My plan for getting into raising goats. Your thoughts?

Pirri · #1 12/14/13, 09:40 AM

I have been doing a lot of research and reading up on how to raise goats. This is my plan.

My plan is to start in May 2014 with 2 goats. One will be a 1-2 year old wether specifically a white Cashmere with horns. The other will be a female Nubian who has had kids and been milked before. I will have her be already pregnant or stud her out so she deliveries at an appropriate time so I will be able to handle it better. I don't want to be in the middle of February with newborns. I am currently looking for reputable breeders in my area to purchase these goats from. I live in Rehoboth, MA and if anyone has any suggestions or know anyone relatively close to my area let me know.

My goals are to clicker train the wether as a pack goat and to milk and raise babies from the Nubian. My reasons for picking these two types of goats is purely cosmetic as I like the way both types look. I know cashmere is not a breed of goat but it is what I am looking for. The picture below is an example of the look I am going for.

What do you guys think? Good Plan?
Thank,
Mark

homstdr74 · #2 12/14/13, 10:02 AM

Don't know. Sounds too planned to me. You do know that the word "capriciousness" comes from Capra, the Latin for goat? I guess what I'm trying to say is that my plans for goats never worked out the way I had planned for them to, mainly because the goats always had differing opinions.

Hope that your plan works out for you, though. Good luck.

dozedotz · #3 12/14/13, 10:49 AM

Sorry, don't know anyone to recommend in MA or close...Nubians are VERY popular so you shouldn't have too much trouble finding a good girl for breeding...obviously, the most important thing is to be sure she and her herd are regularly tested. Personally, I would re-test her before you bring her home and then test again in about 6 months just to see how it's going. No doubt the owner of the buck/stud will want to know that she has been tested before bringing her on to their property for breeding...you will want to know the background on the buck and his herd, too. Just better safe than sorry. There are lots of folks doing regular testing...it shouldn't be that difficult to find a good match for all the things you want PLUS the testing. That white goat is gorgeous...I have seen them with much longer hair than that one, however. Perhaps someone else can give you more info on that breed. Often breeders begin to sell off milking does after kidding in the spring. You need to know something about the breed standard - especially conformation - before purchasing an animal that you plan to keep for some years. You do not want to buy a doe that will not give you good service due to a sagging udder that is not attached well or due to poor legs and feet that will not support her through years of kidding. Do you know someone who can assist you with the purchase...a goat mentor? If not, there are tutorials on the web re good goat conformation and what to look out for when buying a goat. You WILL love the goat! Guaranteed! So, it is important to get an animal that suits your sense of what looks good...but that is also healthy and going to be around for a few years.

CAjerseychick · #4 12/14/13, 11:31 AM

Sounds fine! These goats are your hearts' desire GO For it! Plenty of Nubians around, there is a Cashmere goat breeder on "The Goatspot" forum (another website hope its ok to reference them).... they are in CO but may know more local breeders for you...
Goats are Fun, and yeah you may be surprised how things end up....

GraceAlice · #5 12/14/13, 12:21 PM

Well, how much are you looking to spend? In my area, Nubians who are pure and have had kids before and have NOT had mastitis... AND are tested for CL/CAE, cost around 300.00. Either that or you just can't find them.

Cashmeres... well, I haven't seen a cashmere here in my whole entire life. I think they are pretty expensive though.

Could I ask you why you want a cashmere wether? Is there a certain reason behind the wool?

I think with your plan, you will be looking to spend quite a lot of money. Those two goats in my area would cost 500.00+, not sure about yours. But good luck, goats are awesome little beings.

Pirri · #6 12/14/13, 01:37 PM

The reason for getting a cashmere wether is mainly for the look, but as well as I would like to experiment with maintaining a fiber goat. Milk, Cheese, Fiber, I am going for the try everything attempt and see what works. I have a list of breeders from the eastern cashmere association. Many of them are not that far. I am not doing this as a business so I will pay for quality. I have two daughters 3+4 so having happy healthy well maintained goats is my priority.

LomahAcres · #7 12/14/13, 01:47 PM

I would suggest planning on a 3rd goat

You never know when something will happen and you'll find yourself out a goat - better to have a backup pal. I also would be hesitant to place a horned goat and an disbudded milk goat in the same pen. It may work out just fine - just depends on their temperaments/ages, etc.

baileysclublamb · #8 12/14/13, 02:15 PM

I personally would want a doe cashmere goat. ( I know people like their wethers, but I raise sheep too, and to me, wethers are to eat) This is why... If you are going to spend the money for a nice healthy goat that is possibly hard to find, you may want to breed it. a nice healthy cashmere wether cant be that much cheaper than a doe, and if you are going to have to drive somewhere far from home, at least that doe could give you a return on your trip. Its just me, but I like to have the option for my animals to reproduce. If they are so expensive and hard to find, you may have a bit of a niche market to sell them, even if you didn't want a buck, and you had to haul your doe to get bred, you possibly could still make a decent profit on the babies, if cashmere goats are in demand where you are located. Personally, I cant afford to just have wethers around, I need my animals to pay for themselves( at least partially). You may not need them to pay for themselves, but it may be a chance to start a niche market locally. Just my opinion. Never had a cashmere goat, but that's what I would do.

GraceAlice · #9 12/14/13, 02:22 PM

Yes, putting a horned wether with a disbudded milk doe might not turn out well. And, you have to find out when and why he was wethered. He might have been wethered as a kid, but if not, he might still be a tad aggressive to your doe and maybe even the babies.

I have never had a wethered adult goat, it's always been sheep, and those sheep were horrific. Always slamming babies into the walls and under troughs. I really don't have experience with goat wethers, but I have heard they are great, as long as they are not wethered late. They might still have "buck habits" and pee on themselves... sometimes get a little rough.

I think your plan is fine, if you are really willing to take on the task. You have to really get your head into it though, if you want all three things, you are going to be learning a ton and have a lot of work on your hands. I will be honest with you, whenever you get into goats, you plan NEVER turns out exactly the right way unless you have lots of experience!

baileysclublamb · #10 12/14/13, 02:34 PM

GraceAlice- My sister has 3 ( yes 3 ) pet wether sheep. One is 6 one is 2 and one is a lamb. They are very nice to the ewes, nice to all the lambs, they are heat detectors, but other than that, you wouldn't know they weren't ewes, by their behavior. They are very sweet, the two older ones are like "uncles" to the baby lambs, they are always snuggling the little lambs, and the lambs play on their backs. Again, I wouldn't have wethers( just because they don't have babies), but hers are very nice and sweet, and I like visiting her wethers.

GraceAlice · #11 12/14/13, 02:48 PM

I'm only talking about my sheep, all of them were terrible. Even the ewes would smash other ewes' babies into things. Just my experience with them, though.

baileysclublamb · #12 12/14/13, 02:58 PM

yes, our ewes are sometimes very aggressive. Last year we lost a lamb because another ewe bashed him into the side of the barn and broke a bunch of his ribs. the really aggressive ewes find themselves at the auction( unless they have really great genetics or throw great lambs).

GraceAlice · #13 12/14/13, 03:04 PM

Yes, we had one Shrop that was 250+ lbs and slammed our smallest lamb under the feeder. Another lamb ate so fast that he inhaled food and died 30 minutes later. Another one had a baby and forgot about it 15 minutes after. Another lamb didn't know who his mom was.

Needless to say, all my sheep are animals of the past.

Especially my ram who would chase people around trees. lol ...Team Goats! lol

Anyway, I'm going to stop with the thread hijack!

baileysclublamb · #14 12/14/13, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GraceAlice

Yes, we had one Shrop that was 250+ lbs and slammed our smallest lamb under the feeder. Another lamb ate so fast that he inhaled food and died 30 minutes later. Another one had a baby and forgot about it 15 minutes after. Another lamb didn't know who his mom was.

Needless to say, all my sheep are animals of the past.

Especially my ram who would chase people around trees. lol ...Team Goats! lol

Anyway, I'm going to stop with the thread hijack!

Im more of a sheep person than a goat person( I love my goats, but I keep them for my bottle lambs. ) I raise show sheep, and they are my PASSION. I have had better luck with sheep than goats, I had a kiko doe kill a ewe, A Nubian that liked to play lamb bowling, and a mini Nubian that screamed 24/7 for no reason. She had a friend, food water and shelter. I no longer have those does, I have alpines now. Besides the escape artist doe, I love them, they get along with the sheep, and don't SCREAM at all

but I adore all my sheep. Probably because I have shown them all

I have never owned a buck, because even though rams are a pain, I cant handle buck STENCH!!! we have had rams that, given the chance would kill you. They were horrible!! but at least they didn't stink

but really, I love my Alpine girlies. I bred them to an Oberhasli buck this year, cant wait to see the babies!! ok, I wont hijack this thread anymore

GoldenWood Farm · #15 12/14/13, 11:36 PM

I want to jump in real quick on wethering bucks at a later age. The two pictures down below are of my sweet boy Toy. He was until the age of 7yrs old very much an intact buck. While intact and even after being wethered I always was able to trust him around babies (human or goat). In the photos below you can see I had him around my day old kids and I trusted him completely, he sometimes let the kids know he didn't want to be bothered but he was never mean or aggressive about it.

It TOTALLY depends on the temperament of the buck or wether on if he will be okay with babies or not in my opinion. You can wether at any age but that doesn't mean he will play nice with young kids, just the same as you can keep an intact buck and he might be nice with kids or he might be aggressive with them.

I say if you want to get a wether than go for it though, most people who like to do pack animals prefer wethers due to their more amiable nature and they tend to be just more even keel. I think it sounds like you know what you want and who is to say you can't change your mind down the road

.

Justine

redgate · #16 12/15/13, 12:54 AM

First, although looks are certainly important (I never could get over the "missing" ears of the Lamancha, even though my girl was sweet), be sure you consider all aspects. Individual breeds each have things to consider. Nubians, in general, tend to be some of the noisier and more talkative of goats. For us, that was an issue. Nubians also tend to have the higher butterfat content in the milk of the European breeds, while Saneens tend to have the production. In between those, with slightly differing amounts of production and butterfat levels, you'll find the Lamanchas, Toggenburgs, Alpines, and so forth. Make sure you have an idea of how much milk you are expecting, and then realize that they will peak about 2 months after kidding, and decrease after that. Whether you milk through or not, chances are production will go down by at least 50% around 8-10 months post freshening. Be sure to account for that when selecting your breed and/or number of milk does. Assuming you still want to stick with your selected breeds, as the PP mentioned, putting a horned goat with a milking doe may or may not be an issue. Just be aware. I would highly recommend you have the goats (any you purchase) tested for CAE and CL. The test is not expensive, and good breeders will likely have them on hand for any goat that has freshened. It is relatively pointless to test young kids, but you can ask to see the parents test results. Finally, I would not buy a mature doe that isn't at least pregnant, but preferably in milk. There are just too many risks, and you don't want to be stuck with someone's overpriced cull because it couldn't get pregnant, had a bout of severe mastitis, has small orifices, etc. Ideally, as a newbie, you need to find a doe that has an udder full of milk, and actually put her on the stand and milk her. See how it feels, how she behaves, how much she produces, and even how the milk tastes (it's rare, but there are goats that just have awful milk!). These steps may well save you a lot of heartache in the long run. Just read through these forums for examples. You'll find lots of other great info in these pages, so welcome and enjoy the journey!

GraceAlice · #17 12/15/13, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenWood Farm

I want to jump in real quick on wethering bucks at a later age. The two pictures down below are of my sweet boy Toy. He was until the age of 7yrs old very much an intact buck. While intact and even after being wethered I always was able to trust him around babies (human or goat). In the photos below you can see I had him around my day old kids and I trusted him completely, he sometimes let the kids know he didn't want to be bothered but he was never mean or aggressive about it.

It TOTALLY depends on the temperament of the buck or wether on if he will be okay with babies or not in my opinion. You can wether at any age but that doesn't mean he will play nice with young kids, just the same as you can keep an intact buck and he might be nice with kids or he might be aggressive with them.

Justine

I was just saying it as a "be aware" effect, if that makes sense. I know it can happen, but most likely it would be fine. Most wethers (and bucks) I have met were perfectly fine though.

We did have a nigerian buck that would test his little head on your knees. You have some cute goats Justine!

Especially your Black Betty doppelganger. lol

GoldenWood Farm · #18 12/15/13, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GraceAlice

You have some cute goats Justine!

Especially your Black Betty doppelganger. lol

Thank you

. Those babies in the photos are having their own babies this year

. Crazy to think they where that little at one time! How is your Black Betty doing??

Justine
PS: I get that you where just being cautious with the buck/wether topic. I have a buck right now that I wouldn't trust with kids period, not mean just not kid friendly (expect with human kids oddly enough).

GraceAlice · #19 12/15/13, 11:39 AM

Awwww! I hope you post pictures of them when they kid!

I will create a Black Betty thread just for you right now so you can see her. I've been meaning to do that. Betty is doing great and is due late January.

fadedpolaris · #20 12/15/13, 09:51 PM

My only thought is that if you want to use the wool from the Cashmere, you might not want him for a pack goat. The packs/straps, brush, etc. could damage his coat.