New Federal Rules

dozedotz · #1 12/28/12, 09:01 AM

Does anyone on this list have an understanding of how the new Animal Traceability Rule (I think that is the name...replaces NAIS) will impact goat owners? I am reading in other places that this is 1) worse than NAIS 2) will require all animal owners to keep complete records on "chickens crossing the road for free ranging" because they are "moving around." Obviously, cost is a concern and time involved in keeping records, if this is the case! I'm understanding (I think!) that this is now in place (as of Dec. 20th) and effective as of Jan. 1st??? Anybody have a clearer understanding than I of how this will impact small herd owners who sell a few kids each year? Thanks for any information that might clear up what this new regulation will cost us in time and money (and of course, freedom).

CJBegins · #2 12/28/12, 09:28 AM

Ummmmm, this is the first I have heard about it. Time to go do some research.

ETA link to the ruling: http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usda/...entidonly=true

I honestly hadn't even heard about this until I saw this post.

Alice In TX/MO · #3 12/28/12, 09:39 AM

There were rules already in place that everyone ignored anyway. Ear tags have been required for YEARS as part of the Scrapies Eradication program.

I expect the new system will be widely ignored as well.

Josie · #4 12/28/12, 09:51 AM

http://www.agalert.com/story/?id=4961
" Sheep and goat producers would continue to conform to existing scrapie regulations. Poultry farmers also may use identification methods already required under National Poultry Improvement Plan regulations."

Josie · #5 12/28/12, 09:55 AM

I work at the local extension office. As far as the brite tags for cattle go, we are a pick up point. We have the tags available free of charge to the producer. They tell us how many they need, we record the number of tags handed out and their contact information and it is reported thru an online system to the Texas Animal Health Commission.

iloveafarmer · #6 12/28/12, 10:09 AM

Will they expect us to use an official govt tag for our LaManchas?

Alice In TX/MO · #7 12/28/12, 10:40 AM

No, and they never have.

You register and tail web tattoo LaManchas.

If you register and tattoo any goat, the eartags are not required. I travel across state lines, so I'm familiar with the whole bureaucratic mess.

Heritagefarm · #8 12/28/12, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iloveafarmer

Will they expect us to use an official govt tag for our LaManchas?

Probably a special in-ear device that will eventually malfunction and emit high-frquency sound waves, causing the goats to go insane. Next thing you know, they'll be paying all the goat owners for decapitating their LaManchas.
On the other hand it will take so long for the government to make the tag, and set up a division to oversee the new tag development, people to oversee the overseers, and then people to distribute the tags, overseers for the tag people, Bureau managers, and so much more, all for these little tags! I'm going to sign up. Sounds like a job where I won't have to do anything!

dozedotz · #9 12/28/12, 11:34 AM

Yep! Sounds like government to me. Thanks for the answers. I guess there is some reason they keeping making all these laws with which no one complies...perhaps it is to provide new government jobs to people who support government.
Alice, I know from reading here for some months that you regularly travel from MO. to Texas...do you have to get new tags each year? May be a dumb question...I honestly have never gotten any tags (our goats are PB Nubians...all with tattoos). Of course, when we purchased them I had no idea about their G6S status. We are just testing for that now. So, you learn as you go.

CaliannG · #10 12/28/12, 12:14 PM

dozedotz, if your critters are registered, even as recorded grades, with any of the common registries that require tattoos (ADGA, AGS, IDGR, ABGR, MDGR, etc., etc.) then you don't have to have tags. The only purpose of the tags is if an animal comes down with a nasty disease, such as Scrapie, TB, Bruc., etc., they can backtrack where that animal has been to find what herds may have been infected.

Since registered animals already have an identifying tattoo and a known breeder, where that animal has been can be, at least partially, traced through the registry. So no need for tags.

Alice In TX/MO · #11 12/28/12, 12:19 PM

No tags. All tattooed and papered.

We were only stopped once, coming into Texas, and my health cert was over 30 days old, so I had to get a new one on arrival at home.

The whole health cert requirement is silly, as Scrapies takes at least six months to develop. An infected animal could look fine for the 30 days between the vet check and travel, then succumb to the disease five months later. It's just a jobs program for the Texas Animal Health Commission, the Scrapies Eradication folks at the USDA, etc. Helps my vet's bottom line twice a year, too.

Squeaky McMurdo · #12 12/28/12, 01:35 PM

I have a somewhat related question. The papers for my goats say they have tattoos in their ears but I can't find any. Do you think this was a lets-not-and-say-we-did situation? They wore off? Do I need to re-do them somehow?

andabigmac · #13 12/28/12, 01:48 PM

If their ears are dark try shining a flashlight through them from the back. If they're dirty cleaning helps too.

dozedotz · #14 12/28/12, 01:56 PM

Alice, I asked our vet how long were the CAE, CL and other tests we had done when we purchased our goats reliable. He said, maybe a month!
Squeaky, I have heard that they do wear off and also that you should check for them when you purchase your goats...probably because some folks just skip it.

Heritagefarm · #15 12/28/12, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squeaky McMurdo

I have a somewhat related question. The papers for my goats say they have tattoos in their ears but I can't find any. Do you think this was a lets-not-and-say-we-did situation? They wore off? Do I need to re-do them somehow?

They may just not have done a very good job. We've had goats before where it was nearly impossible to read the tattoo, and it had ben done by a seasoned goat breeder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozedotz

Alice, I asked our vet how long were the CAE, CL and other tests we had done when we purchased our goats reliable. He said, maybe a month!
Squeaky, I have heard that they do wear off and also that you should check for them when you purchase your goats...probably because some folks just skip it.

CAE tests are reliable for quite a while. CL tests are questionable to begin with du to the nature of the disease.

Squeaky McMurdo · #16 12/28/12, 03:16 PM

I'm not going to complain too much. Mine were not only tested clear of CAE and CL the week before I got them but they were also Free. And the owners were smart enough to breed up so my doeling is going to be better than her mom. My eyeballs about popped out when I saw a QSF goat as her grandfather. I danced around a little bit. My husband thought I was weird but you guys understand. lol

The inside of her ears are grey and Cocoa's are brown so that's probably why I can't see. I'll find a flashlight.

I was just wondering how important it is that their tattoos are legible since I live in a neighborhood instead of out of the way.

Alice In TX/MO · #17 12/28/12, 03:32 PM

If you aren't selling them, it's not important at all.

The law has always been in effect for sales, and nobody paid attention anyway. If you aren't selling at an auction or transporting them across state lines, NO ONE is going to check. If you *are* transporting across state lines, I can tell you that we saw the check station manned ONCE since we bought the first goats, and I'm thinking that's going on six or seven years. I lose track.

Unless the goobermints print more money, they aren't hiring inspectors or manning those check stations. The one just inside Texas at Texarkana is a wide paved spot on the side of the road. One sign. No building, no lights, no nothing.

You're best off having healthy goats and doing however much cooperation with regulation as your comfort zone requires. Don't think the brown booted, camo wearing, gun toting USDA flunkies are showing up next week.

mekasmom · #18 12/28/12, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice In TX/MO

There were rules already in place that everyone ignored anyway. Ear tags have been required for YEARS as part of the Scrapies Eradication program.

I expect the new system will be widely ignored as well.

It's amazing how easily those tags get lost. I don't think I have ever managed to own a goat that didn't loose their tag within a few hours of coming onto the property. They are just fragile things.

**mygoat** · #19 12/28/12, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozedotz

Alice, I asked our vet how long were the CAE, CL and other tests we had done when we purchased our goats reliable. He said, maybe a month!
Squeaky, I have heard that they do wear off and also that you should check for them when you purchase your goats...probably because some folks just skip it.

Kinda wrong info coming from that vet.

The reliability of the ELISA tests (not CL) are pretty great.

The way the disease works and the immune system works, THATS where the trouble is.

Say the animal was exposed the day before, or the week before you drew blood... sometimes longer depending on the disease. Even if that animal took in enough virus to get the disease, it's immune system HAS NOT made antibodies for the virus yet. The ELISA test looks for those antibodies. If the animal hasn't produced them yet, the test can't do anything about that. Also, just because an animal HAS antibodies does not mean it has LIVE virus particles replicating in it - just that it has been exposed to the virus - and it COULD just be dead virus that the immune system is responding to (pasteurized CAE+ milk). AT this point you can do an expensive CAE PCR test which would look for virus particles floating around the bloodstream and indicate an active infection, or yo ucan just wait 6 mon-year and retest ELISA. True negative animals will have antibody titres decrease naturally.

If your animals are exposed at any time after the blood draw, you can question your herd status again as well.

This is why NO ONE TEST IS EVER INDICITIVE OF HERD HEALTH STATUS. Cannot repeat this enough. You need 2-3 tests under your belt with at least 6 months between them before you can begin to say that the probability of your goats being true positives but testing negative 3 times at 6 month intervals would be so statistically miniscule you can consider them 'clean'.

**mygoat** · #20 12/28/12, 05:18 PM

With the Scrapies program, you can also tattoo the animals with your herd identification number and an individual number so they can still trace your unregistered LaManchas.

At our sale barn, they don't want to read Tattoos so they require all animals that go through to have a scrapies TAG. So, I tag everybody. If I ever get any 'munchie eared boer crosses (quite possible, here) I'll have to ask them what to do.