Really stupid noobie goat question...

Hannah90 · #1 12/23/12, 03:00 PM

What is protocol for freshening? I.e When do you start milking? How much do I take? I get it with cows. The calf isn't going to drink it all when first born, soon they start munching hay, yadda yadda, but I can't seem to figure how to go about it with goats. When do you start separating the kids from mamma during the day/night to milk twice a day?

Donna1982 · #2 12/23/12, 03:27 PM

I am not much help because we pull everyone at birth. The doe doesn't even lick them so we are milking right away. I think most separate at two weeks but I could be wrong.

CaliannG · #3 12/23/12, 03:40 PM

It depends upon the breed, the line, and the individual doe.

Low producing does can often just have their kids drinking, and about two weeks after birth, be separated for 8-10 hours so that you can milk in the morning/evening.

High producing does will often need to be milked twice a day from day one, because they are producing far more than their kids can drink from the outset, and if you don't milk them, they can blow out teats, udders, get mastitis, all sorts of problems.

You also have to watch for problems even on low-producing does. If the kids favor one teat, and don't drink from the other teat, it can cause the doe all of the problems of a high producing doe, just on one side. If the lopsidedness gets too bad, it can damage her udder for life.

So, the answer is: It depends.

mekasmom · #4 12/23/12, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hannah90

What is protocol for freshening? I.e When do you start milking? How much do I take? I get it with cows. The calf isn't going to drink it all when first born, soon they start munching hay, yadda yadda, but I can't seem to figure how to go about it with goats. When do you start separating the kids from mamma during the day/night to milk twice a day?

Usually you would want to bottle feed doelings you are planning on keeping right away. The slaughter animals can just stay on Mom. You don't drink or use the milk for the first 2-3weeks except for freezing back some colostrum to be saved for future kids.
After the kids are 3wks old or so, separate Mom/kid at night, and milk first thing in the morning, then put the kid on. After more time goes by you can milk twice a day because the kids will be eating a lot more on their own.

Hannah90 · #5 12/23/12, 05:59 PM

Ok, this makes more sense now. This brings up another question. Why immediately bottle feed? Doesn't it make the adult a bad mom? I ONLY ask because I have heard this from other sources. I have no idea. Just wonderin'

Cyngbaeld · #6 12/23/12, 06:38 PM

I pull all the kids and bottle feed. It gives me more control over how much they eat and I know for sure how much each doe is producing and whether she is having any problems. Bottle feeding makes for easier training and care later on as the kids attach to humans better. I don't care if they are going to be good moms, since I don't like leaving the kids on the moms anyhow.

Backfourty,MI. · #7 12/23/12, 07:05 PM

1st you need to decide if you want to Dam raise or bottle feed your kids. I prefer to Dam raise ours.
If you Dam raise you'll want to wait 2 weeks before separating the kids from momma at night, milk her out in the a.m. then put the kids back with her. Normally though you only would milk once a day that way.

Unless like Caliann said & she's producing too much milk for the kids to keep up with.

Frosted Mini's · #8 12/23/12, 07:18 PM

Bottle-feeding does not a bad mother make.

The other reason for pulling at birth is for CAE prevention which means you attend every birth and take the kid before the mother so much as licks it, feed them heat treated colostrum and pasteurized milk thru weaning.

I have one doe that I let dam-raise this year. She had twins as a first freshening yearling mini alpine. She's a pretty good milker, so her kids did not empty her completely at first; I was still milking twice a day-and besides she needs to get her grain anyway...so good time to check her and get her fed. I trained the kids to take a bottle for milk-test, etc. and then sold the buckling and the doeling did not keep her empty. If I were to dam-raise all my goats, I would at the least get the babies their colostrum in a bottle since it is SO important to a newborn's survival. Then keep an eye and start separating the babies at night around 2-3 weeks of age.

Hannah90 · #9 12/23/12, 08:07 PM

This is all making more sense. I always see/hear folks talking about bottle/dam raising and I never thought to ask the difference. Why folks prefer one over the other yadda yadda. As always, different opinions are great!

CaliannG · #10 12/23/12, 09:40 PM

Okay, if you dam raise, you HAVE to be willing to spend a couple of hours per day with the kids to make sure they are tame, most especially doelings, else you are creating does who will be wild and difficult to milk. So that is important.

If you bottle raise, you just have to spend enough time to get the bottle down them, which by a couple of weeks old, they can turn a bottle inside out in seconds flat...it is amazing. At any rate, bottle feeding them cures ANY fear they might have of humans.

For me, at least, disease is not the issue, as my girls are all tested and clean. For some people, bottle raising helps them turn an iffy herd into a clean herd.

Lastly, if you pull kids at birth, the does never get attached to them, they bond with you instead. So they are easier to milk, are more willing, and they don't get upset when you sell and/or butcher the kids. A doe crying for her missing baby when that kid is in freezer camp or gone to another home is positively heartbreaking.

And no, if you bottle raise, it doesn't make does bad mothers later on if you choose to dam raise down the road. Does tend to be good mothers or bad mothers according to their personalities.

Backfourty,MI. · #11 12/24/12, 07:16 AM

Our kids are always as friendly as bottle raised babies. When we sell our kids the buyers are amazed how lovable & friendly they are. It can be done & it's not hard but you Have to spend time with your animals each day.
If your does' are friendly & like lovins more likely her kids will be too.

You don't have to bottle raise to have nice friendly kids. Some of us just prefer to dam raise & some have their reasons for bottle raising.

Everyone always says CAE prevention but if you have a clean tested herd then there shouldn't be any need for bottle raising for prevention.