Production question

CageFreeFamily · #1 02/26/13, 02:03 PM

I have a Nubian doe who kidded mid Nov. We milked her once per day for 8 weeks, then began milking twice per day as her kids passed 2 mo. She was giving about a gallon a day, but has dropped down to a half gallon per day (from two milkings) for the past couple of weeks?

My other doe (LaMancha) was still giving this much when we dried her up to be bred again.

Thoughts? Is something wrong? Is she only capable of giving a half gallon per day? Isn't this quite low for a Nubian who just kidded 91 days ago?
She gets about 3 cups of grain and 3 cups of BOSS at EACH feeding, in addition to her alfalfa and timothy grass hay. She also gets a weekly dose of Replamin Plus. She is definitely not fat, but not skinny either. Her coat (according to the person we bought her from) has always been dull and rough, and has not improved in our care despite our efforts. We were worried about her this winter because she didn't get the big heavy coat that the other 4 goats have, but she finally has. As of about a week ago she suddenly fluffed out even though our winter has been in effect since the third week in November, and we have long since passed our deepest freezes.

I can't really afford to keep a goat that gives half or a quarter as much as others, and need to figure out if there is something wrong with her that can be helped, or if it is genetic and I need to replace her.

Any help would be awesome.

Oh! One more thing. We did have a buck in with all of our goats for about two weeks because our LaMancha was in season. We never saw our Nubian flag or interact with him in anyway, and he has been gone for a week, but I thought that I would put that out there just in case.

coso · #2 02/26/13, 02:33 PM

Could be genetics. Some lines in the Nubian world do not milk well at all, and are known for short lactation period. Sounds like she has weaned her kids so she is not wanting to produce for you, does not have that "will to milk" like a true dairy goat should. Have you kept her wormed? This can affect milk production !! Could just be culling time.

CageFreeFamily · #3 02/27/13, 12:23 PM

She's definitely still letting her kids nurse during the day when they are together, and she behaves on the stand, but she's still only giving 2quarts at each milking.

I guess I will worm her again and if it doesn't improve she'll have to go.

Thanks for your input!

Alice In TX/MO · #4 02/27/13, 12:35 PM

Way way way too much BOSS. Not affecting production, but toooo much.

1/2 cup at most, each feeding.

Her kids are in the same pen? They need to be separated if you want the milk.

**mygoat** · #5 02/27/13, 12:38 PM

If the kids are nursing... try removing them.

That is *probably* where all your milk is going!

coso · #6 02/27/13, 12:58 PM

Sorry, I thought the kids had been weaned. The bigger the kids the more milk they are going to take. I had a four month old taking a gallon a day on the lambar.

Hollowdweller · #7 02/27/13, 04:16 PM

Confused. Are the kids sucking or not?

If you are putting the kids up at night and then milking her in the morning and she's giving half a gallon then she would probably be giving a full gallon with no kids .

If the kids are sucking with no restrictions and your production is essentially what they leave then you have no idea her actual production.

The only way to know the does production is to lock the kids up, completely milk out the doe and then weigh the next 2 milkings.

CageFreeFamily · #8 02/27/13, 09:26 PM

The kids are suckling during the daytime, but are separated 4 hours before the evening milking, and 12 hours before the morning milking, for a total separation time of 16 hours straight.

ETA: after the four hour separation she is giving about a quart, after the 12 hour separation she is giving about 2 quarts. Thus she is giving the same amount at 90 days post partum that our other doe gave at the very end of her milking cycle.

I have been telling Dh that he's giving too much BOSS, and even marked the feed containers to where they should be filled, but no matter how many times we talk about it, and take it down, he keeps upping the amount day by day.

I am thinking of pre-filling yogurt containers with the grain and BOSS, and storing them near the stand so that I am the one determining amounts.

Alice In TX/MO · #9 02/27/13, 10:25 PM

For some run-of-the-mill Nubians, that wouldn't be bad production.

mammabooh · #10 02/28/13, 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CageFreeFamily

I have been telling Dh that he's giving too much BOSS, and even marked the feed containers to where they should be filled, but no matter how many times we talk about it, and take it down, he keeps upping the amount day by day.

I am thinking of pre-filling yogurt containers with the grain and BOSS, and storing them near the stand so that I am the one determining amounts.

I don't know if it would work in your situation, but I mix mine in a big container when I bring it home...I do 6 parts oats to one part sunflower seeds. So, I put some in the container, stir with a broom handle, add more, stir...until I get the container full. That might work for you if you can then make sure there are no more sunflower seeds lying around for your hubby to add!

Otter · #11 02/28/13, 05:14 AM

They will "hold back" for their babies, and sometimes if they're upset. I'd guess the babies are taking more then you'd think.

Since she was giving you a gallon a day and this seems relatively sudden, I'd be inclined to think that she's holding back for her growing and demanding kids.
Also, from what you wrote in the first post, it seems the drop started when the buck was there for 2 weeks? This could also be hormonal. One of the only signs of heat I get (thanks to an overly helpful wether) is a drop in milk production.
I'm wondering if, with her poor health from before you got her, she might have a cyst, causing her cycle to drag.

Any time I hear "sudden change" as it relates to an animal, I look for all factors that changed in that time period and every possible health issue. Often, the answer will popup crystal clear then. I actually have one of those big, monthly planner notebooks just so I can write all the tiny stuff down and it really helps me get a clear picture of what's going on.

KrisD · #12 02/28/13, 06:52 AM

You're getting 3/4 gal a day with kids on her. That's not too bad. I would wean the kids, they are taking the rest of your milk. She is probably holding out milk for them.

When did you worm her last?

Hollowdweller · #13 02/28/13, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CageFreeFamily

The kids are suckling during the daytime, but are separated 4 hours before the evening milking, and 12 hours before the morning milking, for a total separation time of 16 hours straight.

ETA: after the four hour separation she is giving about a quart, after the 12 hour separation she is giving about 2 quarts. Thus she is giving the same amount at 90 days post partum that our other doe gave at the very end of her milking cycle.

well from what you are saying and as others have said, production doesn't seem way off for a nubian.

You may have made one of the fundamental discoveries of goat breeding. Some goats are better milkers!

I like a goat that is like the other you described, with a more level lactation.

In fact between two good milkers the one who milks less at peak but holds onto her milk longer, has a flatter lactation curve I like the one that is flatter because she has less of a chance of blowing out her udder attachments.

CageFreeFamily · #14 02/28/13, 03:54 PM

Alas, it is worse than I thought. The kids have been completely separated for 3 days (4 today) and there has been absolutely zero increase in milk quantity. I wish Dh would tell me these things. I have been asking him to separate the kids for two weeks, and he kept saying he wanted to wait until they were 90 days. I had no idea that they were separated. Yesterday her total give was all of 7 cups.

She was wormed about three weeks ago when she presented with inconsistently clumpy poop. That issue resolved, but now her production is so low. I can't afford to keep a goat that can only give me 2 quarts per day. I will worm her again, and breed in the summer, but I guess I will need to find her a new home with someone who doesn't need as much milk as our family.

This goat has been a learning experience in so many ways. I will never, ever again buy a goat sight unseen, which makes me sad because my other two who came all the way from KS are everything I want.

I opted to add a Nubian to our LaManchas because LM are nearly unheard of in our region. People want Boer, Nubian and Sanaan here, when they even want them. Most people in our area keep horses, cattle, and sheep, and our feed stores reflect that in what they carry. None of them even know a thing about goats or care to stock items for them.

Dang.

Alice In TX/MO · #15 02/28/13, 07:39 PM

If she's a first freshener, she may do significantly better next year. Or not.

CageFreeFamily · #16 03/02/13, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice In TX/MO

If she's a first freshener, she may do significantly better next year. Or not.

This is her fourth freshening.