My new goat plan

Muleman · #1 05/07/15, 02:03 PM

Ok, I know what you are saying, now what does he want to try? Wait a minute. I have given this a lot of thought. My kids are raising the Nigerians and in the last year have really focused on improving their milk genetics so they have bought them a really good little registered buck and are selling some od their does to improve their does as well, all focusing on better milk production and less of the pet market. I have to admit though, they have doen better in the pet market than I really thought they would, but they do take it serious and put in their time to make it work.

I tell you that to say my first inclination was to somehow utilize their little herd in developing a meat herd for the farm. After talking with some of you last year I realized trying to use any of their little goats in a meat program was just shrinking my meat breeds, Literally. So now what.

I determined a totally separate herd would be needed to turn out good sized goats for meat production. I would also like to produce some milk. But are those two goals necessarily not compatible? My thinking now is towards large dairy breed does, such as the Saanen I already have and crossing them with a Savannah Buck or possibly a Savannah x kiko buck. That gives me does that will turn out a good sized feeder kid, that I can also milk.

So any ideas on this? Anybody doing a similar cross? Different breeds you would choose? What I have seen at the sales is if you bring a similar sized group of feeders that look uniform they bring a good price. White Saanens x white Savannahs should give me a nice uniform set of feeders. That is my line of thinking anyway? With lots of milk to help the little pigs grow or for our own use.

HDRider · #2 05/07/15, 05:48 PM

Can't you milk meat goats?

Muleman · #3 05/07/15, 06:51 PM

Not really most are known to give barely enough milk for their own kids.

**mygoat** · #4 05/08/15, 06:56 AM

Actually, they should produce a lot of milk. They have short lactatond and udder conformation wih meat in mind, not dairy.

Muleman · #5 05/08/15, 10:10 AM

Mygoat, I do not question your information for I have have never had any of the well known meat breeds, but it does go against all of the information I have previously seen. I will look into it though and see if I can find someone in my area with good milking Boer stock or milking Saavanah stock.

I have never tried to raise the meat breeds of goats before, but I know from experience with cattle some of the best feeder producers are cows with some milk line crosses and a beef breed bull. I am basing my assumptions on goats n this same concept. I figured there is a reason you do not see many Boer dairy operations the same as you do not see many Angus milking operations. I do see people in my area with good Holstein and jersey cows crossing them with Angus and other beef breed bulls and getting good results. good growth of the feeders they are producing and good milk production. Maybe the goats are indeed much different and this same concept does not apply?

marusempai · #6 05/08/15, 10:37 AM

Last year I bred my Saanen does to a kiko buck. He was black, but let me tell you every one of those kids is white, with maybe some very faint gold markings. Out in the field they all look nearly identical. That gene that makes Saanens white is very dominant, the only way you'd get colored kids out of that first cross is if the Saanen doe was carrying recessive colored genes. If you're just looking to produce kids for meat, and do not want to keep back replacement does, I recommend the cross highly. They are very nearly as stocky as the neighbor's full kiko kids, and are growing very fast on all that milk their mamas have, plus I have as much as I want for the house. What I do is, when I want more milk, I separate the kids from their dams at night and give them a scoop of grain, and milk in the morning. If I don't separate, my girl with a single kid still gives me near half a gallon in the morning. The other one is a FF with twins and has nothing left if I leave the kids on her. I have no data on how a saanen/kiko would milk, as we won't be keeping any back - I prefer my dairies be DAIRY, as they are more predictable.

Muleman · #7 05/08/15, 10:55 AM

I really never considered keeping back does. I will only have room to pasture maybe 10 to 12 head. So my idea was to simply buy 10 or 12 good Saanen does and a top quality Saavanah buck or a Saavanah/kiko buck, which I have also heard good things about. All of the offspring would be sold as feeders, then the does milked for household milk, milk possibly to sell and milk for piglets. I was thinking if I started with a good set of does, it should be several years before I would need to consider replacing them?

My main concern is this. I have seen some good looking individual feeders run through the sale ring. They always bring less than well matched groups. So it seems to my advantage to attempt to turn out a nice group of closely matched feeders to gain more profit in that market.

marusempai · #8 05/08/15, 02:50 PM

Ah ok. I wasn't sure if you wanted to run Saanen does for the long term, or Saanen crosses. But yes - if you start with registered Saanens, your chances of getting non-matching kids - even bred to a colored buck - is fairly low. I'll try to get a good picture of mine when I go out to feed, which basically look like every F1 Saanen cross kid I've ever seen except ear variations, and they are very matchy.

Also yes, start with good young does, and you won't need replacement stock for some time. I'm a fan of keeping a rotation - they really produce a LOT less as FF. So say breed your best doe to the best Saanen buck you can come up with every two or three years to keep replacement does, and sell your worst two or three does. That way you always have up and coming does and your stock will improve over time, but you always have the same number of animals.