Disbudding question

PrettyPaisley · #1 04/01/13, 10:04 PM

Well that went over like a lead balloon today.

SO had DD crying because SO is such a softie. You would have thought I was Cruella DeVille - they made it seem like I was enjoying burning the buds off these sweet things.

I had SO hold the head of the first one because even though it was in the box it was still able to move it's head a good bit. I had gone back and watched a couple of videos, had a plan, had the clippers, read the instructions that came with the disbudder .... so I was pretty ready to go. The first one I admit I probably pushed down too hard and left it on for about 10 seconds .. and SO starts squawling to stop. Well that is the ONLY horn bud that came off. The other 13 buds (I only had 7 bucklings that looked like they were ready to go) were just fried; black on the tip, a bit of copper ring around the bud and lot of burned hair (I couldn't figure out how to make the clippers work and was too nervous about disbudding to relax and figure it out).

So do I need to redo them, alone, tomorrow? I really don't want scurs but I also don't want to brain damage these little critters!

Lizza · #2 04/01/13, 11:28 PM

I think it does help to have it clipped.

I don't do 10 seconds at once, even on bucklings. For doe's we only do about 4 seconds then stop and do the other side then go back for a few seconds. I wouldn't do 10 seconds at one time. Are these guys being wethered soon? As far as horns go it is easier to not have scurs if you wether sooner rather then later, although then there are questions on problems with the development of the urethra.

Can you post a picture?

Chickengarden · #3 04/02/13, 07:54 AM

http://saltspringsprout.wordpress.co...ets-disbudded/I took a video of our vet performing a disbudding. Piper is a doeling and 9 days old. The vet did clip her hair beforehand.
I know you've watched videos already but I thought one more might help.

Alice In TX/MO · #4 04/02/13, 08:52 AM

Wear gloves. Sit straddling the goat box. Use your non-dominant hand to hold the goat's head down to the chin support. Don't squeeze his nose shut. Burn with device in your dominant hand.

I count at LEAST to *six Mississippi* for each side and repeat.

The first few times are simply awful, and you've got that one behind you.

Huggs,
Alice

PS I've also done it straddling the goat as shown in that video.

KrisD · #5 04/02/13, 09:17 AM

That iron wasn't red and glowing, how did you get a good burn? I've always waited until it was glowing orange to do it.

Blue Run Farm · #6 04/02/13, 09:18 AM

One year when my clippers weren't working, I used scissors to cut the hair short and then shaved their bud areas with a human disposable razor. It worked

I did not pop the buds all the way off this year. Last year I did that and I was a little freaked that I could see their skulls. This year I did it like on the fiasco website, just burned good copper colored rings and burned the skin off the top of the buds. We'll see if it worked. My vet did compliment me on the one that he saw, said the rings looked good. So hopefully that is a good sign.

mammabooh · #7 04/02/13, 09:56 AM

The lady that does mine burns completely to the skull...the entire circle is white...not just a ring. I'm so glad that she's willing to do it for me, because I just can't. I bought the iron, just can't use it!

Blue Run Farm · #8 04/02/13, 11:46 AM

Mammabooh, that's how I did it last year. It just really freaked me out that the white was so clearly bone and I kept worrying about something happening. You could see the pores in the bone. If I get awful scurs this year, I'll go back to doing it that way, but I thought I'd try it the way it shows on fiasco's website this time around. My burns look just like the picture, so time will tell.

chewie · #9 04/02/13, 02:52 PM

I am SO grateful my hubby does it for me, he does it just like that video. the bad part is he's usually too busy to get to them in a timely way and that's harder on them. so every year I think I'll just do them myself next year but then it always winds up with him doing them, late again.

Laura Workman · #10 04/02/13, 03:32 PM

I do it for lots of folks around here. Here's my page of instructions: http://www.glimmercroft.com/Disbudding.html

PrettyPaisley · #11 04/02/13, 03:50 PM

Based on the video of the vet with Piper I definitely did not hold the iron on king enough. But my iron was really smoking. And when I say really-before I touched a goat with it I put it against a 2x4 and the wood squealed. I kid you not - the wood let out this sound in addition to lots of smoke. The entire tips of the iron was glowing orange each time I used it as I let it rest 15 minutes or so between each goat. Keep in mind it's brand new out of the box - never used until last night.

I think these bucklings may have had bigger buds than what that video shows. It's amazing how much bigger the male buds are vs. the female buds. The female buds are barely even large enough to feel while the male's are big.

I'll take a few pictures but basically what I have is horn buds still attached but charred. There is a copper/white ring but the bud is definitely still there - all except that one. It's totally gone. Wonder if I should strive for that and try them all again?

I hadn't though much about wethering them but I know DD wants to keep these runt so I guess I'd better give that some thought.

Thanks !!

Bret4207 · #12 04/03/13, 06:45 AM

I've been disbudding for 25 years now IIRC. All I have is the simple copper, non electric cheapie. I get it red hot, orange almost. IMO using a cool iron or not applying it long enough just ends up being harder on the animal. A really hot iron does the job efficiently and quickly. I don't shave the hair. First application singes it all away. I do right, left, for the hair singe, back to right for 5 seconds or so and then the left for the same. By now the iron is cooling. Pop the cap and see if its done. It usually is. If not get the iron orange again and 3-4 more seconds and it's done. A good copper ring. The only scurs I get are from either waiting too long to get to disbudding or from using a cool iron. Usually the whole event is over in 15-20 seconds or less. In all those years I've only have one goat show signs I "cooked" him and he was fine 2 days later, just sort of shocked acting for a day or so.

I also use a very hot propane torch for heating the copper. The little wussy ones take too long to get things hot, same with the few electric ones I've seen. If it isn't red hot it's not hot enough.

wintrrwolf · #13 04/03/13, 07:13 PM

My first time I got a brand new iron, clipped the buds so I could see them, was crouched on them like the vet did, but I held the head against my leg so I could brace, iron was red/orange and it was quick (6 mississippi)
I did not remove the cap
How can you tell if you need to re apply before you get a nasty scur growing? Just curious.

Awnry Abe · #14 04/03/13, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrettyPaisley

Well that went over like a lead balloon today.

SO had DD crying because SO is such a softie. You would have thought I was Cruella DeVille - they made it seem like I was enjoying burning the buds off these sweet things.

LOL. Same here tonight. I was chuckling at DD while I was doing it, and she thought I was laughing because I was enjoying it. It only escalated from there. These were her kids, so I guess she has a little wiggle room there.

By the way, it's been over 4 hours. When will I smell something other than singed hair?

PrettyPaisley · #15 04/04/13, 09:57 PM

Okay. I have FINALLY gotten the pictures taken and downloaded and posted. Surely there has to be an easier way. Can't I just send the pics to HT and have them post magically?

So here is what I think I have learned. I grabbed a couple of smaller males with smaller buds last night and disbudded them. There was lots more hair in the way so next time I will DEFINITELY shave the hair. I could barely see the buds and trying to hit the spot wasn't easy. BUT - 6 Mississippi was right on. 10 would have been way too long. I think I even did 8 on the first and the poor thing squawled so much I let him sleep in the garage because I didn't want him bringing trouble around. He's okay now and his little buds are gone. Flat ... no sign of any problems.

The pictures below are of the bucklings that had bigger buds. So far several buds have fallen off but last night I noticed that there were still a few with red, live (for lack of a better way to describe the spot) spots where the buds should be. I am worried now that there will be scurs.

I'm just not sure what to think about all this other than to get them when they are smaller and stop at 6 Mississippi. I guess the ones I did first will just be a learning experience and go from there.

Disbudding question - Goats

Chickengarden · #16 04/06/13, 08:22 AM

One thing our vet said to me that might be helpful is that if I see anything at all growing/getting larger to bring the girls back to him and he would do them again.
Also, when he was applying the iron he said he would hold it on for a few seconds and then let off because it was all they could stand at a time. He would give them a little rest and then singe them again. You can see him doing this as he holds the iron on the buds then lets go and then uses the side of the iron to singe the top of the buds and then applies the iron again to the base.

Shannon, I see what you mean now about how large the bucklings' buds are. If it were me I think I'd just do them again. Those buds are supposed to fall off, right? (I am just learning too.)

Alice In TX/MO · #17 04/06/13, 08:47 AM

You pick them off or knock them off.

Shygal · #18 04/06/13, 09:40 AM

Yeah, the vet is going to do mine

PrettyPaisley · #19 04/06/13, 09:56 AM

I am going to SQUEWER my dogs. It was pouring rain Thursday and Thursday night - it was cold and relentless rain so I let them all in the barn. These dogs are barely over a year but are bad at chewing so I made sure anything that looked tasty was put away.
EXCEPT - when I went to the barn Friday morning they had chewed the cord off my BRAND NEW disbudder! BRAND NEW! I had only used it on about 10 goats and I have many to do and redo. I hate these dogs ... I hate them!
So I ordered another one real quick and it should be here by Tuesday from Jeffers. I hope it's not too late.
I have a few buds on these fellows that aren't loose so I guess I will have to redo them. Some look great .. some not so much.

Awnry Abe · #20 04/06/13, 10:23 PM

That blows. Those dogs of ours... Mine is turning out to be quite expensive.

I know time=money, but in case you hadn't considered it, the cord may have been replaceable. Somebody had to put that thing together, so it surely comes apart.