Can i replace all of the regular hay with hay pellets and cubes

donkeylover1 · #1 10/28/14, 07:04 PM

Hi i have 2 goats full size adults and they waste so much and sometimes won't even eat there hay is the any way i can replace all of the regular hay for alfalfa or timothy pellets also would i just feed the out of the bag or soak also how much per day in lbs please

Clovers_Clan · #2 10/28/14, 07:40 PM

I get by without hay most of the year, my goats have access to year round browse. In Georgia winter browse is relatively good and plentiful. I supplement with alfalfa pellets/oats(dry) when needed. The rare times when it gets COLD cold I do put out hay, they really need it to generate heat. I'm not sure pellets alone would work well without some browse or hay. Goats need bulk fiber to maintain good rumen function. The pellets might be too processed, they'd eat them too quickly if its their complete diet. I would think at the very least you'd have to ration them out several times a day. During the "fat" times goats are picky and waste a lot. Come winter, they'll be a lot less finicky. If you can come up with a better feeding system where they can't trample it, that might be a better solution. If they are wasting a lot maybe cut back a little so it's not free choice. Give them just enough that they're not spreading it all over the ground. Bear in mind too, if its not very good quality they will pick through it no matter what.

xymenah · #3 10/28/14, 09:01 PM

Goats need a long strand of hay to keep rumens going. I think minimum is inch and a half or two inches? If they do not have browse they need hay. You could reduce the amount of hay and increase the pellets but replacing it I would say no. Goats seem to waste alfalfa so maybe switch to grass hay of they are not thin. Do you free feed? I would stop if you do and go to twice a day feelings if they are of good weight. How are you feeding them? Are they fed on the ground, in a trough, in a hay feeder? If so what kind. While you will always have some sort of waste with hay some feeders encourage waste.

donkeylover1 · #4 10/28/14, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xymenah

Goats need a long strand of hay to keep rumens going. I think minimum is inch and a half or two inches? If they do not have browse they need hay. You could reduce the amount of hay and increase the pellets but replacing it I would say no. Goats seem to waste alfalfa so maybe switch to grass hay of they are not thin. Do you free feed? I would stop if you do and go to twice a day feelings if they are of good weight. How are you feeding them? Are they fed on the ground, in a trough, in a hay feeder? If so what kind. While you will always have some sort of waste with hay some feeders encourage waste.

Right now there getting 3 cups of sweet feed 2× a day each. They get 6 cups a day total and 2 8qt buckets full of timothy grass hay and manna pro goat minerals also they get there treats but no more the 4 per day each

**mygoat** · #5 10/28/14, 11:21 PM

What are these goats doing and what sex are they? Age, pregnant, lactating?

Hay is always going to be your cheapest feed unless you have browse. Hay is cheaper than pellets and better for them considering the fiber type. Cubes are a choking hazard. Most goats will refuse 'soaked' foods, but this may be more to do with what they're used to.

As for what feedstuff is best, we need far more information to help you decide.

Yes, they will waste hay, but it is still far cheaper and 'best' IMO. To reduce waste you can change your way of feeding to reduce pull or soiling, and the number one is increase quality. Generally if mine are wasting a lot, it's because the quality is low. They won't eat stemmy hay - they pick around the stems and eat the leafy parts. To get to the leafy parts, the'll remove the stemmy parts. That's not wasting if it wasn't really 'food' to begin with.

Use that as bedding and buy better quality hay. A good goat hay is soft, leafy, and lots of color.

Quality and quantity of feed should change with different ages, pregnancy status, lactation status etc, and your goals.

motdaugrnds · #6 10/29/14, 09:00 AM

Donkeylover 1, you stated, "...Right now there getting 3 cups of sweet feed 2× a day each. They get 6 cups a day total and 2 8qt buckets full of timothy grass hay and manna pro goat minerals also they get there treats but no more the 4 per day each..."

This would concern me in that, too much grain can produce ketosis and that is something you don't want to deal with. (I actually lost 2 of my best goats before I realized I was giving them too much grain.) Goats need more browse than grain.

**mygoat** · #7 10/29/14, 10:29 AM

Too much grain can cause obesity, and being obese is shown to cause more metabolic problems including ketosis (and milk fever). Grain does not directly cause ketosis by any pathway I've ever seen, because it's an energy deficiency. Many of those metabolic problems are linked, though, because they're all due to errors/changes in feed management.

However, I do agree that your feeding is backwards - I'd maximize hay and minimize grain for all ages/types of goat. What will change is how much grain (or any at all) and the quality of hay provided.

Frosted Mini's · #8 10/29/14, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mygoat

Hay is always going to be your cheapest feed unless you have browse. Hay is cheaper than pellets and better for them considering the fiber type.

I think that really depends. Where I live, there is a mill nearby that makes alfalfa pellets and cubes. They are really great quality (18%+ protein and green and smell great and low dust). We can buy them in big tote bags for $12.50 per cwt. That's $250 per ton. Alfalfa hay here for similar quality is $200+ per ton. So, even if my goats waste only 20% of their hay (which I'm pretty sure they waste more), they are same price, since the goats don't waste any pellets, especially with the feeder my husband just built for them. But, I do feel like they still need roughage, so I feed the pellets free choice and in winter when there is no pasture, hay and/or leaves that I have collected in the fall. A grass hay would be fine since the alfalfa is coming from pellets, but around here grass hay is same price or more than alfalfa, so I just get that and also collect leaves in bags in the fall and store as winter feed. I just drive along in town behind people's houses and grab the bags from their garbage. LOL.

sisterpine · #9 10/29/14, 02:52 PM

Hmm, now I am not really sure what to do, mine get a product called top goat that they like very much and some alfalfa pellets mixed in. they are not getting hay as I have to build /buy a hay bunk thing. The do have browse but I doubt it is their favorite kind. sis

fffarmergirl · #10 10/29/14, 03:34 PM

We have a hay feeder made for mini horses - the kind with the tray under it that catches the hay. We recently put a roof over it so the hay never gets wet. We stopped buying bedding and just use the dry wasted hay as bedding. I suppose the stuff that falls into the tray could be put back into the feeder to reduce waste further. We also have a goat that's being kept separated from the others and we feed her from a milk crate screwed down to her sleeping platform. Very little of that hay gets wasted.

**mygoat** · #11 10/29/14, 07:29 PM

Depends on price of hay - here, I buy 4x5 round bales, so probably around 700lbs each. I recall paying anywhere between 40.00 and 60.00 per bale depending on growing year, quality, type etc. That last year with the drought I think we paid 75.00-80.00 but that was far from the norm. I'm so out of the loop with prices of feed because my dad has pretty much taken over the farm, so I'd love to ask him what the price of hay is right now with this past growing season. But price is less than 200.00/ton (about 3 bales/2000lbs roughly comes to 120-180/2000lbs). Though, that is a great price for pellets I agree!

msscamp · #12 10/29/14, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donkeylover1

Hi i have 2 goats full size adults and they waste so much and sometimes won't even eat there hay is the any way i can replace all of the regular hay for alfalfa or timothy pellets also would i just feed the out of the bag or soak also how much per day in lbs please

No. The maximum amount you can substitute pellets for hay is 50%, and I've never done that. I have substituted 2 lbs of alfalfa pellets for 2 lbs of hay and had good results. Goats need long stemmed forage(hay or browse) to keep their rumens working and keep them healthy. As far as the hay waste, what cutting of hay are you feeding? Alfalfa, grass, or a mix? If alfalfa, do the flakes have a distinct purple color? Are you free choice feeding? First cutting tends to more stemmy than 2nd, 3rd, or 4th. 4th cutting tends to be the finest, but it also tends to be the hottest in terms of nutritional value, so be careful if you decide to go with that because it can cause bloat. If you are free choice feeding, consider feeding 5 lbs per goat per day, watch them and adjust as needed. It will dramatically cut down on the waste. Depending on how cold your winters get, you may have to increase to 6 lbs per day per goat.

Pony · #13 10/31/14, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donkeylover1

Right now there getting 3 cups of sweet feed 2× a day each. They get 6 cups a day total and 2 8qt buckets full of timothy grass hay and manna pro goat minerals also they get there treats but no more the 4 per day each

I'm curious as to why you're using sweet feed. That's an awful lot of sugar for a ruminant's system. What sort of treats do they get?

Are they in good - or even better than average - weight?

As Dona said, more hay, less bag. It makes for healthier and happier goats.

But they will, of course, disagree. They're goats, after all, and will insist that they must have the sweet feed or else.... LOL

kasilofhome · #14 10/31/14, 09:27 PM

Many a goat lives all winter on 100 % broke and alfaph pellets. Mine have as hay can be that hard to get at fifty cents a pound. Hay prices are 24 dollars for forty to 46 pound bales
Those bales you talk about the weigh 700 pounds are 175 dollars plus delivery.

wintrrwolf · #15 11/02/14, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kasilofhome

Many a goat lives all winter on 100 % broke and alfaph pellets. Mine have as hay can be that hard to get at fifty cents a pound. Hay prices are 24 dollars for forty to 46 pound bales
Those bales you talk about the weigh 700 pounds are 175 dollars plus delivery.

Well dang just one more reason not to EVER move to alaksa first half dozen reasons are the cold.

I just bought some Wonderful Tim/orch/clover/Lesp. bales for 3 dollars each my ladies love it and so far they have eaten every last drop.
My friends that got out of the goat business and doing hay gave me the rest of their grass hay that he was charging 4 dollars a bale for...now some of this my goats do "waste" but that's ok because I don't have to waste money on bedding either.
I do not like to feed much grain until it is called for, like during winter months or pre-kidding, and lactation.
Here alfalfa pellets 50# bag costs 16.00 at MFA and that is cheap compared to the retail stores.

kasilofhome · #16 11/02/14, 07:29 PM

Well, the does....nubs are doing well healthy enough to birth winter babies where triples are the norm and quints have happen far too often.

The live on free range from May till snow. I have tons of green berries.cranberries and lingdon. I used to worry over the lupin but the ate the so much along with the firewood that that is not as common. I've planted Timothy, clover, wheat, mustard, and cabbage patches for the as well.

It is not cheap to live in Alaska but I firmly believe it is wise to learn to provide one's own food.