Kinders

CFarmerLady · #1 11/07/12, 04:25 PM

Looking for some recommended reading and anyone who has experience with Kinders. I might be starting a small herd on my uncle's place next spring, but this depends on a great deal, and I'm really just looking for information at this point.

Alice In TX/MO · #2 11/07/12, 04:31 PM

Not many of them around. Here's the organization:

Kinder Goat Breeders Association

LoneStrChic23 · #3 11/07/12, 04:33 PM

I don't own them, but I've heard they are easy keepers.

One of our members here on HT owns them, hopefully she'll chime in soon and give you more information

briargrove · #4 11/08/12, 12:38 PM

I have 2 Kinder does and one wether. I have only had them for a few months so I'm not much of a resource. There is a yahoo group for Kinder breeders with some good info in the archives.

grandma12703 · #5 11/08/12, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoneStrChic23

I don't own them, but I've heard they are easy keepers.

One of our members here on HT owns them, hopefully she'll chime in soon and give you more information

She is a good source of information. She helped me when I first got a few of them but I can't remember what her name is on here.

colemangirly · #6 11/09/12, 06:10 AM

Here I am. Sorry I am late. Things are busy around here. Yes, I have Kinder goats, several in fact. I have around 11 right now, with lots of kids expected next spring and fall.

What type of info are you looking for and where are you located?

My web site is Home - Tadpole Acres

If I know where you are located, I can hopefully point you to someone close to you to talk personally with, but I will answer all I can for you.

Rosina

CFarmerLady · #7 11/10/12, 01:02 PM

Amarillo. Really just looking for anything right now. My mom has some experience with animals, but I don't.

LoneStrChic23 · #8 11/10/12, 02:40 PM

Hey there is a nice Lamancha breeder in Amarillo

Cash Farms.... High quality stock

As to Kinders, I wouldn't have a clue where to point you, but maybe Rosina will know of a breeder close to you.

colemangirly · #9 11/10/12, 06:43 PM

Yes, there is at least one one breeder in Texas and perhaps a couple new ones that I remember getting started. Plus I do some transport in the summer. Was just in Texas in July. Plan on doing a trip to Florida next summer.

So the Kinders a real hardy little homestead animal that when bred properly are good for milk and meat. I only do a once a day milking and leave kids on mom the rest of the day and I get easily 1.5 quarts from my does. If I milked twice a day that would be 3 quarts or so for each animal. Not to shabby for their size. Then I buther out whethers and culls. The meat rate is around 60% which isnt to shabby either. Now of course you are going to get less meat than a boer, but they are smaller goats, the percentage is comparable though. They are rather smarter than any nubian I have ever had, and I have had several. They tend to be quieter, and not as dingy pardon the expression. They can have from 1 to 7 kids with twins and trips being the norm, but multiples do run in lines. The milk is extremely high in butterfat and several kinders have gotten their stars under the same rules as all the other breeds. I have had nubians, saanen and a couple nigerians but love the kinders above all I have ever had.

Creative Critters - DaLinda Ackerman
141 CR 1719, Clifton, TX 76634
Phone: (479) 445-2326
Email: dalindaackerman@yahoo.com

This is a breeder in Texas. I think there are a couple more that haven't been posted yet. There is also one or two in Arkansas, Kansas, and LOTS in Missouri. They aren't that hard to come by in your area, might take a little work, but not near as hard as the eastern states.

If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to ask. If you call DaLinda tell her Rosina from tadpole acres sent ya, lol.

LFRJ · #10 11/10/12, 08:44 PM

We also have Kinders and I can't complain. Our doe gave a steady 2.5lbs at peak, but never quit milking. She dropped down to 1lb per day after two years!!!, and I'm still fighting with her to dry her up, so yes, they can be prolific little milkers! As mentioned the milk is high in butter fat, 5-6%? in fact, I bought an old Dazy Churn and have made butter with it numerous times. Unlike some of the Nigerians, they're not so cute that the breed has been used to cover the pet market, so there's a better chance that the breeder focused on udder/teat size and performance, milk quality and production, etc. Our kinder doe has a four finger teat, a decent udder, and is a very easy milker. She had three kids her first time. We took all four. We were newbies and our Kinder doe was gentle and helped us around the learning curve without too much fuss. She's not obstinate or real hard to work with. We have had no unusual health issues - biggest problem is with hoofs, but in the rainy PacNW, it's always a battle, even with our Kikos.

We've had our for two and half years and we recently added a buck so hopefully by spring can give testimony over their ease of kidding.

I can't comment on the meat, (yet) but am told that thanks to the pygmy in them, they pack it on and rival other meat breeds with regard to feed conversion.

Ours are not noisy though I am told some are. We also haven't had any trouble makers challenging our cattle panel fencing, though I personally believe management has a lot to do with that, along with individual personality.

I don't care for their rolly polly barrel shape. I would prefer the svelt dainty dairy shape, and I don't think our plain brown doe is all that pretty - but beauty is as beauty does - and I can't complain a bit! Our doe has been an incredibly steady milker, sturdy, healthy, easy to work with and easy to keep. What more we could we ask for!

Now...we were lucky. The original Kinder breeder lives near us and she is extremely knowledgeable of her stock and very selective to keep the breed true to its goal of being a good dual purpose animal - or as dual purpose as one can reasonably get. She culls very discriminantly. As a result, she has beautiful, high production animals and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend or buy from her. My point here is that quality stock and good breeding is everything in any breed. Be sure to select from a good herd and strong milking lines. Get to know the breeder, get to know the goats.

YOu can also start your own line if Kinders, but again, start with good stock. Keep us up to date. Good luck. Ask all the questions you want.

cmharris6002 · #11 11/11/12, 11:55 AM

I used to breed Kinders years ago. The breed was really starting to gain popularity after HT's own Kathleen Sanderson (BlueJuniperFarm) wrote a wonderful article for Backwoods Home mag. The problem with Kinders is that because of the way the Kinder Goat Breeders Assoc. has dealt with the breed they have never gained respect with either dairy or meat breeders. I still find it unfathomable that they trademarked the Kinder goat name. If a Nubian/Pygmy cross doesn't meet the KGBA standard of reg. stock on both sides of the pedigree you can not legally call it a Kinder even if that is exactly what it is! This kind of unnecessary elitist attitude turns a lot of people away from Kinders and many people are just getting out of them altogether. They are nice little goats though if you don't mind all the nonsense that goes with owning them

colemangirly · #12 11/11/12, 02:09 PM

I think the main reason for all the fuss with the registration is because it is such a new breed. To get a true kinder, of course the parents must be registered on both sides. If a registered grade nubian was used it wouldn't be 100% true then to the nubian side. I know that some grade nubians have some other blood in them and get breed back several times to registered nubians and eventually get a on appeareance registration. Trying to avoid that. Also some people have pygmys that have blue eyes, that is a easy call to see some nigerian blood there, but because they are the same size, people just assume they are pygmy and call them that, or they might be just part. I don't have a problem, with making sure that my animals are registered. Not sure if this is what you are referring to or not, but I haven't had any problem at all, of course, I have registered animals, even my nubians and pygmys, so it is a nonissue.

Anyway, the animals are great little homestead animals that really are personable and with a great output, both in dairy and meat.

Rosina

LFRJ · #13 11/11/12, 04:00 PM

I regret that the KGBA have loused up their own reputation. Our animals are not registered because this is of no importance to us so we have had no dealings with them, but have definitely heard the stories. I did once email a KGBA leader encouraging them to lurk on this forum as occasionally persons ask about what goat to start out with and it would be a great opportunity to plug, well - educate over the breed. They replied and I was told that "every owner is a promoter". Sorry, i don't feel it my responsibility to promote ANY breed, beyond sharing our experience with those we've owned, good and bad.

They are sturdy little goats though. I'll be looking forward to the meat production aspect next Fall/Winter after our first generation is born this Spring. Our blog shows pics of our 6 month old buckling we purchased for breeding purposes. He's not even top of the line - and already looks pretty husky. Overall, I do believe that the breed may be the closest one can get to a dual purpose, homestead animal, which was the original goal. Nice size, meaty, and excellent milkers. Ours seem to exhibit this.

As others have pointed out, there are a lot of paths to "dual purpose" given that the extra bucklings from dairy stock alone might serve a role in the enterprise. Perhaps though, the Kinder bucklings serve the same, but with better results in the meat department while the doelings (from good stock) are equally excellent producers of quality milk.???

I think the breed's development has been an interesting experiment on behalf of some progressive minded goat breeders. Again, too bad they were less able to market the breed. I fear that in time, the "movement" might dissolve

........but... it's not complicated to start your own herd at any time, and a terrific long term hobby project for someone with time and commitment, the ability to cull with discipline and a discerning eye for quality. So maybe the greatest product/outcome of the Kinder breed association was the notion of the cross itself.

cmharris6002 · #14 11/11/12, 05:16 PM

I still find the Kinder trademark ridiculous. Any dairy goat that meets a reasonable NOA is referenced as being an unregistered goat of that breed and can eventually breed into 'American' status. This can be good for a new breed as proven by ADGA's success of their breeding-up program. ADGA keeps herd books open on new breeds, allowing 'Americans' to migrate into Purebred status to develop a large gene pool.

I've seen on craigslist where someone wants to sell a Kinder type goat and gets their add flagged and then someone posts another add for Kinders that simply states that no one is to call any goat a Kinder without proper registration

No other goat breed is policed like this! This kind of attitude is going to destroy the Kinder potential and keep them obscure.

LFRJ · #15 11/11/12, 05:36 PM

totally agree CM.