the platform idea...
thnx

JoyKelley · #6 07/04/05, 03:27 PM

several of mine are skids with wood over tops and then up on cinderblocks, some are old kitchen tables cut short (or not, they also like to get under the tall ones when they are afraid ), depending on how high they can jump up, or stack them so they can go up like stairs. Some I just built with fence posts sunk in the ground and heavy plywood tops. Alot depends on how much room you have and how willing they are to share the sleeping space with each other. ( also watch out cause around here rats like to nest under the ones on cinder blocks as they are warm , dry and close to the food)

mary,tx · #7 07/04/05, 03:37 PM

Goats need to eat all the time. Unfortunately, when you put hay on the ground, they do not eat it. As far as they are concerned, that makes it part of their litter. If you don't have something else, at least put a big muck bucket or something in there for the hay, or they will always be crying for something to fill their tummies.
mary

mary,tx · #8 07/04/05, 03:38 PM

Should also mention since you are graining them, check the label on your feed for ammonium chloride. Wethers need it in their grain to keep them from getting urinary calculi.
mary

mamajohnson · #9 07/04/05, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoyKelley

several of mine are skids with wood over tops and then up on cinderblocks, some are old kitchen tables cut short (or not, they also like to get under the tall ones when they are afraid ), depending on how high they can jump up, or stack them so they can go up like stairs. Some I just built with fence posts sunk in the ground and heavy plywood tops. Alot depends on how much room you have and how willing they are to share the sleeping space with each other. ( also watch out cause around here rats like to nest under the ones on cinder blocks as they are warm , dry and close to the food)

Thank you so much! Sounds like you can use just about anything stable.... Rats??? eww! guess I will have to fix it so we dont harbor any more of those than necessary... Thnx for the info. I know I have plenty of useable stuff hanging out for this project! lol!

Terre d'Esprit · #10 07/04/05, 04:06 PM

Oh, excellent idea!! I have cinder blocks and pallets around, and even some plywood. Bert and Ernie will have a playground soon. : )

I have been giving them hay 3x a day, but you're right, they're not eating it all, and it's going to waste. I do have some buckets that I will put in there. I used to use them for the horses' hay, but they are on pasture now and don't need a bucket full.

Ernie does like to skid his head along in his hay and then lift his head up so we can see his "hay wig."

And I am sprinkling the minerals over their feed, the breeder gave me some with the instructions. Can I get a block, like I do with the horses?

Thanks to all of you!! : )

trappmountain · #11 07/05/05, 10:35 PM

I have a mineral block but they don't touch it. But they do like the loose minerals sprinkled over the feed. I have a paved floor because that's what was there (2 years until we get the new barn) I use alot of hay on the floor ( i get free hay) and I hung a hay bag on the wall of their stall. They seem to like it. They are in the pasture all day (weather permitting) and love all the attention they can get!!! They make really great pets ( so Far ). I've only had them since May. Mine love to be walked on leashes. I started by getting them used halters and then let them drag around the leashes. Then I stood in front of them with the leashes and since they enjoy following I let them follow. Now they are out front and raring to go. Go slow with leash training. Once they learn they love it. Mine took to it pretty quickley! Also, a great way to let them run is to leave a long leash on them and see if they stick close to you if they don't you can always step on the leash. I can now leave them loose outside the pen when I am with them. If they get startled they run to me or to their stall whichever is closer.