2 1/2 month old doe with low temp

[tnd5]

I have a 2 1/2 month old doe that has gotten sick. She wasn't acting just right yesterday, so I isolated her overnight. This morning, she was in her "house" with a wet, foamy chin. Her eyes are sunken a bit. I took her temp at 10:30 am and it was 93.6! I put her on a heating pad and put some fluids in her with a syringe (35cc). She is dehydrated, but her berries are fine and she is urinating. She will eat, but not a lot. I took her temp, again at 1:30 and at 3:30. It was 98 and then 99. It is still low and I still have her on a heating pad with a towel wrapped around her. She is lethargic and keeps her head down low. Can anyone help me???

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

This is the hardest kind of posts to answer, not enough information. The problem also is...is the low temp part of the problem, or is it simply the first part of death. When a temp on a goat goes below 100, without aggressive help they are dieing. Warmed lactated ringers given IV or under the skin will help the dehydration, which is being further caused by the heating pad. 2 ounces of water by mouth is not enough, and if you don't get fluids into her now, she can not be saved.

She is the ripe age for anemia from cocci and worms. This would explain the lethargy (but so will the temp), what color are her gums and eyelids? Has she had diarrhea and for how long? Did she receive good kid care, lots of colostrum, lots of milk? Is she weaned now? Where is she getting her calories to keep warm from now? Grain, milk, browse, hay? Is she the low kid on the totem pole being pushed around alot?

Your vet or catalog supply or coop/large farm store will carry the lacated ringers, put large handful size amounts under her shoulder skin..right under the skin, as it depletes give her another one on the other side. I would put her on a sulfa both for the cocci (likely with her age) and also for the pnemonia which is what will happen next. The fluid on her chin is likely coming from her system shutting down, their lungs fill with fluid, a shot of a steriod like Dex will also help, you can't use banamine because of her low temp.

Without aggressive vet or knowledgeable breeder help you will lose this kid. Vicki

[tnd5]

Thank you, Vickie. I did all that you suggested, but I lost her tonight, anyway. She died in my lap. I really appreciate the response and help.

[tnd5]

Vicki, Sorry about the short, abrupt previous message....I was very upset. I will try to answer your questions as best as I can.
I am certified in veterinary assisting and have worked for several vets...but, that is all in TX, and all in small animal practice. We just moved to SC in July and I do not know any vets here, yet. All the ones I called yesterday (about 10) told me they do not work with goats and do not know anyone who does. I know about the dehydration and low temperature. I know how to give fluids SQ, but could not get anyone to sell them to me(they are prescription). I did the best I could with the syringe by mouth. I gave her approximately 35-70cc of fluids w/electrolytes every hour.
Trude's gums were pale (which is a sign of anemia). She has had NO diarrhea, had wonderful kid care and showed absolutely NO signs of sickness until day before yesterday. She has had all her Vx and has been wormed on a regular basis. She was getting free feed hay, pasture and a cup of feed per day. She was a twin and she, along with her sister are quite a bit smaller than the others I have that are the same age (within a day or two). Yes, I guess you could say she is (was) the low kid on the totem pole, but she would get right in there with the rest of them. I always stick around when I feed to make sure all are eating.
Do you know where I can get the lactated ringers and Dexamethasone without a prescription? I would like to keep these things on hand at all times. I have penicillin (300,000u/mL) and LA-200 on hand, along with epinephrine. It would probably be a good idea to have Albon, also. While reading some of your posts, I saw you reference a book on Goat Medicine. Could you please tell me where you obtained this book. I am having to learn all about goats on my own, as no one around here even knows what a Pygmy goat is. The attitude on animals in my neck of the woods is.."it is just an animal and if it dies...oh, well...we'll just get another." Almost no one believes in spending money on an animal. I feel like I am up against the world, but I will not give up.
I would really appreciate any and all advice you are willing to impart to me. Again, thank you for your help.
Donna

[Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians]

So sorry you lost the kid.

Just my big ole opinion. With your techincal skill learn to fecal. Go to saanendoah.com, this way you can stop listening to anyone (like me about what to use, how much to use, when to use blah blah blah, and know when and what problems you are having. Any microscope will work, even kids ones. A doe who is anemic has blood sucking worms (hemoncous 99% of the time here) which is not being killed by your wormer (what you using?), or cocci (if you don't use prevention here you will have small stunted animals that fail to thrive, and when a small bacterial infection or something simple that a healthy doe would slough off quickly, goes through the herd it will kill the smallest of your kids. I start all my kids on prevention before they are 3 weeks old, continue until past weaning. I don't want any fecals with high cocci amounts in them, because death can be the first sign of problems, although most of the time it's scouring, and usually by the time they have scoured the intestine is scarred and ruined and the kid simply never grows to their potential.

pipevet.com sells lactated ringers, Dex, Banamine, Bo-se, Naxcel are all vet scripts that I keep around all the time. You can use OTC's for most things, even Bo-se (selenium and E crumble) you can purchase a crumble made for horses and give it as a top dress pre breeding and prekidding, giving 400 IU of E to kids (just purchase the wallmart capsules, slit the capsule and squish the contents of it into the mouth each day for a couple of days. Tetracycline is just as good as Naxcel. Aspirin for fever and using it for an anti-inflamatory is just harder on the goat, because of the amount needed, where Dex or Banamine works fast and really good.

Goat Medicine is for sale in most goat catalogs...caprinesupply.com perhaps hoegers? but much cheaper if you go to half.com or Amazon...right now on Nubian Talk, I think yesterday a person selling all their stuff had it up for 50$. And the best advice I can give you is to find a group of goat breeders on the internet, perhaps a show group of purebred pygmy breeders (Sondra on this forum belongs to one with lots of small goat breeders)...go to Yahoogroups.com and search for goats or pygmy's, also join Nubian Talk (you do have to weed through goat political stuff, and lots of big opinions Imagine a room full of ME'S!!!, but for shear knowledge, stuff for sale, and especially the private emails, it is soo worth putting up with the crap posts. Also go to ADGA.org look up the goat club in your area, join, get the newletter, use their vets, they have already done all the work for you on finding a vet, feed, hay etc. Everyone always says there is no other goat breeders in their area, but that is rarely true. We have Boer, nigerian, pygmy (in fact she has the biggest herd of goats in the club) pet etc...in our club. Our main focus is dairy and putting on our show, but all information we get pertains (well except milk info) to all goats.

Good luck with this, and don't forget the archives here, heavens we have been gabbing about goats for years on here! Vicki

[okiemom]

Hi,

Just wanted to say i think you are doing a great job learning about goats. I know it is hard trying to self learn. The misinformation out there is great. Keep reading and keep a journal by the computer and when info is posted wright out the amounts and what teh meds/ treatment is for. Soon you will have a good reference to use. Katharine

[Sondra Peterson]

Where is SC are you now as I know a very great lady that lives in SC and will give you her email addy. The web site Vicki was refering to that I belong or belonged to is very very pet orintated but if you want the addy email me and I will give it to you just be prepared not to talk of butchering or that sort of thing HA! By the way I think you did the best you could under the circumstances.