Buck not horny?

andabigmac · #1 09/18/12, 12:05 AM

My buck, Jagger, who will be 2 in February, has no interest in girls. We put him in the pen with Frolic and Loretta who were both in heat. He jumped up on the milkstand to look for grain. He's not peeing on himself at all. This is the buck who didn't get anyone pregnant last year. He has seen the vet and his sperm count is excellent so is his motility.

We took our other buck over to see if the girls really were in heat. Kaw-Liga tried to mount everything with a pulse, including me. The breeder is willing to replace Jagger or give me my money back.

Does anyone have any experience with a buck like this? I'm really frustrated right now.

Cannon_Farms · #2 09/18/12, 03:26 AM

somethings off. Does he seem copper deficient? is he with the other buck and what breed is he?

Alice In TX/MO · #3 09/18/12, 06:09 AM

Don't waste any more time. Trade him in.

Minelson · #4 09/18/12, 07:14 AM

Does he like boys??

andabigmac · #5 09/18/12, 09:26 AM

OMG. I love you Minelson.

He is in a pen with my other buck Kaw-Liga and their wether buddy, Gambol. Kaw-Liga mounts and "breeds" Gambol repeatedly throughout the day. Jagger only mounts when they're playing. It's more like wrestling. Both of my bucks are Nubians. He has been getting Replamin for 5 doses and before that he has been getting Onyx with ac, kelp, and diamond v yeast. He looks beautiful, sleek, shiny, and healthy. Kaw-Liga is skinny, matted, and icky. All from rut.

Another thing is he has never gotten that hairy buck thing. He looks like I keep him shaved. He has to be missing some hormone, huh?

Minelson · #6 09/18/12, 10:10 AM

He sounds like a gay pretty boy....not that there is anything wrong with that. Or he just isn't into it. I don't think there is anything you can do to make him mate so I would either trade him in for another buck (since the breeder offered) or castrate him and keep as a pet so you can say you have diversity on the farm

andabigmac · #7 09/18/12, 10:25 AM

Every buckling she has is related to my good does so I'm going to breed everyone to Kaw-Liga and see if she has an unrelated buck in the spring. If not I'll get a doeling from her. I was already going to buy a buckling from elsewhere next spring. What a PITA.

Dreamgoat Annie · #8 09/18/12, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minelson

Does he like boys??

Actually, I was going to suggest that. It's a fairly common problem with rams. There have been several studies done about it.

OHSU News Release

I've never had a ram that wouldn't breed ewes but I did have one who clearly preferred the guys (he'd breed ewes if they were in standing heat but he courted the wethers). In fact, his darling was a goat wether.

Sue

andabigmac · #9 09/18/12, 10:57 AM

He doesn't seem too interested in our wether or other buck. Our other buck was courting one of our mares through the fence the other day. I won't go into the pen with him because he tries to mount me. Jagger just seems to have NO sex drive. He lived with the does from august of last year until march. No babies. Ugh.

CaliannG · #10 09/18/12, 11:03 AM

Sounds like he has Low T. Goats can have that just like humans or anything else. That would also explain why he is so pretty-boy, and courts neither male nor female.

If you REALLY want his genetics, you could try testosterone boosters or shots. You can also try having him collected and doing A.I.

andabigmac · #11 09/18/12, 11:27 AM

Would he pass the low testosterone to his sons? Is that something genetic? I suppose you can only buy goat testosterone from the vet. My vet already thinks I'm 12 shades of crazy...

finnsheep · #12 09/18/12, 12:43 PM

Often this type of behavior in rams is encouraged by keeping them in male-only groups. Rams that are kept in sight of ewes do not normally prefer males. It gets really bad when one of these rams actually ends up trying to breed a ewe and then falls over backwards because he is so used to a ram moving away.

I am reasonably sure that it's similar in goats. I've not had any issues with either bucks or rams in this regard. That's not to say that there might not be something else up too, like low testosterone, etc.

andabigmac · #13 09/18/12, 12:59 PM

Spoke with my vet. He said that due to Jagger's extremely high sperm count his testosterone levels are probably fine. He said he had a bull do the same thing this year. The bull was happy just to hang out in the field and chill out. We discussed some studies he's read about on a genetic link to libido. He said we could collect sperm if I wanted but if there is a genetic link I wouldn't want that passed down to offspring, male or female.

Time to break the news to hubby.

Dreamgoat Annie · #14 09/19/12, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnsheep

Often this type of behavior in rams is encouraged by keeping them in male-only groups. Rams that are kept in sight of ewes do not normally prefer males. It gets really bad when one of these rams actually ends up trying to breed a ewe and then falls over backwards because he is so used to a ram moving away.

I am reasonably sure that it's similar in goats. I've not had any issues with either bucks or rams in this regard. That's not to say that there might not be something else up too, like low testosterone, etc.

Oh, that's a great mental image (the ram falling backward after breeding a ewe). My four young rams 'practice' on each other all the time but have no problems when they meet a ewe.

I got my bi-sexual ram when he was 5 months old and he never saw another ram until his sons were grown up. He just liked wethers (especially his goat wether buddy) and since they were all kept together, he pestered them a lot. No problems with fertility, though. All but a few of my sheep are his descendants and none of his sons inherited his preference.

Sue

Backfourty,MI. · #15 09/19/12, 03:43 PM

What a Bummer! I'd let the breeder have him back & get a doe if she doesn't have a buck you want or they are too closely related & get another buck next year from an entirely different breeder for some new blood.

KnowOneSpecial · #16 09/19/12, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andabigmac

Time to break the news to hubby.

Is Hubby not wanting to mount anything either?!

andabigmac · #17 09/19/12, 05:08 PM

Hubby is more selective. He prefers to stay within his species and the opposite sex. If it becomes an issue though he will certainly go back to his breeder...er... mother.

My hubby is pretty upset about this. Jagger is his buddy. Jagger's such a chilled out, easy going guy. I was hoping to pass his mellowness down to his offspring. Now I know that I definitely don't!

LoneStrChic23 · #18 09/19/12, 06:44 PM

Hey maybe you can collect, and have the vet inseminate just a doe or 2, then keep mellow doelings & breed them to a buck with more normal behavior?

Has he been bullied by older does by any chance? I've seen timid bucks who were shy & unwilling after being roughed up by an older doe when they were young......

Maybe he has performance anxiety, doesn't want an audience

But At least you have the option to return him

CaliannG · #19 09/19/12, 08:26 PM

I have a very dominant doe who will flat out refuse to stand for any buck less than 3 years old. And he had better be flat out CRUSTY, too, or she won't have him.

My yearling bucks didn't even TRY with her.

It can also be where he is on the totem pole in the buck pen. My most low status buck didn't even attempt to breed ANYONE until he had been out of the buck pen for a month, with my laid back hermie keeping him company.

So don't discount politics in your troubles.

andabigmac · #20 09/19/12, 11:30 PM

He's the boss in the buck pen. There really isn't any fighting. My does are ----s. I have never seen so much eyelash batting and butt wiggling since saw a drag queen show in Vegas. He also lived with the girls from Oct-March last winter. He had plenty of alone time. I could see my older does being picky but my yearlings that weren't bred to Kaw-Liga didn't get bred either. I wish I could video him so you can see how he acts but my phone only videos for 30 seconds at a time.